Adjusting To Dead Mat

[licatkelsi]

I am transitioning from allstar cheer to hs cheer, and as you all know it is all on dead mat. I was wondering if there was any tips to adjusting to dead mat (tumbling). Are there any ways I can get stronger tumbling on dead mat? Any tips/routines etc. will be appreciated. Thanks!

 

[FlexyTumblerMom]

Be more careful ;). My CP says a big difference between tumbling on dead surface versus a spring surface is that you need to roll your feet when you land - not roll your ankles as in hurting them ;), but land first on the balls of your feet and then roll out towards your heels to absorb the shock - this is different than on a spring floor where the tendency to to land on a flat foot all at once w/ most of the force going towards your heel cause that way you are more likely to "stick" the landing and stand up straight when the bounce of the floor takes affect. When there is no "bounce" it's just different. The first time CP ever did a back tuck on a hard floor she bruised both her heels cause she had always been used to the spring floor landing, but once a teacher explained the rolling thing to her she was fine (of course her heels were sore for almost a week cause of the first one!).

 

[retiredl5cheer]

Emphasize your technique because it'll get you through.

 

[BuegeSmalls]

Call me crazy but I don't think it's really that different. Make sure to use good technique!!

 

[vannahlexis]

Call me crazy but I don't think it's really that different. Make sure to use good technique!!

I dont think it's that different either! Granted the most I've done is standing and running springs w the once in a while standing tuck. I feel like I need to shrug more in my handspring on spring mat than I do on hard floor though. Hard floor has a nice give to it.

 

[BuegeSmalls]

I dont think it's that different either! Granted the most I've done is standing and running springs w the once in a while standing tuck. I feel like I need to shrug more in my handspring on spring mat than I do on hard floor though. Hard floor has a nice give to it.

I feel like the only skill it's a little different for is jumps to tuck, but still for those it doesn't even seem that different. I think a lot of times it's just in people's head's that it's gonna be such an awful change.

 

[AndrewSky]

1) remember your technique.
2) make smart decisions when throwing skills.
3) it's not that different, good luck!

 

[tumbleyoda]

Good technique is good technique, period. While there is some adjustments you may have to make in regards to muscle memory, if you learned solid tumbling technique in All Stars, you should be able to transition well. It is just getting used to the different feel of the floor and the constant pounding without give of the floor.

The two biggest technical issues I observe is those that tumble on flat mat/outside/grass/concrete vs a spring floor/rod floor is those that train primarily on non spring surfaces jump more (flex their knees - absorb and then push) in everything they do. That is how they push off the ground. On a spring floor you are properly taught to punch the floor (less flex, tighter through legs and ankles) as that gives you more height and power. The exception is jumps to tumbling which are doing the same muscle movement. Those that train primarily on spring surfaces are still looking for that bounce, spring or pop and it takes awhile (muscle memory)to realize there is none.

The second is the tendency not to properly set and to throw the head back to rush the rotation of the BHS, Tuck, Layout, Etc. Flip or die is what we hear a lot. Transitioning from spring to dead mat and not being comfortable with it, usually results in the athlete throwing their head back to hurry up and get the skill over with. Which the pulls the shoulders back, loses, height, etc. Staying true to to properly setting your tumbling will help you much.

We created a class for specifically for these types of athletes as they transition so they can tumble on the dead mat and learn how to adjust before they go to school and have to do it all the time there. Additionally if you have not been doing it, ankle raises, plyometrics, strengthening your wrists are things you can do to make it easier, since you will be doing more pounding on those joints and you will definitely feel it.

 

[AndyT_T]

Stand up out of your handsprings! I see people in Allstar full and double right off the floor, that is NOT POSSIBLE nor safe on dead (it isn't really safe on spring either). Pop off your shoulders, get your feet a little bit behind you out of your handspring, stand up with your arms caging your head and your chin neutral, and really think about waiting before you pull for a twist.

