All-Star The 'right' Level

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Dec 14, 2009
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I saw a comment on the video thread, and rather than hijack that thread with my query, I thought it would be an interesting discussion from the variety of coaches we have on here.

When do you determine your team's 'Appropriate' level?

The comment basically was that a team didn't appear suited for the division they were entered in, and that perhaps they'd be more successful at a lower level. The next response was, suitably, 'Oh, well it's only October, maybe if it was February I could see them doing that.'

I know this answer might vary for everyone, as some people have already attended a variety of locals before the major nationals season ramps up, whilst others don't start competing until December/early January. Regardless, when do you as a coach/gym owner choose the level, and when do you decide if a team goes up or down? Hypothetically, if they thought about waiting until late February/early March until dropping a level, you might be missing out on some of the major nationals (in terms of being where you 'belong').

I also know some coaches have the other philosophy of a 'reach' level for comps where they're alone in their division/local comps and then the 'more realistic' level for major comps where there's a title on the line. Does doing that with a team factor into a level? How many competitions do you struggle through before making that decision? Or is it a competition-by-competition basis?

A little thought for your Tuesday..
 
How crazy is it that this thread popped up right when my team started having some of these issues? Thanks lol but yes PLEASE give me some idea on when it's appropriate to shift levels So that I can pass the info onto my coaches!
 
We select our teams based on what level those kids are at collectively at tryouts in May. If they move up over the summer, wonderful. But, if they struggle too much (and moving a few athletes to other teams doesn't work), we will drop a level. We haven't changed levels for any team in the last 5 years so its not common for us at all but we do consider it as an option.

We don't typically change levels during the season either. We have debated trying it on occasion but every comp we attend is a big deal (no "practice" comps for us hehe) so we never have.
 
Personally, I think that all teams should be picked based off of the majority skill level. However, I am a firm believer that there is no point in entering a division you cannot be competitive in. It may not be the popular belief, but if my team was a worlds team that did not have a shot in heck, I would rather be a really competitive restricted team. Maybe it's a stupid belief, it's just how I feel.
 
Our kids are put on a team in May based on tryouts. I haven't seen a team move down levels but I have seen one or two stretch upwards by the last couple of comps for the season, kind of trying it on for size for the next year.
 
We actually don't finalize levels to teams until the end of summer/choreography time. The teams are referred to by their team "name" but the kids usually have a pretty good idea of what two levels they are practicing for (ex: Youth 1/2, Senior 3/4, ect). We don't keep it a secret - we just don't want to restrict them during the summer to a certain level of skills, if they keep progressing then great, if not, well then they are aren't disappointed by "moving down a level". Also, this helps limit the gym shopping that some kids do at the end of the year to chose a gym based on the highlest level team they get assigned to.

We have had to move a team down a level mid-season though. A couple years back, I was coaching a senior 3 team that was just really struggling to be competitive for the other local level 3 teams and we sat them down as a team and did an open discussion as to what level they would like to compete. We did try to steer the conversation towards excelling and being confident in the routine over chosing a higher level, but in the end it was their decision to move down to level 2.
 
I actually just had to recently deal with this. I work at pretty small gym so we have to make due with what we have. We were a Sr 2 last season, well this season we were thinking of pushing for a Sr 3 but didnt have the tumbling required so we decided to go ahead and push for Sr 4.2. We recently decided to pull back and just start as a Sr 2 and hopefully move on to a Sr 3 or 4.2 by the end of the season. It was just too much of a jump for my team. They do have level 4 stunting but its just not as strong as it is now and we didnt want to risk it nor over stress our athletes. We basically left our season open ended and left it up to the athletes to decide if they will stick to level 2 or move up. Im hoping we move up haha.
 
*Just using this as an example* Sr. Elite didn't look too hot at their showcase last year. But they looked like a strong large senior 5 team even though it was only october. What I'm saying is that the teams that will be strongly competitive in their division will look like they will this early in the game. They may not hit, but there is just those teams that when they perform YOU KNOW they will be good by February.

I just feel like some gyms will stack one team and in fear of losing athletes make other worlds teams. Id personally win a major national championship in restricted 5 than make it to worlds prelims.
 
We've never changed levels, we have changed team sizes- going from small to large or large to small. and we've had kids move around to different levels, but the teams have stayed the same
 
Cp's team was called a Jr 3/4 after tryouts but even though most of them have solid level 4 tumbling, their stunting needs too much work for them to be truly competitive at level 4. Jr 3 it is this season with the mindset of advancing that stunting all year to be ready for next season.
 
A couple of seasons ago, CP's team had to bump down a level. Why? Because even though at tryouts and choreo they could technically hit the skills, by comp season they just couldn't hit the stunts. Best and toughest decision made that season.
 
I think sometime people don't realize that to be a level 5 (or whatever level) you need to have both the stunting and tumbling skills for that level. It may be great that you have some fierce tick tocks and kick doubles but if half of your athletes are throwing running passes to tuck then you shouldn't be a level 5.

Personally, I'd rather move down a level then make a fool of myself with a routine that's too hard.
 
I think sometime people don't realize that to be a level 5 (or whatever level) you need to have both the stunting and tumbling skills for that level. It may be great that you have some fierce tick tocks and kick doubles but if half of your athletes are throwing running passes to tuck then you shouldn't be a level 5.

Personally, I'd rather move down a level then make a fool of myself with a routine that's too hard.
I don't know why you wouldn't want to stay at a level where you can be competitive and fierce over pushing into a level you're not ready for and losing all season long. I get that some parents/kids (and probably coaches) want to be able to claim they are "x" level just to say they are, or that they have one, but the industry is going to quickly let you know if you actually "are" that level or not. And at this point in my cheer mom development I'd rather have my kids on a team that competes in a level where all the kids on the team have the skill and maybe a portion of them are pushing past it into the next, rather than a team where some have ghe skills and the other portion are only pushing to get into that level to begin with. One team has success, the other stays frustrated all season.
 
I don't know why you wouldn't want to stay at a level where you can be competitive and fierce over pushing into a level you're not ready for and losing all season long. I get that some parents/kids (and probably coaches) want to be able to claim they are "x" level just to say they are, or that they have one, but the industry is going to quickly let you know if you actually "are" that level or not. And at this point in my cheer mom development I'd rather have my kids on a team that competes in a level where all the kids on the team have the skill and maybe a portion of them are pushing past it into the next, rather than a team where some have ghe skills and the other portion are only pushing to get into that level to begin with. One team has success, the other stays frustrated all season.

Yeah, I feel like it gives gyms pride saying oh we have a senior 5 team, but they really should be a level 4. Then they become known as that gym with the sketchy level 5 instead of that gym with the amazing level 4. And it probably is a pride killer (for lack of better words) to move down, but it's in the best interest of the athletes. I've been on that team that doesn't have too hot of a season (Not because of level issues, but because of people quitting & lack of commitment) and it SUCKS.
 
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