All-Star At What Point Should I Coach Accept It's Not Going To Work And Change Something?

[catlady]

As for going to another gym, it's a small gym in a small rural part of the world, not a lot of options and no options when rumor has it they close.

"Rural" comes with its own unique set of issues. They are often limited to a smaller talent pool which often leads to teams consisting of athletes varying greatly in skill level. It may be a situation where the coach NEEDS this athlete to fly to have enough stunt groups to be competitive at competitions depending on its size. The coach may be waiting because, their only other option may be to level down the entire team if this flyer is not able to hit at this skill level. Is there another flyer than can take her place tumble/stunt skill wise? If there is, I'm at a loss as to why a coach would wait this long to make changes. As far as "safety", as long as the child is being caught I wouldn't have a problem, however, if she is hitting the floor over and over again, I would be pulling her.

You mentioned a contract, what kind of contract did you all sign?

 

[INeverStopCheering]

You as a parent need to let the coach do their job, if you can't trust the coach do their job then you need to go to another gym.

I think she was more speaking in a hypothetical, just-for-future-refrence, manner, not in a I'm-trying-to-knock-my-coach manner.

Me personally, I don't drag things out. There are some times I'll put a kid up two practices and be like "Yep this isn't gonna happen." I'm a big problem solver, so by the time things go wrong, I'm usually two steps away on how are we gonna fix/work this out.

 

[The Sixth]

My best piece of advice is that if its not your kid or a relative then I would stay out of it. This is a delicate situation and your genuine concern can be twisted and used against you.

The girl could be experiencing a growth spurt. When that happened to my daughter her flying skills were inconsistent.

To be fair however, every parent has (or should have) a vested interest in the team. I'm not saying winning is everything, but this is a sport. And sports are about competing. And as such, it's the coach's obligation to put the team in the best possible position to be successful.

 

[cupieqt]

I won't leave an athlete in the air if they can't stay up 9/10 times they do a particular stunt. Usually it's obvious from the get go if they are or aren't going to get any better after doing the stunt 15 or 50 times the first night they learn it.

I will either A. Find a new flyer, B. change the stunt sequence to something all groups can hit or C. Water down that flyers group if it is one particular element they are struggling with. Not necessarily in that order though. It just depends on the circumstances.

I won't let a flyer fall week after week though. That's just defeating and unnecessary. I would get too frustrated and I know the group would too. It would be counter productive to leave her there. Months? No. Not happening.

 

[CricketCheerMom]

was trying to reply with tablet, last night didnt work so well..

She did take stunt classes last summer.....then stopped. I did switch gyms (not for this reason) and she is now at our new gym as well, flying again and falling...she gets yelled at a lot. I know for a fact at the previous gym anytime a coach talked to her she would cry and parents would be all up in the coaches faces for making her cry. We shall see how far this goes this season at new gym.

I am sure they will get to a point where they say enough is enough... I have been doing this since mine was 5 and she is 12. I have seen things come full circle.

 

[King]

Their is one flyer on cp's team for what ever can't stay up (fall's 90%) of the time. She has flown for years (been great), for some reason this year isn't her year. It may be her it may be her bases, I can't say. It's painful to watch her fall so many times, plus the risk of her getting hurt. During the routine the bases do change and I believe said flyer still has the same issues, can't say for a 100%(more so with one particular part - group). Has a coach at what point would you change things, how many months would you let this go on? Has a parent how much could you take of watching your 9yr old fall time after time. My cp (8yrs) flies and had her falls, I just don't know at what point I would just freak and say screw the contract, burn my bridges etc.., I understand the risk.

As a coach you are constantly weighing these types of options. And I don't know the whole situation, but changing that one flyer can have huge ripple effects and changes you might not be able to see. So coaches are constantly saying to themselves: is this part of just grinding it out and working to make the kids better and at the end we will get it or is this just not worth it and we have to abandon it completely.

My advice, you cannot one slice of time and look at a flyer falling. Yes it is frustrating, but your coaches are probably looking past the falling and learning period to where they are going to be. I have had a team completely falling and dropping and looking terrible and in a month of hard work suddenly were winning a paid bid to Worlds. You gotta just trust your coaches. If you don't trust them, it is time for a new program. But never approach a coach about changing something how they are doing. Like I said, if you don't trust them, definitely leave.

 

[King]

To be fair however, every parent has (or should have) a vested interest in the team. I'm not saying winning is everything, but this is a sport. And sports are about competing. And as such, it's the coach's obligation to put the team in the best possible position to be successful.

I won't leave an athlete in the air if they can't stay up 9/10 times they do a particular stunt. Usually it's obvious from the get go if they are or aren't going to get any better after doing the stunt 15 or 50 times the first night they learn it.

I will either A. Find a new flyer, B. change the stunt sequence to something all groups can hit or C. Water down that flyers group if it is one particular element they are struggling with. Not necessarily in that order though. It just depends on the circumstances.

