All-Star Motivational Speech By Tate Of Nfinity

[King]

I looked at it as a competition for coaches and owners. With REAL judges people who understand what they are looking at, not all the worry about how big your bow is, if your wearing a t-shirt over your uniform etc........

On a side note, we really do need to gain the control back to our sport, think about the "Mandatory" athlete ID. Are you kidding me we never voted on that it was just told to us that we had to have it. What purpose does it serve? Untill there is some sort of punishment for not having them then I dont see whats so mandatory about it. Also I was under the impression that there could only be 13 board members right now there are 14. How can we follow the rules if the USASF can't even follow their own?

I get the point of the individual event, the one competition that allows everyone to be themselves. But its not large enough to build a gym or a business on. There isn't enough alternative organization to allow these other competitions to grow as well. And if it gets a lil popularity I see people not being allowed to attend non-accredited events (perhaps insurance is dropped because you went to an event that doesn't meet guidelines)

As for the ID its a tracking number and an way of preventing cheating. Can't have age verification and tracking without an ID. It's the invasion of privacy trade off for logistics and validated data.

 

[Ashay]

I get the point of the individual event, the one competition that allows everyone to be themselves. But its not large enough to build a gym or a business on. There isn't enough alternative organization to allow these other competitions to grow as well. And if it gets a lil popularity I see people not being allowed to attend non-accredited events (perhaps insurance is dropped because you went to an event that doesn't meet guidelines)

As for the ID its a tracking number and an way of preventing cheating. Can't have age verification and tracking without an ID. It's the invasion of privacy trade off for logistics and validated data.

I understand you point about the compeition. As far as the ID there hasnt been any punishments for cheating thus far so how does this make it any better. When you hand in those release forms they count them and push them off to the side, who is going to look at every one of the id's as your team walks on the floor. Im pretty sure it will never happen.

 

[King]

I understand you point about the compeition. As far as the ID there hasnt been any punishments for cheating thus far so how does this make it any better. When you hand in those release forms they count them and push them off to the side, who is going to look at every one of the id's as your team walks on the floor. Im pretty sure it will never happen.

While I am unsure of their method of enforcement, from a rollout standpoint it would make more sense to have everyone categorized then start collection of the data. Will it ever be enforced? Yes, I think so. But only when it can be done seamlessly and not negatively impact bottom line. I am still for RFID shoe tags and facial recognition software. As far off as that sounds, its not that far off.

 

[CoachTamara]

I don't know why I love getting into these discussions so much, because there is no answer and that makes me crazy... Yet, I continue to bite. Moth to flame right here...

Let's say the ASGA or another organization decides they want to "overthrow" the USASF. What would need to happen to get this accomplished? I would think off the top of my head that this organization would need numerous nationwide competitions (to provide a non-USASF option), athlete registration with proper implementation to prevent cheating, a Board of Directors that is not associated with a brand/gym/etc (solely there to guide the sport, no personal interest or side projects), a judging system that is through them instead of at the discretion of the EP, and enough gyms to support it right out of the gate. Sounds like a whole lot of money would be needed... There has to be something different that makes gyms want to join this over the USASF, and although I think the upset with the USASF could be enough, I don't think it will be for the gyms that see Worlds as the end all be all. I want to think gym owners have enough power to get what they want done, but I think the hole is a little to deep at this point. There will never be enough financial backing to do this now since the industry is so big.

What would it take for a gym to move from USASF to supporting another governing body? You can complain, but what would it need to offer and provide to you as a coach or parent to make the change?

 

[King]

I don't know why I love getting into these discussions so much, because there is no answer and that makes me crazy... Yet, I continue to bite. Moth to flame right here...

Let's say the ASGA or another organization decides they want to "overthrow" the USASF. What would need to happen to get this accomplished? I would think off the top of my head that this organization would need numerous nationwide competitions (to provide a non-USASF option), athlete registration with proper implementation to prevent cheating, a Board of Directors that is not associated with a brand/gym/etc (solely there to guide the sport, no personal interest or side projects), a judging system that is through them instead of at the discretion of the EP, and enough gyms to support it right out of the gate. Sounds like a whole lot of money would be needed... There has to be something different that makes gyms want to join this over the USASF, and although I think the upset with the USASF could be enough, I don't think it will be for the gyms that see Worlds as the end all be all. I want to think gym owners have enough power to get what they want done, but I think the hole is a little to deep at this point. There will never be enough financial backing to do this now since the industry is so big.

