All-Star Poor Sportsmanship

[Official OWECheer]

Could you be so kind as to link this video for us?

To heck with the gentle wording LOL!

LINK. NOW. MUST. SEE.

@PaSE Dad PM me as well!

 

[klynn64]

Um, I think you missed the point of my comment...

You said, Hypothetically, if your Mom had a L2 cheer team that got beat by a team of L3, L4 and L5 athletes at NCA, would she still feel it was ethical?

The response was in response to that specific question since I originally brought up that I was raised by a mom who would find the L2 versus L3-5 situation a smart move to ensure a win. I'm not saying that YOU said it was rigged or anything like that.

Got it. I understand your comment now. It required my reading it a number of times for it to sink in. Now your response makes more sense. I think we've all seen situations where that is truly how people feel.

 

[klynn64]

If this is the incident I believe it to be, your statement is not entirely accurate.The program did not go on record stating they were exploiting a loophole, they instead stated that what they did was within the rules. And I'm not entirely sure that the same thing, or something very near it, couldn't still happen at NCA. Again, I'll assert that this is talking about what is "fair" and not as much about ethics. But I can validate that you don't see a distinction between the two. I might be one of only a few who makes this type of distinction. For the record, I also completely validate the cheer community's response to this incident. Addressing issues of fairness with an EP and making choices to not compete at competitions that allow this to happen are exactly what I think programs and cheerleaders who are opposed to this kind of thing should do.

ETA: eek posting issues

I stated that they were well aware that they were exploiting a loophole, and they were.

Although I don't agree with what this team did. They did not break any rules. And though I view it to be unethical, there was no dishonesty. And though I would not allow my CP to attend this gym, many others would be happy to be there.

They've attempted to close the loophole. I'm sure with a lot of effort any coach can find a way to circumvent the rules if that is where they want to invest their energy. And some do. There will always be those interested in spending time manipulating the system rather than competing on their merit. That's why we are guaranteed to see this type of thing again in the future.

If you have to compromise your principles to win you haven't really won at all. You took the prize but at what price?

 

[336Teal]

Can someone DM this video to me also?

 

[632_beans]

Can someone DM this video to me also?

Me too! I wanna see;)


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[Official OWECheer]

So many bullies here... LOL.

 

[SL&AM]

If he actually PMs me, I'll let you know. Until then...time to surf some YouTube.

 

[_MRB]

I think the word unethical is one of those words that has a million and one definitions and differ greatly from person to person.

This weekend SL was in a division of 6 and against one team that I guess you could kinda call a rival (the gyms are close location wise)---they took 2nd, we took 3rd. My mom asked me yesterday if I was going to move SL to rival gym and when I asked why she said because they beat us. My mom is one of those win at any costs people, I guarantee she would be totally fine with the NCA L2 team that is really Level 5 athletes and not find it unethical at all---she'd call it smart. Different strokes for different folks. And because I'm nothing like her, I quickly reminded her that we had the opportunity to pick that gym before I even knew about ours and there was no way we would go there.

I definitely agree w you, some people have their own definitions of unethical. There's just a lot of people on the boards who play by the rules than to cheat. Which I think is totally fine! Idk winning isn't that much to some, but to others, it's everything. I glad you and your child picked the gym that's better for her/him and for you.

 

[Cheermom1969]

I stated that they were well aware that they were exploiting a loophole, and they were.

Although I don't agree with what this team did. They did not break any rules. And though I view it to be unethical, there was no dishonesty. And though I would not allow my CP to attend this gym, many others would be happy to be there.

They've attempted to close the loophole. I'm sure with a lot of effort any coach can find a way to circumvent the rules if that is where they want to invest their energy. And some do. There will always be those interested in spending time manipulating the system rather than competing on their merit. That's why we are guaranteed to see this type of thing again in the future.

If you have to compromise your principles to win you haven't really won at all. You took the prize but at what price?

While I can't remember the gym that did this the year your daughter was on JB, the same thing happened to us last year. The gym brought two teams to NCA. A j2 and R5 (I think it was). The J2 was pretty clearly stacked with higher levels kids - I had several people from their part of the country tell me this anyway - and they won. The irony is that they didn't get first at Summit, didn't even crack the top 3.