I won't let a flyer fall week after week though. That's just defeating and unnecessary. I would get too frustrated and I know the group would too. It would be counter productive to leave her there. Months? No. Not happening.

I will disagree on one point. The team you have at this moment or after two tries may not be the winning combination. But sometimes you have to create flyers and create winners. I know when I was at Stingrays we did our best to pick the most successful teams we could which were a balance of talent for that level but also challenging so the kids could get better. And sometimes you pick the team you think is right and you get to that first practice and you realize what you had on paper may not have been as strong as you first thought. You thought you had 6 flyers but 3 of them had growth spurts. You thought you had close to squad handsprings and you have 10 mental blocks that pulled it out for tryouts. So what do you do? It is your job to build the kids up, create the talent, and win anyway. It might mean months of falling and failing, but you project your vision to the kids (and possibly the parents), why you are doing what you are doing, and push forward.

And not just for lower levels. I have seen Orange lose a flyer to moving away and then turn a base who has never flown before into a flyer they won Worlds with. Each situation is unique, but I don't think falling for weeks is bad. I think sometimes you gotta lose in December to win in February. But every situation is unique.

 

[cupieqt]

I will disagree on one point. The team you have at this moment or after two tries may not be the winning combination. But sometimes you have to create flyers and create winners. I know when I was at Stingrays we did our best to pick the most successful teams we could which were a balance of talent for that level but also challenging so the kids could get better. And sometimes you pick the team you think is right and you get to that first practice and you realize what you had on paper may not have been as strong as you first thought. You thought you had 6 flyers but 3 of them had growth spurts. You thought you had close to squad handsprings and you have 10 mental blocks that pulled it out for tryouts. So what do you do? It is your job to build the kids up, create the talent, and win anyway. It might mean months of falling and failing, but you project your vision to the kids (and possibly the parents), why you are doing what you are doing, and push forward.

And not just for lower levels. I have seen Orange lose a flyer to moving away and then turn a base who has never flown before into a flyer they won Worlds with. Each situation is unique, but I don't think falling for weeks is bad. I think sometimes you gotta lose in December to win in February. But every situation is unique.

I think there's a difference between a flyer that is learning and a flyer that can't hit. I've only taken a former flyer out of the air once and it was when she couldn't hit any of the stunts at all. Not one, not even once, no matter how much we coached her through it. We worked with her for weeks/months so I guess that was my exception.

That is the only time I can recall having an experienced flyer not be able to hit any stunt less than 50% of the time. All the rest usually start at 50-50 and work to become those 95-100% hitters.

I have also had success training bases to fly! I'll never forget one who was super flexible went up her first night like she was born in the air lol

 

[quietmom]

If you have to pick between hurting feelings or hurting a body, go with the feelings but do it gently.

 

[King]

I should throw in that when I read falling I don't mean to the ground dangerously. I just mean not hitting.

 

[cheermuse]

I am sure they will get to a point where they say enough is enough... I have been doing this since mine was 5 and she is 12. I have seen things come full circle.

I have seen this happen as well...8th year of all-star...I recall a few years back we had a team Y3 stunts couldn't hit during practice to save their lives..the parents of that team went to the coach and voiced their concerns how they felt the team wasn't ready, etc and that if they were put on the floor, folks would start pulling their kids. Coach made the decision to put kids on the floor and they did AWESOME..perfect flawless routine won 1st and grand champion. I have always been one of the few cheer parents who can see all sides.

 

[bestbackspot]

I hate when this happens. I'm sure every coach just wishes that all of their athletes can hit a stunt and there its perfect! But in reality that rarely never happens. Most teams have varying difficulty, some that hit perfect every time, and some that don't. Sometimes it's a lot of things, like the group itself isn't clicking, not the flyer. I'm fortunate to be in a stunt group (same group for the past 2 years) that just clicks really well together (even though our flyer is taller than both bases lol). Sometimes that just happens though, and it sucks.

 

[The Sixth]

I think there's a difference between a flyer that is learning and a flyer that can't hit.

Great point! I understand the point made by kingston but based on the TS, it appears to be the latter not the former.

Additionally, my first response was generic. I'm not singling out the flyer either necessarily, but the group as a whole.

 

[King]

Great point! I understand the point made by kingston but based on the TS, it appears to be the latter not the former.

Additionally, my first response was generic. I'm not singling out the flyer either necessarily, but the group as a whole.

I think as well its hard to understand for a parent to interpret the situation. That does not mean she is not right, as well that does not mean she is also not wrong. I think every person is going to skew their description of the situation to support their case. I think it is right and job of every parent to look after their kid. But you can only do so in your limited capacity. I think in this situation she either trusts the coaches and sticks it out or heads elsewhere. Sometimes its not the best answer, just the least worst.