What would it take for a gym to move from USASF to supporting another governing body? You can complain, but what would it need to offer and provide to you as a coach or parent to make the change?

You hit the nail on the head. Overall the same general solutions would have to happen. Some are necessary (athlete registration and ID card are pretty common in lots of youth sports) some are unique to our situation (bow size). At the end of the day I'm not sure how possible change can be, and if it did happen how many of the solutions would just be done the same way later. I think most of the resistance is by who is giving the message, not what the message is.

 

[acxjags]

I don't know where to start but King you have the wrong impression of what we are trying to do. We (the ASGA)are not thinking a new event will change the world. We need to make a solution to give people choices. Right now the grip of the varsity family plan is making people bottle neck their choices. The world and free market is getting smaller. You don't have to be an economics major to know what's going to happen is there isn't an tee native so people have a choice. I'll comment later in more detail. The goals we have are really helpful for the gym owners to have more choices. We all know what happens when there are businesses that compete for business. The customers get the best service at the best price. That's all we want. We don't want to make a new governing body. We want to improve the one that's in place. After all we are coaches and we point out things that need to be improved for a living.

 

[CGAcheer]

I'm not questioning anyone's motivation, I just overall don't get it. If this competition gives back money and the Varsity family plan gives back money what's the difference? Just moral choice of who to spend a dollar with?

The Varsity Rebate is a set percentage based on the number of kids you bring VS what Tate is talking about is profit sharing of the entire competition. So, what is the difference there- VFP is set you bring this number of kids to this many competitions and you get this amount. With Tate (if my understanding is correct) you get a piece of all the revenue sources of the competition such as hotel kick backs, apparel sales, food sales, ticket sales, in a addition to the comp fees, so the bigger the event the better for everyone. Bringing extra spectators helps you, buying shirts helps you etc.

I get the point of the individual event, the one competition that allows everyone to be themselves. But its not large enough to build a gym or a business on. There isn't enough alternative organization to allow these other competitions to grow as well. And if it gets a lil popularity I see people not being allowed to attend non-accredited events (perhaps insurance is dropped because you went to an event that doesn't meet guidelines)

As for the ID its a tracking number and an way of preventing cheating. Can't have age verification and tracking without an ID. It's the invasion of privacy trade off for logistics and validated data.

There is the problem! Do we want to be an industry where one entity gets do decide where and with whom you compete?

The ASGA isn't trying to overthrow the USASF, it wants to bring balance back to the USASF and to have it follow its own rules. The people who are actually working with the kids are the ones best suited to making decisions that affect the kids and their businesses.

But if it were just me, the USASF would be responsible for Age Grid, Safety Rules and Warm Up Standards, which would stick to a 2 year cycle that would be voted on by the Member Gym Owners. Everything else can be done better by someone else.

and few rules on the actual voting-
Gym has to have been in business for 3+ years
and a break down of how each gyms vote counts
15 votes per gym
#Athletes/75 (i.e. if your gym has 250 allstars you would have 3.33 votes + 15 votes for a total of 18.33 votes)

your vote number x 10 would be your membership fee. Which should be more than adequate to facilitate the vote and run a website with a list of member gyms, Sanctioned Competitions, the Age Grid, the Rules, and the warm up standards and a few salaries to keep it up.

 

[CGAcheer]

But if it were just me, the USASF would be responsible for Age Grid, Safety Rules and Warm Up Standards, which would stick to a 2 year cycle that would be voted on by the Member Gym Owners. Everything else can be done better by someone else.

and few rules on the actual voting-
Gym has to have been in business for 3+ years
and a break down of how each gyms vote counts
15 votes per gym
#Athletes/75 (i.e. if your gym has 250 allstars you would have 3.33 votes + 15 votes for a total of 18.33 votes)

your vote number x 10 would be your membership fee. Which should be more than adequate to facilitate the vote and run a website with a list of member gyms, Sanctioned Competitions, the Age Grid, the Rules, and the warm up standards and a few salaries to keep it up.

