All-Star Crossovers Just To Get Paid

[12stepCheermom]

And cheer is such a small world at times. A few may get away with it but with videos/youtube and kids knowing exactly who is on which team, I would think it would be a real crapshoot to try and do a bait and switch.

Totally agree with this. People would get caught doing that. I don't remember the gym but wasn't there a team a few years ago that lost a bid because they had someone on the team that wasn't cleared in some way to be there or on a roster or something. It was the YouTube video of their performance (if i recall) that got called out. The cheer world is way too small for people to actually get way with that. Shoot wasn't it some thread recently where people were watching crossovers on two teams and counting the number that were on both?

 

[SuzieQ]

I don't even think a complicated retinal scan/DNA type system is needed. My youngest plays travel softball. Before each tournament the team registers and checks in. The officials have the team roster and each athlete shows her state issued ID. They cross check, ask them their birth dates and the whole thing takes about 3 minutes. Of course, anyone could play for someone else after that just like in cheer but people cheat in professional sports. I don't think there is a way to eliminate it all.


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Would having the athlete show her ID card directly AFTER competing (in cheer, funneling the team through an ID check before they watch their performance on video) avoid some of this? If athlete is checked before, someone can jump in, but not if athletes are taken directly after competing. If an ID card doesn't match, team is disqualified.

 

[dawgshow]

Really? All the gyms around our area you have to pay if you cross over. Who expected to pay for the athletes cross over fees if the parents don't pay? At our gym the only time you don't pay if it's a last minute fill in but if you cross over all season then you have to pay.


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Here too. It's a discounted rate, but you pay to play.

 

[klynn64]

Only way to prevent it is say the bid is tied to the specific kids who earn it, and the only way you can sub is if there is an injury or a person quits. I'm really surprised there is not a rule like this already? What are the reasons why there is not?

They have that you need a release to switch gym's after 11/1 and still go to Worlds rule - so they think athletes hopping gyms is a bigger problem than gym's stacking teams to scam bid money away from other teams so their lesser skilled level 5 teams can get a free trip? Also, at the same time eliminating some better competition at worlds itself in case a team (the would have earned a paid had the stacked team not got it) chooses not to go cause their bid is at large.

This sounds very wrong - gosh, I don't even want to know what we'll known gym does this cause I will lose respect for them and I probably currently like them :(.

I also sure hope people don't do this for Summit.

You wouldn't believe what they do for Summit. Or should I say what Summit allows. That's why we'll go to UCA, NCA, Cheersport but not Summit.

 

[klynn64]

Seriously. I mean, at Summit you can practically take a whole different team than the one that won the freakin bid!

I've heard of instances where gyms have taken athletes from their Worlds team and kept them in Florida to perform with their Level 2 team at Summit.

 

[klynn64]

There was a gym with a level 2 team. They were not going to attend NCA. So the gym formed a team comprised of level2,3 ,4, and 5 athletes and they competed at NCA as a level 2. They won at NCA so rather than disbanding the team as previously intended they went to Summit as a level 2 team. The real level 2 team did not attend Summit as intended initially. I really felt bad for the athletes on the real level 2 team.

 

[likemotherlikedaughter]

There's a gym near us that does this every year. I always wonder which team is really their team. I mean what team are they going to compete at World's with? It might not be breaking the rules but doesn't seem right to me. And you really can't compare other sports to cheerleading. It is not even close what goes on.

 

[Tina]

I understand people have different opinions and that is fine. I think calling a gym unethical for doing something within the rules is where I have an issue.
I do understand the rules with football, but I have seen schools with a weak Varsity opponent play their second string for that game and load their Varsity starters on the JV game instead. Just trying to point out ways all teams in all sports try to gain a competitive advantage.

"You are only responsible for being honest, not for someone else's reaction to your honesty."

I dont think it's fair either to say its unethical either, it's fair game within the rules ;) I think everyone has to do what they feel is right for their kid as well as what the cp is comfortable doing, at the end of the day it's a business just as much as it is a sport so gym owners as well do what they need to do. I watched a mini 2 team this weekend that blew my mind, my guess is majority of them were able to easily compete on a youth 2 team, but for whatever the reason they aren't and I was like hey more power to them :)
Perhaps you can tell me, other then Cheers port are there many other comps that have cross over rules and what is the rules when it comes to crossovers for world's teams ?

 

[Tina]

There was a gym with a level 2 team. They were not going to attend NCA. So the gym formed a team comprised of level2,3 ,4, and 5 athletes and they competed at NCA as a level 2. They won at NCA so rather than disbanding the team as previously intended they went to Summit as a level 2 team. The real level 2 team did not attend Summit as intended initially. I really felt bad for the athletes on the real level 2 team.

