All-Star Is All Star At The Proverbial Fork In The Road?

[tumbleyoda]

I'm curious, not in a judgey way I swear, but what is the plan going forward for your gym? I respect clean and strong technique a lot, but knowing it'll likely keep you lower on the awards than you deserve, will you start focusing on the shimmying, fierce, and snapping fingers in the future?

This has been a subject of debate in many of our directors meetings this year. Again we have had a very successful year as a program (for us top 3 at any competition is where we are trying to be), but we have to make adjustment if we are going to continue to progress. We have a plan and we will definitely be addressing it. But we will not be abandoning what has brought us success over the past ten years. Just tweaking some of the strategies, that's all. ;)

 

[tumbleyoda]

@tumbleyoda---I just wanted to say how much I truly appreciate all of your posts. You never fail to inform and educate, and you do it with such professionalism and kindness! Really love your POV.

So, on that note, can you (and anyone!) elaborate on what it specifically means to you to be a UCA-style gym? I'm gathering it basically entails being clean/sharp, valuing execution over showmanship & finger snapping, pony wagging, etc....Can you elaborate the other aspects that signify UCA-style to you?

I think of Stingrays when I think of clean, but are Rays considered UCA-style? I've guess I've always wondered the major differences between UCA, NCA and others but never really thought about it being an actual thing. And so even with the unified Varsity score sheet, does UCA-style not typically win outside of UCA comps?

Thank you for educating this West Coast mama!

Thank you for your kind words. I definitely have mellowed out a bit since my first cheer board experiences and hopefully it is all for the better. My background is gymnastics, but here is what I have been told and seen from several UCA staffers and gyms that have primarily UCA staffers work there.

UCA style IMO is typically a clean, hit, clean, move, clean, hit, clean type of style. Very little fluff because it is seen as not relative to the scoresheet.Until now. Motions are sharp not showy. Boys either don't dance or of they do they would never be the point dancer type of dance. You won't see a boy fly typically.

I see NCA as skills plus show, and UCA as skills no show. NCA style is we will creatively hide what we don't have skill wise and UCA as we don't have it so we just wont throw it. NCA style is typically faced paced, leaves you breathless just watching. UCA is a slower style. (This seemed to be a major thing that was picked up on even by parents at NCA Dallas. You could tell the UCA style teams because their routines were slower than the gyms from the East and West coast) UCA is also what from I see a big Midwest thing. Most of the gyms in the Midwest that people talk about have branched out of an UCA style.

I don't think of Stingrays as UCA style. They are just insanely clean. And good.

I would wager that if you are looking at the top spot at most competitions in the past, it would be a NCA style gym. What I do seeing happen now is more hybrid styles, which is going to shake up rankings for the next couple of years. More gyms are adapting and changing. More UCA style gyms are coming out of their comfort zone with choreography and music, which will make it interesting the next couple of years. UCA gyms may be changing kicking and screaming along the way, but they are starting to adapt to this new expectation of performance and fluff.

 

[tumbleyoda]

What gym are you at? I think you just became my new favorite.


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Pride of Illinois

 

[BuegeSmalls]

Pride of Illinois

Ahh we're practically neighbors! I live in WI :)


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[CharlotteASMom]

Thank you for your kind words. I definitely have mellowed out a bit since my first cheer board experiences and hopefully it is all for the better.

You've come a long way baby! :D

 

[tumbleyoda]

You've come a long way baby! :D

Thankfully those boards have died the death of the ages....lol.

 

[NJ Coach]

Still mad I didn't get to see you @tumbleyoda this past weekend in Nashville...

 

[DancerDude0118]

@tumbleyoda---I just wanted to say how much I truly appreciate all of your posts. You never fail to inform and educate, and you do it with such professionalism and kindness! Really love your POV.

So, on that note, can you (and anyone!) elaborate on what it specifically means to you to be a UCA-style gym? I'm gathering it basically entails being clean/sharp, valuing execution over showmanship & finger snapping, pony wagging, etc....Can you elaborate the other aspects that signify UCA-style to you?

I think of Stingrays when I think of clean, but are Rays considered UCA-style? I've guess I've always wondered the major differences between UCA, NCA and others but never really thought about it being an actual thing. And so even with the unified Varsity score sheet, does UCA-style not typically win outside of UCA comps?

Thank you for educating this West Coast mama!

I suppose in AS there aren't enough UCA-style gyms to catch them at competitions to tell the difference, but in college cheer it's quite obvious. Just watch teams that compete at UCA and NCA college nationals - NCA routines tend to look flashier and are fast paced; UCA routines lean towards execution and don't even have a dance requirement.