Thought I would explain this a bit further.

If you've been in business for 3+ years, you at least have a clue about what's going on and how to run a business and you've experienced at least 2 rules cycles. and it prevents some random schmuck to who decided on a whim to start a cheer gym from having a vote yet.

Large gyms represent more kids in addition to that they probably have a pretty good idea about what works since they have that many kids. Sorta like the house of reps and the senate.

Athlete id can be done better by Youthsportsid.com
Training can be done better by gyms sharing with each other
Worlds can be done better by an EP
PR can be done better by the gyms within their own communities
Scholarships can be done within gyms
the Current Credentialing is a joke and could be done better by something else (perhaps the ASGA)
What else does the USASF do?

 

[cheersafety]

Well over throwing USASF isn't going to help. USA Cheer is the governing body, although I don't know who the members are. ICU is your international governing body. USASF, USA Cheer and ICU are all owned by Varsity. So.........

 

[ASCheerMan]

Right now the grip of the varsity family plan is making people bottle neck their choices. The world and free market is getting smaller. You don't have to be an economics major to know what's going to happen is there isn't an tee native so people have a choice. I'll comment later in more detail. The goals we have are really helpful for the gym owners to have more choices. We all know what happens when there are businesses that compete for business. The customers get the best service at the best price. That's all we want. We don't want to make a new governing body. We want to improve the one that's in place. After all we are coaches and we point out things that need to be improved for a living.

I still don't understand this argument that the Varsity Family Plan is TOO compelling and bottlenecks choices. Free enterprise and choice is what drove the creation of the Family Plan. The VFP is our way of offering those best services at the best price we can. If that rebate is too enticing for a gym to go elsewhere, then the competitive market has rewarded the business with more customers and the consumers with a better product at a better price. .

 

[Rudags]

I still don't understand this argument that the Varsity Family Plan is TOO compelling and bottlenecks choices. Free enterprise and choice is what drove the creation of the Family Plan. The VFP is our way of offering those best services at the best price we can. If that rebate is too enticing for a gym to go elsewhere, then the competitive market has rewarded the business with more customers and the consumers with a better product at a better price. .

What about the 'bullying' that is done to people who go against the VFP or look into other vendors?

 

[ASCheerMan]

I don't know of any bullying taking place. We've let any program that was unhappy with their relationship out of their Network Agreements, I know bullying to be 'use of superior strength and intimidation to force someone to do something.' I wouldn't say making an offer so attractive that it can't be resisted as bullying.
Now, if you have a personal story that supports your statement, then perhaps you should post it. But typically, if you hear a story 2nd hand, the 1st hand has left out valuable information that helps paint a clearer picture. I think we should stay away from 'someone told me that Varsity that xxx happened.'

 

[Rudags]

Justin, I am not talking about a business making an offer to make someone potentially unhappy stay with your company. We both know that is just good business practice and I would see no problem in that.

After this past year in Chicago, secondary information is no good to me. I need to see it and I need to see it in writing if I am going to believe anything.

I do however work for one of Varsity's 'rivals' and can see several things on a weekly basis. I am not at home right now, but I will absolutely post some examples of bullying via screenshots and documents I have seen and received. Thank you for allowing me with the opportunity.

 

[ASCheerMan]

Kyle, I truly hope you don't really have plans of posting screenshots of customer issues with Varsity that are not your own. You must know from experience how out of context evidence like that can be taken It would be unethical for me to air JamBrands' dirty laundry as it isnt mine to air. That's not my place to do so and as a competitor of Varsity Spirit Fashions, it's not your place to do so, either. Please contact your employer and ask them if that's how they would like you to do business first.

 

[Rudags]

I intend to only share my own experiences. I never said anything about sharing anything of my customers. I never have and I never will. My customers are absolutely fantastic, as is the company I am independently contracted through, and I'm 100% certain my ethics, passion and drive for success for the company I work with is just fine. I don't need to call them to find out how they run their business nor check up how I run mine.