Looking back, for us personally, while it stung to be beat by this team, it was a learning experience for my daughter that she needed. She needed that loss. It helped to keep her humble and to realize you can't win them all.

 

[East78]

There is a team in Maryland every year who we will call HH. For NCA every year they take the best kids mostly level 3 and 4 and formed a senior 1 to compete. Most parents were ok chasing a jacket since the kids didn't win very much at their regular level comps. Some parents would leave but most stayed. So regardless of big gym or small gym, the question of whether it's "ethical" still applies

 

[BadtotheBow]

I recognize this is a poor sportsmanship thread but there isn't a good sportsmanship thread (not that I could locate anyway). And I want to give credit where credit is due.

This past weekend my CP competed at NCA on a L3 Small Senior Coed team. Our team had the highest score following Day 1. But the scores were close among the top three contenders in our division. Often a close race can fuel hostility among competitors. But, after performing on Day 2 our team ran into the second and third place teams backstage. Quite literally actually since my CP passed out while coming off stage. It was the athletes on those teams that caught my CP and helped get her to the Medic. We were pleasantly surprised to find that these teams were comprised of the nicest group of athletes you could imagine. These teams were Fierce Black Cats and Twist and Shout Senior Honor. Kudos to these gyms, their coaches and parents, and the athletes for exemplifying good sportsmanship. It was a pleasure to compete against such a nice group of athletes. I am sure that the remaining teams in our division were equally nice but unfortunately we never had the opportunity to meet them.

If anyone reading this has contact with either the Fierce Cats or Senior Honors gym owners/directors or coaches please pass on my gratitude for a job well done with their athletes. Likewise I intend to send a note to these gyms complimenting them on their athletes.

I notice Team Cheer started an award called "Team Cheer Sportsmanship Award" and anyone can nominate a team to win. I think it's a great gesture from a company to recognize and promote good sportsmanship.
Sportsmanship | Team Cheer

 

[Nothanks]

There is a team in Maryland every year who we will call HH. For NCA every year they take the best kids mostly level 3 and 4 and formed a senior 1 to compete. Most parents were ok chasing a jacket since the kids didn't win very much at their regular level comps. Some parents would leave but most stayed. So regardless of big gym or small gym, the question of whether it's "ethical" still applies

I feel bad for those kids because from what I've gathered, they don't even try to compete at their level anymore. I know they had a handful of girls with level five skills a few years back that only competed senior 1.

 

[CoachMandiCF]

Definitely happened...think it was a local. Right @CoachMandiCF

Yep local event last season. Wildcard Summit event. Two local program coaches going at each other in the stands. I believe there was a banner involved too. Classy.


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[oncecoolcoachnowmom]

I feel bad for those kids because from what I've gathered, they don't even try to compete at their level anymore. I know they had a handful of girls with level five skills a few years back that only competed senior 1.

I'm derailing the thread, but:

In tumbling, if you don't use it, you lose it.

I'm confused as to how you'd even be happy on Senior 1 with Level 4/5 skills you only really get to throw at practice or open gym? You'd lose it all if you didn't throw it regularly.

Yes, jackets. But really?

 

[Nothanks]

I'm derailing the thread, but:

In tumbling, if you don't use it, you lose it.

I'm confused as to how you'd even be happy on Senior 1 with Level 4/5 skills you only really get to throw at practice or open gym? You'd lose it all if you didn't throw it regularly.

Yes, jackets. But really?

They tried to have a senior 5 about 3-4 seasons ago (i don't remember the last year they attempted...since i quit cheering they all blur together), even had choreography done by a known name in the industry, then dropped down to senior 1--they may have crossed to sr 1 with some other girls that same year, but i can't be certain. I never understood why they were happy being on a level 1 team and never getting to work their level 5 skills after that season.

eta, i also used to keep much closer tabs on them, but then i unfollowed the head coach on Facebook since i was tired of seeing it, and it's blurred even more since then lol