All-Star All Star Prep

[Cheer4lyfe]

I think the whole thing just needs to be regulated. Say what you like but it should be very cut and dry. Something like this:

All Stars: Competitive cheer only, year round cheerleaders
All Star Prep: 1/2 yr cheerleaders, competitive cheer only
Rec Teams: Teams who cheer for a sports team.

Real simple, clear cut. We are making it too complicated.

As far as I can tell, if your team is competitive only- you are all star. The thing that seperates All Stars from Recreational cheerleading has always been that Recreational cheerleaders split their cheer resonsibilities between games and competitions, and all stars strictly compete.

And in regards to the cost, thats on the EP's. Case and point : we are a not for profit cheer program, we work on panel mats and practice September through March- we have and always will compete All Star. Now, we were going to compete at a Cheer Tech competition. They were charging $40 a girl for All Stars and $150 PER TEAM for Rec. Same floor, same judges, same awards. The cost is because of the EP's. THEY are what makes cheer so expensive for all stars, NOT the talent level.

Additionally I agree there should be no crossovers. Half year teams are just that- Cheerleaders who cheer all stars HALF YEAR. Not girls who have been cheering for months and have had months of training joining girls who are starting fresh out.

Just my opinion;)

 

[Callmeboots]

I don't know if marketing it as "just prep"...with the flip side being, the real deal with the real trophies and jackets is all-star. It feels divisive and belittling to the idea of a prep division. I am sure that is not your intention at all but if "prep" is a parents only option, I don't want it to feel some how "less than". Different is good...less than??? not so much. Not sure what the answer is but that approach is probably not a good one.

I agree, I had girls from the Pop Warner team I coached do a half year at a gym earlier this year, and it was offered to all of the girls on my team, but a lot of them didn't want to do it because they knew they would get made fun of by the full year girls. Sure enough, the girls on the full year team would tell the girls on the half year that they weren't a "Real All Star" team, and that they weren't good enough to wear the name of their gym. I think that it's almost inevitable, but creating even more of a divide between the two is probably not a good idea.

 

[5-6-7-8]

I can tell you how we market it and have had a huge success! Our All Star Prep teams are 3 month teams. 3 months of practice, twice a week for an hour each. One local competition at the end of the 3 months and it's done. Then we start the next session the following month. In our planning meetings we thought of it like a football season or tee ball season. Most parents are used to that. Parents will take a small step because it's only 3 month commitment. Some will stay and some will move to full year program... Not ONE team kid has even asked about joining prep program. It's silly to them bc they see the real side of the sport; however, new parents don't get that side of the sport so they think it absurd to sign a 6 yr up for a full year commitment.

I think the usasf should regulate it more , but bc each region sees it as something different, they are letting the market set itself. I think the few guidelines like 2:00 min routines, no crossovers and hopefully capping the level will help preserve the idea of half year or 3 month teams.

Btw when we sit people up we let them know that they will be competing against other teams that might have been practicing longer than them so if they only care about "winning" then they need to join our full year program. Not one of them said they cared about winning, just a place for their kids to prove that they really like cheer enough to commit to a full year team.

I LOVE that approach! Not only does it let people try out the sport but it also allows those girls who want to play other sports a chance to cheer (the ones who are choosing the other sports instead.)

 

[cheercurl]

I can tell you how we market it and have had a huge success! Our All Star Prep teams are 3 month teams. 3 months of practice, twice a week for an hour each. One local competition at the end of the 3 months and it's done. Then we start the next session the following month. In our planning meetings we thought of it like a football season or tee ball season. Most parents are used to that. Parents will take a small step because it's only 3 month commitment. Some will stay and some will move to full year program... Not ONE team kid has even asked about joining prep program. It's silly to them bc they see the real side of the sport; however, new parents don't get that side of the sport so they think it absurd to sign a 6 yr up for a full year commitment.

I think the usasf should regulate it more , but bc each region sees it as something different, they are letting the market set itself. I think the few guidelines like 2:00 min routines, no crossovers and hopefully capping the level will help preserve the idea of half year or 3 month teams.

Btw when we sit people up we let them know that they will be competing against other teams that might have been practicing longer than them so if they only care about "winning" then they need to join our full year program. Not one of them said they cared about winning, just a place for their kids to prove that they really like cheer enough to commit to a full year team.

Brilliant...it's like paying for a session or a short season and you are right people are use to that.

