All-Star Anyone Having Trouble Getting Released From Their Old Gym?

[Just-a-Mom]

@Rudags I do believe you and I are becoming fast friends here on Fierceboard! :D

I'm sorry but I'm with Rudags and King on this one. You had 5 months (or more) to decide. And you knew the rule going in. I don't understand what is so "not simple" about a rule. It's a rule, so you do it. I completely agree--make smarter choices next time. I think most people who've seen me on here know for sure that I'm not signing any year-long commitment to a gym without doing my research. It took me 4 months to find a partial season team! And now I'm spending another 2 months looking at full season teams.

I think what really gets me is WHERE ARE THE PARENTS in this? Why are these parents letting these kids gym hop? And what the heck kind of jobs do you people have that you can afford to keep buying uniforms and paying comp fees more than once a year?:D

JustCheer--I'm somewhat familiar with the situation I think you are referring to. But truthfully I'm familiar with it because of Facebook. That to me does not scream "We handled this like adults" because for one, I'm not affiliated with either of the gyms in question, so quite frankly I should be sitting here with absolutely no idea what you're talking about. And two, Facebook is NEVER an adult way to handle a situation.

Are there gym owners and directors that are going to be immature about this? Of course. But that is how the world works. Sometimes you have to deal with people who have a rule on their side, so you have to just accept it. I am sure if there really is that dire of a situation involving a child's safety or well being the USASF could step in. To be perfectly honest if a gym registered with USASF is having issues involving children's safety and well being, the USASF should obviously be stepping in regardless of releases.

As for owing a gym money? Definitely a no brainer. If you owe a gym money, you have no business giving another gym money until you're paid up.
Shadow--I don't know how the gym owed you money because every gym we've ever been to has a very strict "Once you give us money it's ours" policy, but I think if you left you'd have to just chalk it up as money lost.

 

[tdittmar]

Everyone feels sorry for the kid who can't get released. You say, "we just want to go to Worlds!" etc. etc. etc. What about the 19 other kids on their former team who are now struggling to find athletes because a few jumped ship mid season. Don't you think their dream is to go to Worlds too?

 

[kristenthegreat]

Everyone feels sorry for the kid who can't get released. You say, "we just want to go to Worlds!" etc. etc. etc. What about the 19 other kids on their former team who are now struggling to find athletes because a few jumped ship mid season. Don't you think their dream is to go to Worlds too?

Heck, don't you think they'd want to compete on a full team period? Nevermind Worlds, sometimes you get stuck in a situation where you don't know if an athlete will be there in two weeks for a regular competition or just quit altogether tomorrow..

 

[newcheerdad]

@Rudags I do believe you and I are becoming fast friends here on Fierceboard! :D

I'm sorry but I'm with Rudags and King on this one. You had 5 months (or more) to decide. And you knew the rule going in. I don't understand what is so "not simple" about a rule. It's a rule, so you do it. I completely agree--make smarter choices next time. I think most people who've seen me on here know for sure that I'm not signing any year-long commitment to a gym without doing my research. It took me 4 months to find a partial season team! And now I'm spending another 2 months looking at full season teams.

I think what really gets me is WHERE ARE THE PARENTS in this? Why are these parents letting these kids gym hop? And what the heck kind of jobs do you people have that you can afford to keep buying uniforms and paying comp fees more than once a year?:D

I'm not a big fan of letting kids gym hop, which is why I think that there has to be at least some penalty, some rule, the says that you have to wait a certain amount of time after leaving a gym before you can cheer somewhere else. To me, 90 days is sufficient. More than that seems punitive, especially when there are situations (like a family move) that are beyond the athlete's control.

I would even be ok with the current process if there were waivers granted for certain scenarios where the onus was on the gym to prove why the athlete shouldn't be released. But the current rules are pretty darn inflexible - it's either "get a release or you can't cheer anywhere else."

 

[Cody Z.]

I agree with @Just-a-Mom. :)

 

[Just-a-Mom]

I'm not a big fan of letting kids gym hop, which is why I think that there has to be at least some penalty, some rule, the says that you have to wait a certain amount of time after leaving a gym before you can cheer somewhere else. To me, 90 days is sufficient. More than that seems punitive, especially when there are situations (like a family move) that are beyond the athlete's control.

