OT New Random Thread Pt. 3

[SL&AM]

I cannot believe this dangerous, giant orange man will now hold our nuclear codes.

If we're lucky and our Congress acts with a brain, they'll take away his access to them and assign the responsibility elsewhere.

I literally have no knowledge of Hamilton other than the fact it's hard to get ticket to, so I don't get this at all lol



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Hmm, for some reason I thought you were a fan but I'm sure I've mixed you up with someone.

What I love about Hamilton is how relevant the story still is today, that is what has made it stand out so much to me.

 

[ErinS]

Ive never understood the hype behind hamilton. Ive seen plenty of scenes on youtube, tv, etc. But i just dont get it. Has broadway been that boring and predictable over the years and hamilton is just that out of the box, i dont know. Ive heard everything from the casting of it is what makes it so unique/different, to the fact that they rap in a musical........ I mean im glad if thats what makes it revolutionary then great, i mean rap music has been around for yearssss so if it took this long to get on broadway then i guess thats cool. Same goes for casting.
i really just dont get it, i think even if i someday saw it i still wouldnt get it.

Yeah I guess that's also part of my confusion because a lot of people I know that are obsessed with it don't like rap.....and also they are to type to be confused why Rue was black in the Hunger Games....

But I love rap. And what I heard didn't connect with me so maybe that's it




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[UCFKnights07]

In the Heights and Bring it On had elements of rap in them. And Holler if Ya Hear Me was based off of Tupac's music. Although that one closed fairly quickly.
But for the most part, yeah, Broadway is that predictable. The 2014-2015 season was the first time a show with a lesbian main character opened on Broadway, and also the first time a female writing team won for best score. It took until 1991 for an Asian-American actor to win a Tony award, and I'm pretty sure I can count the number of Asian-Americans who have won Tonys for acting on one hand. (And with the best actress/supporting actress, they've been for portraying Asian characters, instead of something like the Leading Player from Pippin.)
Part of the reason why people went nuts over Hamilton is that they purposely cast non-white people in most of the lead roles. And that the music isn't the typical Sondheim/Rogers and Hammerstein/Andrew Lloyd Webber music. But a lot of the fandom is more than a little extreme in their love for the show, and their inability to see why people don't like it or get it.
(If anyone is curious there are a few video bootlegs of the show, if you want to see more of it. None of the performances they've done for award shows were the best thing from the show.)

i do love that broadway has caught up with the times, but i guess i just dont understand why this is such a big deal as to why the show gets so much hype. I mean i get the fact that they are portraying historical white figures in the play but arent white, but i guess im just the "debbie downer" as to why that is such a hyped thing.
i saw wicked in london on my honeymoon and i remember that show being a big deal when it first came out. It was good, but its not something i would see again. I guess im just not a fan of musicals.... Glee was about the only "musical" i was obsessed with when the show was in its prime, LOL.

 

[Eyes On The Prize]

It's hyped because it's the first time something like that happened. Generally, shows based on historical figures cast according to the race of the subject. And that the casting notices specified they preferred to see non-white actors for the roles. A lot of people cried racist over that, forgetting that some shows have straight up said their show's characters are all white, and some characters are specified as white when they really don't need to be. (Like Glinda from Wicked.)
But there are other shows that have done groundbreaking things that haven't received the same kind of attention. Which makes the hype over Hamilton seem a little excessive.

Fun Home deserved infinite times more recognition than it got. IMO it was just as ground breaking as Hamilton and could've surpassed Hamilton in the ground breaking-ness if they received just as much coverage. And I will be as pissed as I want to be about it until the day I die.

I don't think hamilton was over hyped, because it is GREAT, not only for the diversity but because of its story telling, it's stage design, the complexity in the musical orchestrations, the HAM4HAM shows and how ground breaking THAT was, the writing and how Lin literally takes all of the first act and changes the meaning to all of the songs/tunes and uses it for the entire second act, etc. But it was extremely overwhelming after a while and what the news did with it seemed extremely shallow. Coverage of Hamilton went on for MONTHS (MONTHS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!) and the only thing the media took away from it during that entire time was the color of the actors' skin compared to the real life people they played... nothing else. They didn't care to look into other ways it was ground breaking or other ground breaking shows that were running during the same season. Not the show about the gay coming of age story, not the musical with the deaf actors (like a musical.... with people who can't hear the music...), not the play where the main character was autistic, not other shows that were also breaking racial grounds (RIP Kyle), not the three other shows that were comprised of all, non white actors, not about how that season was one of the most diverse in broadway history (not just because of hamilton) and the reasons why that's so important. Just. Hamilton. And now broadway suffers and shows close because of the Hamilton Effect the media created.

