The Perfect Competition/Event

[King]

Every cheer comp or event has certain things we love and hate. If you could design the competition that would make the most sense and most people happy while making everything feel fair, what would you want? What pieces matter the most to you?

 

[Mclovin]

Let's see --

Varsity's scoresheet
Cheersport's video playback
Cheersport's stage set up (back to back with the curtains closing between teams)
Jam Brands rubric (however, I don't believe the judges can accurately count skills the way the rubric calls for it but if they could, this system would be WONDERFUL)
World's prelims and "X" number of teams making it to finals.


But more than anything, I would like to see the judges go through many many hours of proper training and certification. I would like the head judges to filter in and out to where it's not the same ones every single year at the same comps because once you call them out on something, you are forever a foe. I would like the judges to be required to stand accountable for their decisions (scores for each category for each team available to ALL coaches). If I could have these things, I don't think I'd care how the competition itself was run.

 

[hiyoe6]

Interestingly enough there's a sole judge whos ONLY responsibility is to count skills at JamBrands events. I hope they're counting accurately since its the only thing they're doing.

 

[Mclovin]

Well that's good to know! Someone posted somewhere on this board that the judges (even at Jambrands) are told to count the same person throwing 3 passes the same as 3 separate people throwing three passes. To me, that is not accurate counting. But if that judge can do it right, then I LOVE IT!!!

 

[hiyoe6]

Well that is actually true.... They count the same person multiple times. In other words at JamBrands if you are level 2 on a team of 10 and a girl does a round off bhs 10 seperate times in the routine the team gets awarded as if they entire team did a round off bhs each. The new college format (NCSTA) is trying to weed that out with the numbers on uniforms. It has been thought about having a check list with all the teams numbers and check them off as they tumble in routines and take the score that way.

 

[Mclovin]

See to me, until we can correct that, it is not accurate scoring. Why can I, as a spectator, notice when the same kid tumbles more than once, but the judges can't?? I also think cheersport's video replay system could help in this area as well. I like the numbers on uniforms idea, too.

 

[theoneandonly]

I'm gonna have to go against that... if a kid throws more than one pass, they deserve to be counted for it. Yes, it's a way of hiding for some teams... but if a kid is throwing 6 doubles in a routine, they deserve to be credited because that is NOT easy haha

As far as the perfect competition... I think Cheersport has it pretty close in terms of the way it's run. However, was not too thrilled with the judging this year or last... But, I think it's hard to be 100% satisfied when you have a billion and a half judges on the panel for the seven billion divisions... But, I didn't feel like the dartfish idea really made a difference

 

[Mclovin]

I'm gonna have to go 100% against that... If a kid throws three different passes, they should ABSOLUTELY be counted as two separate skills... i don't know if you've ever tumbled a double multiple times in a routine.. but it is freaking HARD. I think there is a balance in terms of counting a kid who tumbles 6 times in a routine as 6 passes though... but that's where the rest of the judges come in. They're not dummies... they can tell when that one kid is first, third, and last pass ya know?

lol Tom, no I've never competed a double ever! haha I'm not even sure they existed when I was in my tumbling prime. haha I think female elite gymnasts were just starting to do them. lmbo!

While I understand that throwing more than 1 pass in a routine is hard, I don't believe it should count towards the rubric that Jambrands uses. The point of the rubric is to give those teams that actually have full squad or close to full squad skills an advantage over the teams that don't. Having a team of 20 members, only 10 of which actually have the skills to be at that level, but having them each throw 2 passes each is not fair to the team that had every team member doing their part. JMO though.

 

[King]

I think the problem with the video review is if its not HD things can get pretty fuzzy.

 

[Mclovin]

I think the problem with the video review is if its not HD things can get pretty fuzzy.

Agreed. No need to have bad quality video or you'll have the judges scratching the heads more after review than they were before! lol

But in this age, HD should NOT be a problem for any event producer.

 

[King]

I also think no crossovers except levels (only only a few per team in emergency cases) should be standard in all competitions.

 

[Mclovin]

I also think no crossovers except levels (only only a few per team in emergency cases) should be standard in all competitions.

Oh yes yes yes!!! I understand crossovers are needed to some degree, but it's gotten out of hand. I don't necessarily agree that it can only be level to level though because some gyms don't have more than 1 team at each level so that's not fair to them. But definitely need to have some sort of limit and standard on this issue.

 

[theoneandonly]

Gotcha Susan.. I think they can be counted towards the overall team total, but not toward the full team percentage.. if that makes sense...

And crossovers... Amen

 

[King]

i think the level thing at NCA just makes it so you cant use that many at once. so maybe limiting it to 3 a team would be fine.

 

[hiyoe6]

Judges, in my opinion, have WAY too much to worry about right now and making them distinguish between who is throwing what skill is too complicated. We might get there one day but right now I do not think its feasible.

I worked for a gym for 2 months that had 45 kids in the ENTIRE program but yet fielded 5 teams. I hate crossovers for reasons besides skills but until the USASF decides something abuot crossovers nothing will change. Competition companies are a business, first and foremost. They don't want teams to stop coming because they don't allowed crossovers. Crossovers bring in a lot of money.