 

[Callmeboots]

I can tell you how we market it and have had a huge success! Our All Star Prep teams are 3 month teams. 3 months of practice, twice a week for an hour each. One local competition at the end of the 3 months and it's done. Then we start the next session the following month. In our planning meetings we thought of it like a football season or tee ball season. Most parents are used to that. Parents will take a small step because it's only 3 month commitment. Some will stay and some will move to full year program... Not ONE team kid has even asked about joining prep program. It's silly to them bc they see the real side of the sport; however, new parents don't get that side of the sport so they think it absurd to sign a 6 yr up for a full year commitment.

I think the usasf should regulate it more , but bc each region sees it as something different, they are letting the market set itself. I think the few guidelines like 2:00 min routines, no crossovers and hopefully capping the level will help preserve the idea of half year or 3 month teams.

Btw when we sit people up we let them know that they will be competing against other teams that might have been practicing longer than them so if they only care about "winning" then they need to join our full year program. Not one of them said they cared about winning, just a place for their kids to prove that they really like cheer enough to commit to a full year team.

This is seriously such a good idea and so simple that I'm actually shocked that it hasn't caught on more.

 

[cheergirlbrey]

I think the whole thing just needs to be regulated. Say what you like but it should be very cut and dry. Something like this:

All Stars: Competitive cheer only, year round cheerleaders
All Star Prep: 1/2 yr cheerleaders, competitive cheer only
Rec Teams: Teams who cheer for a sports team.

Real simple, clear cut. We are making it too complicated.

As far as I can tell, if your team is competitive only- you are all star. The thing that seperates All Stars from Recreational cheerleading has always been that Recreational cheerleaders split their cheer resonsibilities between games and competitions, and all stars strictly compete.

And in regards to the cost, thats on the EP's. Case and point : we are a not for profit cheer program, we work on panel mats and practice September through March- we have and always will compete All Star. Now, we were going to compete at a Cheer Tech competition. They were charging $40 a girl for All Stars and $150 PER TEAM for Rec. Same floor, same judges, same awards. The cost is because of the EP's. THEY are what makes cheer so expensive for all stars, NOT the talent level.

Additionally I agree there should be no crossovers. Half year teams are just that- Cheerleaders who cheer all stars HALF YEAR. Not girls who have been cheering for months and have had months of training joining girls who are starting fresh out.

Just my opinion;)

Ok I'm not an EP but seeing different price points in many different venues in life I kinda get who they do this. Bottom line is venues, employees, judges and such need to be paid. Thats where the original price point comes in ( plus let's face it every business has the goal of profit). Then they say, " hey let's help those non profits (true 503c groups) and let them offer their families more than local high school gym comps and cut them a price break because after all they are non-for- profit unlike all star gyms." This is no different then when I offer my services at a discount to those on difficult times. We are all in a business to make money but why shut out all potential clients when there can be a better way to accommodate everyone.

 

[INeverStopCheering]

We've had program like this for years. In the past they have been a half year team. Most of them are girls who's rec/school season is over. They want to keep cheering without having to travel very far. They start in October/November and compete at 3 or 4 locals and US Finals. In the past they wore our retired unis, but the program got so big this year we got them inexpensive ones.

In the past they have had to compete with regular Allstar teams, which never ended well for them. I'm really looking forward to Allstar prep to give them a place to compete where they still have competition but aren't out of their league. Also it eliminates the problem that one gym may have, say, two large Junior 2 or Youth 1 teams. This way the full season and the prep team are not forced to compete against each other.

I'd like to see something like this in terms of rules:
Youth, Mini, and Junior levels 1 and 2 same as Allstars
Senior Level 1 or 2 with extended rules (I don't see the need for the decimals) Level 2 tumbling, one leg extended stunts, single twist cradle from two feet, one trick tosses, NO release skills, no full ups, maybe some pyramid restrictions, but I would need to read the level three rules closer.

If you are doing any more than the above you are not a prep team. In the entire experience of our half year teams only once has a child ever walked in off the street with a tuck, and it purely because she was so powerful, there was no technique involved

 

[yojaehs]

Wanted to start a friendly discussion on all-star prep, based on some of the things that have been discussed with other coaches.
First, for those of you that are considering doing the prep division, do you like or dislike the 2 minute rule? The no crossovers rule? Why?
Second, we obviously do not want every single division offered, because a small co-ed level 5 is not a true prep team. What divisions would you like to see? What divisions make the most sense?
Third, the big concern is with tumbling. On a prep team, you could have a wide range of skills since you will probably have new kids mixed in with kids that have cheered before, maybe on a pop warner or youth league team. What is the best option to allow children to compete at their true level (which may be level 3 stunting but level 1 tumbling) but allow the prep division to grow?