I'm never not mad at the media fyi.

 

[UCFKnights07]

I don't know if the Hamilton Effect can be blamed entirely for shows closing, but it definitely hasn't helped. I'm not going to lie, I'm surprised On Your Feet! is still running, given that it's right next to Hamilton and didn't do that well at the Tonys. Tuck Everlasting closed relatively quickly, but from what I've heard, the book was a bit of a mess and needed more revisions. I can't really think of any shows that would have lasted longer if Hamilton wasn't as hyped to the extent that it was.

Don't forget Spring Awakening also had the first actor in a wheelchair on Broadway. And Eclipsed (yeah, it's a play) didn't get enough attention either. (Still not over Kyle.) Speaking of Les Mis, there haven't been many occasions where Valjean has been played by a non-white actor, have there? And Waitress had the first all female creative team. People forget about that show, too.
One good thing about Hamilton is that it made people look at the casting of other shows that have traditionally been either labelled white only (looking at you, Bright Star. That wasn't necessary. And Glinda.), or despite roles advertised as 'any ethnicity' have always gone to white actors. (Elphaba is one. There may have been one non-white Elphaba on Broadway, and I think there's been maaaaybe 5 black actresses who've done the role on tour?)

they had a musical based off that book???? interesting, i havent read that book in years but i still remember everything about it. Actually a pretty decent book.

 

[Eyes On The Prize]

I don't know if the Hamilton Effect can be blamed entirely for shows closing, but it definitely hasn't helped. I'm not going to lie, I'm surprised On Your Feet! is still running, given that it's right next to Hamilton and didn't do that well at the Tonys. Tuck Everlasting closed relatively quickly, but from what I've heard, the book was a bit of a mess and needed more revisions. I can't really think of any shows that would have lasted longer if Hamilton wasn't as hyped to the extent that it was.

Don't forget Spring Awakening also had the first actor in a wheelchair on Broadway. And Eclipsed (yeah, it's a play) didn't get enough attention either. (Still not over Kyle.) Speaking of Les Mis, there haven't been many occasions where Valjean has been played by a non-white actor, have there? And Waitress had the first all female creative team. People forget about that show, too.
One good thing about Hamilton is that it made people look at the casting of other shows that have traditionally been either labelled white only (looking at you, Bright Star. That wasn't necessary. And Glinda.), or despite roles advertised as 'any ethnicity' have always gone to white actors. (Elphaba is one. There may have been one non-white Elphaba on Broadway, and I think there's been maaaaybe 5 black actresses who've done the role on tour?)

Yeah, I'm just disappointed. If the media had created a message around the diversity of Broadway and not just Hamilton, then Broadway and what people think about it could've really changed a lot. Broadway's audience has always been affluent, white people, and the stories shown on broadway have catered to them regarding the types of shows that are put on. You don't put on shows that don't target your audience and when the overwhelming majority of your audience is all one specific thing, then all the plays will be shows that cater to that one thing.

In 2014-2015, the audience census reported that black audience members are up to 6.0% of audience members (3.6 in 1998-1999 for reference) which isn't a lot but it's a start. They didn't report numbers for other groups (hispanic, asian, lgbt, etc) in the article I read. No doubt that number will be a tad, tad higher in the new reports because of Hamilton, but Hamilton tickets STILL were priced so high that only the affluent could afford it aka a majority white audience. If the media reported "Hey guys, if you want Hamilton tickets and aren't royalty, then sucks to be you, but here are some other great shows that offer just as much diversity for you guys to check out", then they could've made a huge difference in the audience make up and in turn, the stories that ended up on stage.

Eclipsed was barely promoted despite the creator being the actress who plays Michonne in The Walking Dead and one of the actresses being Lupita Nyong'o. Although not sure if that was just a limited run gig. The Color Purple and Shuffle Along are still playing but the media could've made an attempt to spotlight those if they wanted to - if they were truly interested in diversity and not just following the hype of a group of people (the fandom) and trying to capitalize on it. The media could've really helped shift the audience demographics and help continue to diversify stories/lead roles. They could've helped push people who aren't affluent to off-broadway shows that are cheaper. And could've pushed people who were a little more affluent, who can't get Hamilton tickets, to other shows. But I feel like most people just know Broadway as "stereotypical broadway plus Hamilton".

Obviously the results haven't come out yet and this is only speculation but I don't think Hamilton changed the audience demographics as much as it could've and I put part of that blame on the media, who pushed the "diversity" thing in a way they could profit from it, not in a way to help literally anyone else. There have been strides because of Hamilton but there could've been a lot more.

