All-Star Idea For How To Score Better

[BlueCat]

well, what if there is no COP. what if each section of difficulty is relate dot everyone else in your division?

I really think either method is OK. (Absolute vs relative scoring) Relative makes the idea of a grand champion more difficult to administer, but absolute often leaves too little room at the top.

 

[King]

I really think either method is OK. (Absolute vs relative scoring) Relative makes the idea of a grand champion more difficult to administer, but absolute often leaves too little room at the top.

I am actually not a huge fan of grand champion anyway as to me it doesn't make sense anyway. Relative scoring for difficulty on video after teams have competed means the hardest will always get rewarded for being harder.

 

[BlueCat]

I am actually not a huge fan of grand champion anyway as to me it doesn't make sense anyway. Relative scoring for difficulty on video after teams have competed means the hardest will always get rewarded for being harder.

I can understand being against a grand champ, especially at some larger events with multiple judging panels. However, at many competitions we go to, that is the only "competition" that some of our L5s have.

 

[CGAcheer]

I like the code of points, but my only worry, is that if everyone knows that this particular skill maxes out the score, assuming you can hit it why would anyone not do it? But I guess, if there are multiple skills that max out and there is a creativity score we will be able to avoid becoming compulsory

 

[King]

I like the code of points, but my only worry, is that if everyone knows that this particular skill maxes out the score, assuming you can hit it why would anyone not do it? But I guess, if there are multiple skills that max out and there is a creativity score we will be able to avoid becoming compulsory

Cheerleading is already compulsory

 

[CGAcheer]

Cheerleading is already compulsory

It is, like with dismounts but going even further towards compulsory would be a bad thing

 

[King]

It is, like with dismounts but going even further towards compulsory would be a bad thing

It is with everything. Pretty much all the skills are compulsory. Maybe we have found some nifty little turns here and there but in general you have to do certain things in each level to get a max score. The part that separates it all out is how exciting and fast moving the choreography is.

 

[ICEDAD]

I like the code of points, but my only worry, is that if everyone knows that this particular skill maxes out the score, assuming you can hit it why would anyone not do it? But I guess, if there are multiple skills that max out and there is a creativity score we will be able to avoid becoming compulsory

The goal should be to have more compulsories, skills that can be objectively scored, per the video system you all are working on. The more elements that you all can establish as predetermined skills per level (based on difficulty), the mre consistent the score should become. The subjective score should pertain to the live judging elements of a routine, not the level of difficulty and quantity of skills executed.

 

[BlueCat]

The goal should be to have more compulsories, skills that can be objectively scored, per the video system you all are working on. The more elements that you all can establish as predetermined skills per level (based on difficulty), the mre consistent the score should become. The subjective score should pertain to the live judging elements of a routine, not the level of difficulty and quantity of skills executed.

Agreed. No one here has suggested that entire routines become compulsory, or that subjective elements be removed from the scoring. We are merely looking for ways that the part of the scoresheet that is already supposed to be objective (difficulty) to be scored more accurately.

 

[imrichhowboutu]

I like having a range for a set of skills. Jamfest already does this for its judges basically.

Lets say for jumps. They have it mapped out exactly what jumps the team does with what point bracket it falls into.
(this is not what their breakdown is, i'm just using it for arguements sake)
9.1-9.3 - 3 jump combination and extra jump
9.3-9.5 - 4 jump combination and extra jump
9.5-9.7 - 3 jump combination with extra combination
9.7-9.9 - 4 jump combination with extra combination

This way you know exactly where you are going to fall. Coaches can decide if it is worth the difficulty points to try and go up on the ladder and if they want to sacrifice execution. Variety and creativity are what will dictate where in that small range you fall.

Same thing can be done with stunts
Perhaps you say that you need X elements in a stunt section. 3 flexibility skills, 2 transitional elements, 2 entries. 2 dismounts. That would get you in the 9-10 point range. Then skills are listed in difficulty order, much like the coed stunting list from USASF. There could be a different list for Twisting skills, release skills, inversions. This way a judge could have a set idea of what scores higher.

Full up
full and a quarter
full up immediate
full and a quarter immediate
full and a half up
full and a half up immediate
double up
double up immediate

This could be done for every type of skill that we do.

For tumbling it could be ranked
Double full
1 specialty through to double
2 specialty through to double
flipping skill immediately connected to a double
2 connected specialties through to a double.

 

[King]

I like having a range for a set of skills. Jamfest already does this for its judges basically.

Lets say for jumps. They have it mapped out exactly what jumps the team does with what point bracket it falls into.
(this is not what their breakdown is, i'm just using it for arguements sake)
9.1-9.3 - 3 jump combination and extra jump
9.3-9.5 - 4 jump combination and extra jump
9.5-9.7 - 3 jump combination with extra combination
9.7-9.9 - 4 jump combination with extra combination

This way you know exactly where you are going to fall. Coaches can decide if it is worth the difficulty points to try and go up on the ladder and if they want to sacrifice execution. Variety and creativity are what will dictate where in that small range you fall.

Same thing can be done with stunts
Perhaps you say that you need X elements in a stunt section. 3 flexibility skills, 2 transitional elements, 2 entries. 2 dismounts. That would get you in the 9-10 point range. Then skills are listed in difficulty order, much like the coed stunting list from USASF. There could be a different list for Twisting skills, release skills, inversions. This way a judge could have a set idea of what scores higher.

Full up
full and a quarter
full up immediate
full and a quarter immediate
full and a half up
full and a half up immediate
double up
double up immediate

This could be done for every type of skill that we do.

For tumbling it could be ranked
Double full
1 specialty through to double
2 specialty through to double
flipping skill immediately connected to a double
2 connected specialties through to a double.

So a type of matrix that is compulsory (how many of your team does this certain amount of skill and blah blah yadda yadda) will get you this type of difficulty skill. That part is boring and compulsory (which we all seem to want).

The live judges decide if it was creative and presented in a nice way. So it is a marriage of the two things we want. Proper identification of difficulty WHILE still allowing the judges to just judge.

 

[imrichhowboutu]

So a type of matrix that is compulsory (how many of your team does this certain amount of skill and blah blah yadda yadda) will get you this type of difficulty skill. That part is boring and compulsory (which we all seem to want).

The live judges decide if it was creative and presented in a nice way. So it is a marriage of the two things we want. Proper identification of difficulty WHILE still allowing the judges to just judge.

Thats exactly what I want.

Then coaches are NOT allowed to complain if they were scored within the certain range. If you did those jumps and you are in that range stated, then there is nothing to be done. The judge gets to decide where in the range you fall. There will be strict guides to what a difficulty judge does, but still allows some room for movement within a range. Perhaps based on variety, frequency, etc.

Also, to be eligible for any score within a certain range, the majority of the team must perform it.

 

[imrichhowboutu]

kingston I sent you some emails with examples of this being used in the industry already.

 

[King]

kingston I sent you some emails with examples of this being used in the industry already.

Yes I got them. And now with how specific they are I more agree it is not possible to live get these accurate all the time. So, basically, people are already going back to review video to see if someone is in range.