All-Star "males - Minimize Exaggerated Or Theatrical Movements"

[ACEDAD]

Next time I'll sit back and not stand up for something I feel is wrong.

That's not even close to what I said.

 

[yojaehs]

Extreme actions call for extreme measures, maybe next time they will think. If the ACLU and GLAAD help the cause I'm all for it. There have been so many things attempted to "tone down guys" forever, but for WHAT REASON?

 

[CaptainoftheCheerocracy]

It's kinda upsetting that they would separate gay cheerleaders from everyone eles...call me crazy but I have gay friends and when I introduce them to other friends I dont say "hey guys this is is my gay friend so and so" I guess I dont see someone's worth through if they like the same sex or not...I mean if I'm wrong here someone please tell me

You aren't wrong, but from now on when people ask me what All-star cheerleading is about, I probably won't introduce them to my "homophobic frienemy, the USASF" I do actually appreciate so many things that the USASF is working for in All Star Cheerleading, but this recent situation has made upset beyond words.

I typically try not to get furious and complain about something unless I have a valid solution, so there are issues or complaints that I keep to myself about the USASF. Unfortunately they are the closest thing to a governing body that All Star Cheerleading has. I honestly couldn't care less if "chuggles" (my new word for non cheer folk) think my sport is in fact a sport. I know that what we do is beyond that. However, the USASF does typically "parent" us. I mean, we may not always like the rules, but we know they are there for a reason. Sometimes we break the rules and accept our punishment. In the end, we knew better. BUT this is one "rule" or objection that I can't keep to myself. This kind of ignorance and disrespect for our progressive sport and family, leaves me hoping that the USASF will lose custody!

Whoever was a part of this decision process needs to step back and think about why they were part of this discussion at all. Are they involved for their own agenda, or really for the improvement of our cheer family? After all that base happened this year or the last however many years, I don't think they can look in the mirror and honestly say it was the latter.

 

[RaRaMama]

The "etiquette and appearance" pages were not rules though. Just guidelines. So they weren't anything that would be enforced... just suggestions. The rules were the things about tumbling, ages, crop tops. The things about behavior and the thing about the males being less dramatic were on the guidelines "chart" (for lack of a better word). If they hadn't pulled it all down I could link and explain it better. But the comment about males, while grossly offensive, wasn't an actual rule. BAD timing to put them all out as a package, as I think many people were confused that they were all rules, but they were 2 separate documents.

I respect your opinion, but I feel like they were more than that. When a large governing body puts out something like this, they aren't intended as suggested guidelines. They come across and I would think the USASF intends for them to be expectations. So, even if they aren't rules and aren't necessarily something they USASF can "enforce", the idea that (in my mind) the USASF expects male cheerleaders to restrict their performance so they don't come across too "gay" is discriminatory and obnoxious, at best.

 

[Just-a-Mom]

I respect your opinion, but I feel like they were more than that. When a large governing body puts out something like this, they aren't intended as suggested guidelines. They come across and I would think the USASF intends for them to be expectations. So, even if they aren't rules and aren't necessarily something they USASF can "enforce", the idea that (in my mind) the USASF expects male cheerleaders to restrict their performance so they don't come across too "gay" is discriminatory and obnoxious, at best.

Which I said earlier (quite emphatically in at least 3 posts). I was saying more from a legal standpoint they weren't "binding" rules.

USASF put out that ipromise thing and some sportsmanship thing that no one follows or pays a lick of attention to, and they aren't enforced in any way. I think this was very similar. Except this time they screwed up and put in some grossly discriminatory language. But no... I don't think this document was in any way shape or form enforceable or binding.

 

[CAWildcat44]

We all know some males in our sport get a little carried away in performance and sometimes it is disturbing to see a guy hair flip and pop his butt 307 times in a routine.
IMO a male should ALWAYS appear all american and classy. They are counted as a male on the roster and in the division so they need to act that way.
Off the mat that is a different story. haha

 

[fierceBOWlove]

The statement made me cringe and I was completely offended as well. Normally I would feel that it was wrong, but being the time that these new 'rules' came out could not have been at a worse time with all that the cheer world is going through as of late. I'm not trying to stir the pot, but probably doing jumps to back and landing in a split probably isn't classy.:rolleyes: That being said, I absolutely LOVE IT. It gets the crowd going wild and is totally fun to watch, but according to the USASF is that too theatrical? Trying to put rules on things that make our sport what it is should never be done and it's all the theatrical things that our athletes do that make it as great as it is.

 

[King]

I completely understand that. It was stupid. You think ACLU and GLAAD are the right hands?

Kyle has the right to do as he sees fit. I just think the firestorm of opinion from the athletes, coaches and parents was generating results.

In situations like these those are the two groups I have seen contacted over the years (GLAAD or another gay rights group). That is the reason the groups are there. Contact them, talk to them, and see what your options are. I am a card carrying member of the ACLU and I have talked to them a few times. (Fun Fact: did you know you can call your state senators and congressman and actually get them on the phone rather easily? It is shocking that I could but at the same time made me appreciate our government a bit more).

It is all about checks and balances. Someone messed up and didn't think through something and it went south, bad. I am not gay so I cannot be offended for myself because the statement was not towards me. I am quite offended that they would single gay people out like that.