I would even be ok with the current process if there were waivers granted for certain scenarios where the onus was on the gym to prove why the athlete shouldn't be released. But the current rules are pretty darn inflexible - it's either "get a release or you can't cheer anywhere else."

I see where you're coming from. God I hope a gym would release someone if they moved! I think for that it should work like memberships at other places work, where if you can show documentation that you've moved more than X number of miles away from the gym you're automatically released--and put that in the contract at the beginning of the season.

But I guess I need someone to give me an actual example of a scenario where:

1. The reason for leaving was recent, and didn't occur in the first FIVE months before competing with this gym
2. The reason is so horrible you just CAN NOT stay for the rest of the season, no matter what
3. The reason is not safety/well-being related, because I think we've all agreed if that is the case, then obvioulsy there should be a way to get the USASF involved. If a coach is actually abusing or harming a child, getting a release waiver should be the least of your concerns

Otherwise, the rule is fine. If it's something inherently wrong with the gym/coach/program, you should be able to spot it within those first 5 months--or before if you're actually doing your research. If it's physically or emotionally detrimental to the child, I'm 100% sure the USASF could override the gym's refusal to grant the release. And by emotionally detrimental I DON'T mean she's not placed where she wants to be in the routine, she doesn't like her teammates, or her coach is too strict. I mean he/she is actually being abused in a case where charges are possibly going to be filed.

So can someone give me an example of one of these "horrible" situations you guys are talking about?

 

[newcheerdad]

But I guess I need someone to give me an actual example of a scenario where:

1. The reason for leaving was recent, and didn't occur in the first FIVE months before competing with this gym
2. The reason is so horrible you just CAN NOT stay for the rest of the season, no matter what
3. The reason is not safety/well-being related, because I think we've all agreed if that is the case, then obvioulsy there should be a way to get the USASF involved. If a coach is actually abusing or harming a child, getting a release waiver should be the least of your concerns

I don't have any specific examples because my cp's program is awesome. :) And for most people this isn't an issue. But the problem is that there's nothing in the current structure that gives an athlete any recourse if one of these hypothetical bad situations DID occur. That's my big concern.

 

[imrichhowboutu]

I'm agreeing with Kyle and King. I HATE when people arent mature about situations. Do what you need to do and make arrangements. And research your options. Talk with parents and coaches. This really shouldnt be that big of an issue. I think loyalty will do everyone a little bit of good. And I'm sure that if you moved across the country and your gym wont release you, that you can petition the usasf.

 

[shadow]

@Just-a-Mom so you want a kid to stay on your kids team knowing they want to leave? Good luck with that.

 

[texas2010]

@Just-a-Mom so you want a kid to stay on your kids team knowing they want to leave? Good luck with that.

I don't think she is saying they have to stay. I think the point is if there is not a really good reason to leave then they shouldn't be allowed to go somewhere else. If they can't cheer, then they will have to really think about is the situation worse than not cheering at all. The goal is to not make it so easy to abandon your teammates for no good reason. Even if you hate the gym, your teammates depend on you. Youth these days are lacking commitment. Not a good thing to teach them!

 

[newcheerdad]

And I'm sure that if you moved across the country and your gym wont release you, that you can petition the usasf.

That may be true, but I can find nothing on USASF's website that suggests that to be the case. The World's gym waiver rules are pretty specific - no waiver, no cheer. Then imagine filtering that down to all levels.

 

[Just-a-Mom]

@Just-a-Mom so you want a kid to stay on your kids team knowing they want to leave? Good luck with that.

Happens all the time. My kids stayed at their first gym for three veeerrrryyy long months after we decided to leave. And I didn't say they had to stay. I said they shouldn't be able to leave the team high and dry to go somewhere else. Is it really fair to leave your team short one person with only a couple days until competition? No. But it still happens.

All I asked was for someone to give me an example of a scenario where a child needed to leave that was something they couldn't figure out before competition started. And that wasn't an obvious over-the-top abusive coach scenario (because, again, I would hope there would be some more going on with that). And no one has answered me.