Just my two cents ;)

 

[tumbleyoda]

Stand up out of your handsprings! I see people in Allstar full and double right off the floor, that is NOT POSSIBLE nor safe on dead (it isn't really safe on spring either). Pop off your shoulders, get your feet a little bit behind you out of your handspring, stand up with your arms caging your head and your chin neutral, and really think about waiting before you pull for a twist.

Just my two cents ;)

Technically speaking they should not do it in All Stars, nor should it be taught that way ever. Gymnasts and Power Tumblers are not taught that way, but then again those disciplines don't just grab some guy and make them coach high level tumbling with zero experience and training except they used to cheer because they cost lest than a trained coach. Nor do they encourage their athletes that go home and do it on a trampoline to hurry up and get it on the floor so they can make a Level 5 team, go to Worlds or that their team has a better chance to make it to State. But that is another discussion for another day. Most athletes I see do that are either self taught or are those that are rushing to get the skill so they don't listen to a coach telling them to set first, layout second, twist third, then look for landing. They have zero spatial awareness and simply rip, flip and spin. All they are trying to get around and to them that does not mean set higher, spin tighter, or land safely but spin faster.

And technically speaking it is possible to spin a full right off the floor on a dead mat or flat surface. Happens all the time. I agree it is not safe, but it is technically possible. When you don't have equipment to train on, if you believe All Stars is evil because they take your best cheerleaders away from the school team, or if your school coach tells you to get the skill or else you won't be on the team, you do what you do. In that mindset, the results matter, not the process to get to the correct result which IMO is a foolish approach that is guaranteed to fail.

 

[AndyT_T]

Technically speaking they should not do it in All Stars, nor should it be taught that way ever. Gymnasts and Power Tumblers are not taught that way, but then again those disciplines don't just grab some guy and make them coach high level tumbling with zero experience and training except they used to cheer because they cost lest than a trained coach. Nor do they encourage their athletes that go home and do it on a trampoline to hurry up and get it on the floor so they can make a Level 5 team, go to Worlds or that their team has a better chance to make it to State. But that is another discussion for another day. Most athletes I see do that are either self taught or are those that are rushing to get the skill so they don't listen to a coach telling them to set first, layout second, twist third, then look for landing. They have zero spatial awareness and simply rip, flip and spin. All they are trying to get around and to them that does not mean set higher, spin tighter, or land safely but spin faster.

And technically speaking it is possible to spin a full right off the floor on a dead mat or flat surface. Happens all the time. I agree it is not safe, but it is technically possible. When you don't have equipment to train on, if you believe All Stars is evil because they take your best cheerleaders away from the school team, or if your school coach tells you to get the skill or else you won't be on the team, you do what you do. In that mindset, the results matter, not the process to get to the correct result which IMO is a foolish approach that is guaranteed to fail.

I mean I agree that you shouldn't ever pull off the floor, but there are entire programs that tumble like that and win worlds. It doesn't translate as to dead.

 

[kobegirl]

And here is another question.... has anyone tumbled on a fiberglass board under the mat carpet before? We encountered that once at Jamfest and we had lots of sore backs just from warmups. My cp just practiced a punchfront only and really jammed her back. She flies, so had a really warmed-up and stretched-out body already before warmups. then another of our coaches mentioned the fiberglass underlay. Anyone else have issues with these or come across them before? Maybe too many of them were landing super flat-footed???

 

[cheer25mom]

I don't know about transitioning, but I think working on both when you are learning skills is helpful. CP is only working on level 2 skills, but what she does on spring floor at the gym also gets coached on dead mat at the dance studio. I think she is making skill gains faster for having to be proficient on both. I think tumbling on the dead mat is requiring her to concentrate more on good technique every time and throwing with power and confidence because she cannot just "bounce off" if she bails on something. Watching her throw her standing BHS by herself on dead floor for the first time was probably the scariest moment ever as a cheer mom for me thus far, but I think it did wonders for her self confidence.