 

[Mamarazzi]

Is an apology all you're seeking?

I agree that the language was offensive and silly. But I'm not sure that going to the ACLU and GLAAD was the right answer.

Maybe if you asked for an apology/correction and didn't get it....

I would generally only hope those groups would need to be involved if the comments were intended to be hurtful. While we may debate the thought process of the whole announcement, I seriously doubt you could find that the board of the USASF intended the release to be hurtful.

Just my thoughts.

I think an apology is needed, like UltimateRudags said, to regain a relationship lost between the cheer community and the USASF. Had the etiquette suggestion not been removed, those groups have the knowledge, man/womanpower and experience to address discriminatory behavior by public entities, and elicit change. The groups were contacted before the wording was removed from the publication, but now the relationship between the community and the USASF is scarred, and needs to be mended. Whether the USASF intended for the suggestions to be offensive or not is irrelevant. The readers/members perceived them offensively. It's subjective, but nonetheless hurtful.

 

[King]

I think an apology is needed, like UltimateRudags said, to regain a relationship lost between the cheer community and the USASF. Had the etiquette suggestion not been removed, those groups have the knowledge, man/womanpower and experience to address discriminatory behavior by public entities, and elicit change. The groups were contacted before the wording was removed from the publication, but now the relationship between the community and the USASF is scarred, and needs to be mended. Whether the USASF intended for the suggestions to be offensive or not is irrelevant. The readers/members perceived them offensively. It's subjective, but nonetheless hurtful.

I would agree. An official USASF apology is probably needed since the document was published as a USASF document.

 

[Mamarazzi]

Which I said earlier (quite emphatically in at least 3 posts). I was saying more from a legal standpoint they weren't "binding" rules.

USASF put out that ipromise thing and some sportsmanship thing that no one follows or pays a lick of attention to, and they aren't enforced in any way. I think this was very similar. Except this time they screwed up and put in some grossly discriminatory language. But no... I don't think this document was in any way shape or form enforceable or binding.

I agree with you, but I think the biggest problem is that the "Etiquette Suggestions" were released at the exact same time as "The Rules." Therefore, I believe the intent of the Suggestions was to be abided by as Rules.

 

[ufomom]

I don't care if it was a rule or a suggestion or a pig in a poke. It was just a very ugly intimation that I immediately took as anti-gay. Whoever wrote that suggestion in not in touch with 2012 or reality in the all star cheerleading world. If I had not gone into all star cheerleading, maybe I would not be friends with gay young men numbering into the HUNDREDS, merely a few close friends and family. But how could they so completely miss the offensiveness of their suggestion. I swear the USASF needs to spend a little bit of their budget on a PR expert. They are not running Aunt Fannie May's Cheer and Dance Emporium.

 

[munchkinmom]

I completely understand that. It was stupid. You think ACLU and GLAAD are the right hands?

Kyle has the right to do as he sees fit. I just think the firestorm of opinion from the athletes, coaches and parents was generating results.

With the silence surrounding the release and the almost silence (3 sentences) from the board surrounding the withdrawl, I would be anticipating silence on this issue from them as well. The involvement of these groups will likely bring about the public apology that is needed. It was part of essentially a press release, it had not been outlined as part of the rules yet. Even for groups such as these, lawsuits normally don't come about until the entity in question refuses to change their policies or individual(s) have been directly harmed by a policy.

 

[TheUltimateFan]

I think an apology is needed, like UltimateRudags said, to regain a relationship lost between the cheer community and the USASF. Had the etiquette suggestion not been removed, those groups have the knowledge, man/womanpower and experience to address discriminatory behavior by public entities, and elicit change. The groups were contacted before the wording was removed from the publication, but now the relationship between the community and the USASF is scarred, and needs to be mended. Whether the USASF intended for the suggestions to be offensive or not is irrelevant. The readers/members perceived them offensively. It's subjective, but nonetheless hurtful.

I completely agree, but I wonder if that will be enough. I remember sometime, somewhere reading in a child development article that it takes 10 positive statements to undo the psychological damage from one negative statement. That applies here, in bullying and in everyday life.

To have credibility USASF is going to need to go beyond just a public apology - who would believe it was generated from their hearts rather than by their lawyers? I (personally) want to see proof, in small and large ways, that they embrace the rights of gay men in our sport and the value they bring with them to this sport.

 

[Mamarazzi]

I completely agree, but I wonder if that will be enough. I remember sometime, somewhere reading in a child development article that it takes 10 positive statements to undo the psychological damage from one negative statement. That applies here, in bullying and in everyday life.

To have credibility USASF is going to need to go beyond just a public apology - who would believe it was generated from their hearts rather than by their lawyers? I (personally) want to see proof, in small and large ways, that they embrace the rights of gay men in our sport and the value they bring with them to this sport.

Well, that's a pretty hefty request. I don't disagree with it, but in all instances, you can't really ask for an apology without being ready to accept it, forgive, and move forward from that place. The USASF removed the offensive suggestion from the official material, and if there's an apology given - a true apology, not "I'm sorry YOU felt that way about what WE said," - then I don't know what more can be done to rectify the situation. We have to be willing to forgive. If we're not, we need never ask for the apology in the first place.