And that's my thesis of the week :)

Side note: The Glinda thing gets me every time. Wicked is a story, first and foremost, about discrimination based on the character's skin color. Yet they rarely take on non-white actresses for the lead roles. Astounding. Also, I'm not sure about Valjean, I believe Kyle was being touted as the first black Valjean on Broadway specifically. No clue about tours or West End Valjean's! What ever the opposite of a miracle is though, that's Kyle's story.

 

[njallday]

Yeah, I'm just disappointed. If the media had created a message around the diversity of Broadway and not just Hamilton, then Broadway and what people think about it could've really changed a lot. Broadway's audience has always been affluent, white people, and the stories shown on broadway have catered to them regarding the types of shows that are put on. You don't put on shows that don't target your audience and when the overwhelming majority of your audience is all one specific thing, then all the plays will be shows that cater to that one thing.

In 2014-2015, the audience census reported that black audience members are up to 6.0% of audience members (3.6 in 1998-1999 for reference) which isn't a lot but it's a start. They didn't report numbers for other groups (hispanic, asian, lgbt, etc) in the article I read. No doubt that number will be a tad, tad higher in the new reports because of Hamilton, but Hamilton tickets STILL were priced so high that only the affluent could afford it aka a majority white audience. If the media reported "Hey guys, if you want Hamilton tickets and aren't royalty, then sucks to be you, but here are some other great shows that offer just as much diversity for you guys to check out", then they could've made a huge difference in the audience make up and in turn, the stories that ended up on stage.

Eclipsed was barely promoted despite the creator being the actress who plays Michonne in The Walking Dead and one of the actresses being Lupita Nyong'o. Although not sure if that was just a limited run gig. The Color Purple and Shuffle Along are still playing but the media could've made an attempt to spotlight those if they wanted to - if they were truly interested in diversity and not just following the hype of a group of people (the fandom) and trying to capitalize on it. The media could've really helped shift the audience demographics and help continue to diversify stories/lead roles. They could've helped push people who aren't affluent to off-broadway shows that are cheaper. And could've pushed people who were a little more affluent, who can't get Hamilton tickets, to other shows. But I feel like most people just know Broadway as "stereotypical broadway plus Hamilton".

Obviously the results haven't come out yet and this is only speculation but I don't think Hamilton changed the audience demographics as much as it could've and I put part of that blame on the media, who pushed the "diversity" thing in a way they could profit from it, not in a way to help literally anyone else. There have been strides because of Hamilton but there could've been a lot more.

And that's my thesis of the week :)

Side note: The Glinda thing gets me every time. Wicked is a story, first and foremost, about discrimination based on the character's skin color. Yet they rarely take on non-white actresses for the lead roles. Astounding. Also, I'm not sure about Valjean, I believe Kyle was being touted as the first black Valjean on Broadway specifically. No clue about tours or West End Valjean's! What ever the opposite of a miracle is though, that's Kyle's story.

I saw Rent approximately 12 times on broadway, and approximately 10 years before it was an "age appropriate" show for me to see, (also creating my lifelong love of Taye Diggs *heart eyes*) but even then I knew the only reason the cast was diverse was because it was a story about poor, HIV positive, heroin addicts. Hamilton has used their diversity in such a positive way. I also love that the music was able to educate Americans about the founding of their country in ways they haven't grasped before. But I agree, the media overhyped it, but not in the right way.

The only reason I saw it was because my aunt's Amex Black Card got her early access to the show. How does that help change the audience demographics? On the other hand, as a lifelong theatre nerd who was always kind of, sort of made fun of for it... being able to talk about broadway with "normal" people in my every day life was refreshing. Having a regular guy asking me to borrow by Hamilton soundtrack to copy was exciting.

 

[Beans100]

I didn't understand the Hamilton hype until I saw it. Personally, I found it incredibly inspiring. It emphasizes how interconnected our history is. It shows how there was corruption and bad decisions but they got through it by talking it out. (Cabinet Battle, The Room Where It Happens) It's also a great story of how a nobody can have a lot of impact if they stand for something and they fight for it.

 

[CheerBank]

No, what I meant is I'm deliberately and consciously rejecting all things Hamilton. Like the plot line, I'm aware of. But the fandom. It doesn't make sense to me that so many people are so obsessed with this Broadway musical that haven't seen yet. Like I get it but it just doesn't make sense to me. The one time I accidentally saw a scene- Tony Awards? Grammy's? Oscars? I dk. Whatever award show... the music just didn't resonate with me. At all. And that's okay. Everything ain't for everybody. I'm sure the majority of y'all would cringe that I'm excited about seeing Kanye West in 30 days (Yeezus 2020)

Hamilton is certainly on my eventual to do list, I think. I'm not sure. It's certainly hovering at the bottom-bottom. I hate musicals. I hate live theatre. I hate any acting I can't pause. I'm dreading going to my niece's Shrek Jr. musical on Friday because I just can't.