Just wanted to start a little discussion, since the talks I've been a part of so far have been really awesome. Keep in mind we are talking about true prep teams here... Composed of kids that cannot afford or do not want to make the full commitment to all-star, but want a small taste of it. :)

Ready... GO.

What are your thoughts on the 2 minute routine? I love it! I also LOVE NO crossovers! I'm gonna get boo'd on this one but I honestly would LOVE a compulsory music per division!

 

[CGAcheer]

What are your thoughts on the 2 minute routine? I love it! I also LOVE NO crossovers! I'm gonna get boo'd on this one but I honestly would LOVE a compulsory music per division!

boooo! can you imagine sitting through the same generic music over and over and over? Judges would have to be on Suicide watch

 

[MomOf2ThatsMe]

boooo! can you imagine sitting through the same generic music over and over and over? Judges would have to be on Suicide watch

:cheering: The kids on the floor
:banghead: The judges

 

[yojaehs]

boooo! can you imagine sitting through the same generic music over and over and over? Judges would have to be on Suicide watch

That is why I suggested PER division. Yes, 100 of the same music, yes would be annoying, but 3,4 maybe even 5 would NOT be bad. And if it's cheer music, how is that any different that sitting in your gym while a team is practicing? And it's not like it's compulsory gymnastics music with no words or sound fx

 

[5-6-7-8]

That is why I suggested PER division. Yes, 100 of the same music, yes would be annoying, but 3,4 maybe even 5 would NOT be bad. And if it's cheer music, how is that any different that sitting in your gym while a team is practicing? And it's not like it's compulsory gymnastics music with no words or sound fx

Here's a thought...what is even the routines were all / partly compulsory? I know, it goes against what all-stars is, but here is what I am thinking:

1. It will help the issue of all-star athletes wanting to do all-star prep (for the most part...there always may be a few year round athletes lost to a shorter season but let's face it, those athletes probably had a foot/toe out of the door already.)

2. Simplifies the process for gyms (choreography and music aren't an issue). One less component to worry about with a shorter "season."

3. Simplifies judging (and helps introduce parents to the judging portion of all stars. It is much easier to see how team A beats team B when routines are the same.)

The issue I do see with it is how to choreograph to different skills (it would really dumb down stunts / pyramids for that level.)

Or maybe to keep it really simple, someone mentioned it already for tumbling but what if the difficulty portion of the scoresheet was thrown out across the board and only execution was scored. That would accomplish similar goals with a bit more creativity.

Just thinking out loud here...

 

[CoachTamara]

What are your thoughts on the 2 minute routine? I love it! I also LOVE NO crossovers! I'm gonna get boo'd on this one but I honestly would LOVE a compulsory music per division!

Love two minutes, and love no crossovers. Not sure how I feel about compulsory, mostly because I don't think there is a reason/need. :)

 

[yojaehs]

Love two minutes, and love no crossovers. Not sure how I feel about compulsory, mostly because I don't think there is a reason/need. :)

I'm simply thinking costs

 

[CoachTamara]

I'm simply thinking costs

I love the idea of cutting music costs, I just haven't figured out how to do it. With music people able to charge $1,000+, they do. It's crazy to pay that much for a team that only spends a few hundred for the entire season... Compulsory music could possibly be it, but for my sanity I want to hope not. Also, compulsory routines may be the death of me. I have had teams that can do certain level skills, and cannot hit others. Even a simple level 2 routine could turn into a nightmare if your team cannot do a straight up extension. I guess they are already somewhat compulsory in required skills...

Also, 5-6-7-8, I like the idea of throwing out difficulty, or at least making it very minimal! I don't want to take anything away from this division or these teams, but I think simplicity is key to making this word. It needs to be basic, and people need to realize that what wins in regular all-star may not be the same in the prep division.

Also, thank you all for humoring me and having this discussion. I love it. I love that something in this industry has so much potential and is just beginning and could really adopt some of these ideas to help it excel. :D