Through my untrained eyes, most competition score sheets throughout the season favour NCA-style routines. I might be wrong, but I want to say Worlds is a good combination of both? I was searching for a breakdown of last year's Worlds score sheet (helped me with my bracket predictions) and came across the large senior division, there's a reason why a team like Orange scored miles ahead of the rest of the competition. I noticed teams that would normally place higher at certain competitions, but lack the clean execution, didn't fair as well when they competed at Worlds. Or when a team that is known for execution gains better traction and scores higher than most people had anticipated.

 

[tumbleyoda]

Still mad I didn't get to see you @tumbleyoda this past weekend in Nashville...

I know! I was only there on Sunday though. Every time I saw your teams in Warm ups I was looking for you and didn't see you anywhere. Miss our sitting together at Worlds in the pre cheer updates days and texting what happened back to those on the boards at home. I will be at Summit this year, so I hope to see you there.

 

[NJ Coach]

I know! I was only there on Sunday though. Every time I saw your teams in Warm ups I was looking for you and didn't see you anywhere. Miss our sitting together at Worlds in the pre cheer updates days and texting what happened back to those on the boards at home. I will be at Summit this year, so I hope to see you there.

I will be there...running around like a sleep deprived crazy person.

 

[SL&AM]

Thank you for your kind words. I definitely have mellowed out a bit since my first cheer board experiences and hopefully it is all for the better. My background is gymnastics, but here is what I have been told and seen from several UCA staffers and gyms that have primarily UCA staffers work there.

.

Thank you for explaining it all in detail.

 

[cheer25mom]

I think there needs to be a healthy balance between technique and showmanship in the sport. I think that creativity, showmanship, and "sass" as someone else put it, definitely have a place in all star cheer. I think the STUNT is definitely an outlet for those who want to explore the totally athletic side of what cheerleaders do, and I think there is room for both. I grew up dancing, so that is the world I know, and these same discussions take place there as well. Ballerinas say that jazz dancers spend too much time working the crowd to cover up subpar technique, and jazz dancers say ballerinas don't know how to express themselves because they rigidly adhere to precise forms. It happens everywhere art meets execution. Personally, I think All Star should strive for good solid technique along with innovation, creativity, and performance value. I think ALL of it is what makes All Star its on unique animal and so much fun to watch.

 

[KDCheerMom]

Pride of Illinois

Wow. Thanks for sharing. Had no idea you were so close

 

[Helen uk uni cheer]

This year, more than any other year, we have lost at competitions due to the fact that we are not a "foot stomp, pony tail whip, shimmying, wink and nod" type of performing program. Our youth have gotten hit because they don't sell it and dance like seniors. Our juniors have had incredibly difficult stunt sequences but because the fliers are winking, nodding or shimmying we lose in the overall impression categories. Our seniors make the stunting look too easy, as if they should be bobbling and falling all over the place. Being an UCA style gym, this is been a difficult lesson to learn. The skills didn't matter. The execution didn't matter. The fact the stunt went up and did not move didn't matter. The fact it was a true whip and not a crappy BHS with no hands or a low flying projectile piked over layout did not matter. It mattered that the fliers didn't shimmy and pony tail whip. It mattered that they didn't choreograph spirit after landing a tumbling pass.

All subjective. All personal opinion. But enough to cause teams to lose competitions and in some cases bids.

At this point, we need to know who is judging to determine what to focus on the week before the competition. Smh.

We had a great year, make no mistake about it. Teams looked better than ever across the board. But it is hard to explain you lost because it has been subjectively declared the other team was better over a shimmy and pony tail whip. So I feel we are going as an industry more toward a dance style, performance direction. Where the skills matter, but how you sell them matter more.

I am considering doing some after school cheer clubs with maybe taking them one prep comp in my area. My issue is there is no cheer in my area and I know the perception is Poms and cheering boys on as most families are from rural backgrounds who don't understand less traditional sports.My problem is going to be trying to market the right way and choosing comps that parents would not have a heart attack at if they went . I have a few ideas such as making flyers and have a simple name and clean logo and focusing on teaching stunts, tumbles and jumps with simple motions. Also the main sport is rugby I know of quite a few who play rugby and cheer for the agility so hopefully I might be able to make it happen.

 

[AScheer]

This has been a subject of debate in many of our directors meetings this year. Again we have had a very successful year as a program (for us top 3 at any competition is where we are trying to be), but we have to make adjustment if we are going to continue to progress. We have a plan and we will definitely be addressing it. But we will not be abandoning what has brought us success over the past ten years. Just tweaking some of the strategies, that's all. ;)

Shimmying, stomping, hair whips, they're all just trends that will fade away and something new will take their place. Clean and proper technique will never go out of style! Hopefully judges can recognize the difference between fluff and skill.