When it comes to tickets I know I can't get right now my priority is the African American History Museum. If someone can get me a pass to that before January 20 2017, that'd be awesome. (Yes I'd go after Jan 20....but seeing it while knowing The Obamas are still living in the White House would be magnificent)



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I felt the same way. Until I started listening to the soundtrack and fell in love with it, and now I kick myself all the time that I missed the boat on seeing it with the original cast. But I love musicals and this was the first one since Rent that really got me excited. The cool thing about this soundtrack is that with the exception of I think 2 smaller scenes you really get almost the entire play through the soundtrack. I'm thinking you saw the scene they performed at the Tonys. And the African American History Museum looks amazing and it high on my list (unlike Kanye, although my oldest did see him at her college a month or so ago).

 

[SL&AM]

I felt the same way. Until I started listening to the soundtrack and fell in love with it, and now I kick myself all the time that I missed the boat on seeing it with the original cast. But I love musicals and this was the first one since Rent that really got me excited. The cool thing about this soundtrack is that with the exception of I think 2 smaller scenes you really get almost the entire play through the soundtrack. I'm thinking you saw the scene they performed at the Tonys. And the African American History Museum looks amazing and it high on my list (unlike Kanye, although my oldest did see him at her college a month or so ago).

I'm another one who found the soundtrack before I found the hype. What I love the most is that it teaches History without force feeding it to you in a way you don't get or don't care to get. I also love the role it's taken in helping our kids learn and become excited about history.

 

[CheerBank]

I'm another one who found the soundtrack before I found the hype. What I love the most is that it teaches History without force feeding it to you in a way you don't get or don't care to get. I also love the role it's taken in helping our kids learn and become excited about history.

My kids love it all for different reasons. Each has a different favorite song - my oldest loves Dear Theodosia and Burn, my middle Satisfied (she's a romantic at heart) and my youngest loves the Cabinet Battles. My middle is taking HOTA (History of the Americas) right now and is writing a paper on how most of Hamilton's financial proposals were unconstitutional. My youngest can at least tell you who the first few presidents were, and quite a lot about the American Revolution. He said he really likes the music because even though it is a play it tells the story through music he can relate to. I just think LMM is so unbelievably talented, and to have taken Chernow's book and translated into living, breathing history in such a clever way blows my mind. And I love his style - I listen to In The Heights all the time as well and recently saw it in London.

 

[quitthedrama]

y'all need your own Hamilton thread :p

 

[Eyes On The Prize]

My kids love it all for different reasons. Each has a different favorite song - my oldest loves Dear Theodosia and Burn, my middle Satisfied (she's a romantic at heart) and my youngest loves the Cabinet Battles. My middle is taking HOTA (History of the Americas) right now and is writing a paper on how most of Hamilton's financial proposals were unconstitutional. My youngest can at least tell you who the first few presidents were, and quite a lot about the American Revolution. He said he really likes the music because even though it is a play it tells the story through music he can relate to. I just think LMM is so unbelievably talented, and to have taken Chernow's book and translated into living, breathing history in such a clever way blows my mind. And I love his style - I listen to In The Heights all the time as well and recently saw it in London.

He is exceptionally talented. Lin did a skit for This American Life called 21 Chump Street. Apparently 70ish percent of the words in it were verbatim quotes from interviews and stuff. Idk if you've ever heard it but it's amazing.

You can listen to it here (528: The Radio Drama Episode), it's the first act, about 20 minutes long. Anthony Ramos (John Laurens/Phillip Hamilton) plays the lead male.

 

[CheerBank]

It's just the 'Laurens Interlude' that isn't on the cast album. Which was done because (with the exception of Laurens singing a few lines) it's spoken, I think...
If you ever get the chance to see it (they released a new block of tickets for late next year), the main cast replacements are (for the most part) as good as the originals.


It doesn't help that the b roll footage has pretty much disappeared from youtube, but some people managed to download it before it poofed.
https://www.dropbox.com/s/pd3swxrj7trsauy/Ten Minutes of Hamilton Clips.mp4?dl=0

I have tix for April :cheering: and the kids are going in May.

 

[SL&AM]

In the spirit of Jefferson in the Election of 1800...can we go back to politics?

Has anyone been watching who Trump is appointing to some of his key advisory positions? If so, are you as terrified for this country as I am? I realize he called for an end to the hate (too little, too late, imho); but it's kind of counter productive when you promote someone who is open about being a white supremacist, right?