That in my opinion is just terriBle and what kind of lessons are these kids getting from that....how sad the kid on the original team must have felt #dislike

 

[Tina]

There's a gym near us that does this every year. I always wonder which team is really their team. I mean what team are they going to compete at World's with? It might not be breaking the rules but doesn't seem right to me. And you really can't compare other sports to cheerleading. It is not even close what goes on.

I agree with you and I also believe because of all the Grey areas in cheer makes it so much harder for the non cheer community to consider it a sport.

 

[luv2cheer92]

I dont think it's fair either to say its unethical either, it's fair game within the rules ;) I think everyone has to do what they feel is right for their kid as well as what the cp is comfortable doing, at the end of the day it's a business just as much as it is a sport so gym owners as well do what they need to do. I watched a mini 2 team this weekend that blew my mind, my guess is majority of them were able to easily compete on a youth 2 team, but for whatever the reason they aren't and I was like hey more power to them :)
Perhaps you can tell me, other then Cheers port are there many other comps that have cross over rules and what is the rules when it comes to crossovers for world's teams ?

It's NCA that has the 5 crossovers per team limit and only in the same level. Worlds doesn't allow any crossovers period. The only other comp with a crossover rule is the Summit, which limits 5 kids per team that competed at Worlds. Of course there is also the general rule for every comp that one athlete can only compete on 3 teams.

 

[Tina]

I've heard of instances where gyms have taken athletes from their Worlds team and kept them in Florida to perform with their Level 2 team at Summit.

Please tell me this is a joke right.....I'm sorry but I hope that one day when my cp is able to compete on a worlds team will feel the same way I do....is it really winning when you are comparing apples and oranges, and don't these parents want our young ones to look up to these amazing cheerleaders on these world's team and not have them compete against them lol how could one even feel good about themself, oh yeah we won the Summit I showed that 7 yr old how its supposed to be done lmao what a joke

 

[Official OWECheer]

You unplug the speaker cables while a competitor is performing, then your team yells the wrong counts at the team. No USASF rules broken. Ethical?

I grant that the team-stacking situation is more nuanced, but I do NOT believe it is automatically OK to do anything that doesn't break a rule.

I hope this hasn't happened in real life...

 

[Tina]

It's NCA that has the 5 crossovers per team limit and only in the same level. Worlds doesn't allow any crossovers period. The only other comp with a crossover rule is the Summit, which limits 5 kids per team that competed at Worlds. Of course there is also the general rule for every comp that one athlete can only compete on 3 teams.

Thanks @luv2cheer92 ;)

 

[Official OWECheer]

The more I think about this the more appalled I get.

We ALL know that the intent of USASF with the bid system is to have the team that earns the bid be the team that takes the mat at Worlds. The reason there is no rule against what we are talking about is because it would be very very difficult to come up with one that would still be fair and allow for unforeseen circumstances (injuries, quitting, tumbling blocks etc). If you put "X" amount of athletes out on the floor for a bid comp KNOWING they will not compete at Worlds it is wrong, it is fraud. Plain and simple...no it's not against the rules, there are gray areas with rules. However, it is morally wrong....there is no gray area with right and wrong. It's either right or wrong, any preschooler can tell you that.

The scary part in all of this is the number of adults that are doing it and those justifying it for whatever reason. A team that can't afford to go on an at large bid came up. I'm sorry but this is not justification for doing something that is wrong. Why would a team/athlete think they have any more right to that bid than someone else? As a kid I missed out on opportunities that other kids had because my parents didn't have the money. Guess what? It made me strive to always work harder so that wouldn't be an issue when I had my own children. I wonder where I'd be today if someone told me, "It's ok for you do something that is morally questionable because you can't afford it" and just handed me whatever it was that I wanted? All teams have about 12 months to ensure they can afford to go to Worlds and can fundraise, work extra shifts, whatever is needed. I already see so many kids/young adults today that have entitled attitudes. Most know nothing about working hard to get what they want because there are so many adults surrounding them enforcing the notion that they shouldn't have to miss out on anything because of their circumstances. Fact of the matter is that just because you DO work hard it doesn't mean you are going to get what you want...that's life! It's really frightening to think what this generation of kids (people with little moral fiber and drive) are going to be like as adults.

That is all...really those of you that want to see both sides and/or justify what's happening really ought to give it another thought!

Sad but true. Preach.