So, reasons people leave gyms that I've come up with are:
1. Price--obviously you'd know about this WAY before first competition. If price was OK and then your circumstances change, then you should be able to go to the owner and discuss a viable option. Just leaving without trying to work something out is not a choice.
2. Location--again, if your circumstances change, I don't imagine an owner would fight this
3. Coaching style--easily figured out early in the season
4. Problems with teammates--should be able to be resolved with coach stepping in. This sort of falls into the "get over it" category
5. Team doesn't win enough--and the gym down the street wins all the time. Well, you should have researched better. Wait til next season and go down the street.
6. CP is not happy with their place on the team (flyer, base, front, back, point, etc.)--this is definitely the one that drives me the most insane. CP's, this is what is commonly referred to as "life". No one said it was fair or perfect.
7. "I want to go to Worlds and my team didn't get a bid". Well, you were on the team, right? You worked with the team all summer, right? You knew going in that this could happen, right? I don't get this one. Maybe a "team" sport isn't for you.
8. This last one is a little touchy. I'll call it "bad touch". I've only encountered it twice, and that was 2 times too many. In this case, you should be pressing charges. Release is not a problem, because you will go to the USASF with your paperwork from the police.

I'm sure I missed some, but that's why I asked for an example.

OK. I know my opinion is probably not very popular on this, but I feel very strongly about it. This is a TEAM sport. Your TEAM is counting on you. They are your family for the year. And like any family, there will be ups and downs. But you don't just walk out on them.

 

[Nothanks]

But I guess I need someone to give me an actual example of a scenario where:

1. The reason for leaving was recent, and didn't occur in the first FIVE months before competing with this gym
2. The reason is so horrible you just CAN NOT stay for the rest of the season, no matter what
3. The reason is not safety/well-being related, because I think we've all agreed if that is the case, then obvioulsy there should be a way to get the USASF involved. If a coach is actually abusing or harming a child, getting a release waiver should be the least of your concerns

This wasn't an actual case of worrying about being released, because I have that mentality that I started the season, I need to finish it out, but we had girls quitting all year for whatever reason.
My senior year, I was on a senior 4 team at a super small gym (and by that i mean we had 16 girls at most all season, and were the only team in the program). I paid at the beginning of the season for legitimately, EVERYTHING (uniform, choreography, music, all competition fees, etc.). A few months into the season, I started having problems with two girls on the team (I hadn't done anything wrong, in fact the one girl flat out admitted to a parent that she just didn't like me because I "came here out of no where, and she had been here for 3 years and I thought I knew more about cheerleading/tumbling. I had a full, she didn't have a tuck. I had been in gymnastics for 7 years, cheering for 4 at that point, and coached for 2. my "know it all" was in giving the younger girls advice and tips on tumbling they were struggling with). Several times, the girl made comments that were COMPLETELY out of line, and some were even considered threats (that if I looked at her she'd "beat my a**"). I did everything to get over this issue with the girl, from killing her with kindness, trying to talk to her, befriending her friends and talking to the coaches. The coach said if she kept it up, the girl would be off the team.
Also, we kept losing girls all season (we ended with 11). It had a tendency to happen right before competitions as well, and we wouldn't end up going. those competition fees were never seen again--i lost over $100 in competition fees that year, and for a high school student that didn't have a job anymore (i went to boarding school and had to fight tooth and nail to even be allowed to continue cheering), that was a lot.
The problems with the other girl on the team never ended. I dealt with her attitude and comments every practice, and the coach never intervened, never told her to knock it off, just kinda looked the other way. There were countless girls not paying for anything, yet people like me lost money because we had paid for things.

Had I wanted to leave, would I have been justified (and this would have been level 5 and needed a release form?)

 

[debbie]

I'm agreeing with Kyle and King. I HATE when people arent mature about situations. Do what you need to do and make arrangements. And research your options. Talk with parents and coaches. This really shouldnt be that big of an issue. I think loyalty will do everyone a little bit of good. And I'm sure that if you moved across the country and your gym wont release you, that you can petition the usasf.

no you cant and thats the problem!

 

[lakerfantlc]

no you cant and thats the problem!

that is a fact....usasf.says NO exceptions...no matter what....even when no parent or guardian has signed waiver for club or said competition...your child can be bound with no parental concent....I understand the gym holding a release because of an unpaid balance but until there is a protection in place for a minor (ie..a club being able to hold a minor child when no parent has signed ANYTHING)....this rule is crazy!!!! USASF tells you to settle it with the club....period!