honestly, the vengeance are a waste of money from what I've heard. My gym got the last pass this season, and we've had nobody's shoes fall apart, and we've had them since like september-ish. Personally, I'm not a fan of either, I love the Nfinity Evolutions. I compete in the last pass because I'm required to, but when I practice, I wear my evolutions from last season, which I competed in all last season, practiced in all last season, and have been practicing in all season this year, and they have fallen apart at all. They might way like barely a little bit more, but they hold up so well and have good support.