All-Star Trying Not To Be That Parent

[BlueCat]

OK, I'm trying not to be THAT parent that complains about everything but my daughters coach isn't making it easy on me.
Last weekend was first comp and our center flyer fell out of her stunt and then fell out of the pyramid causing a PD(pyramid disaster). It looked like she got scared and just fell out, didn't even try to save it. She falls out all the time at practice too.

Now, next practice we suddenly had a new center flyer. I'm thinking all is good because the replacement is a beast! She deserves it.

Now, at tonight's practice, guess who's back at center? Yup, Ms Falls-a-lot. We've learned that the Mom pitched a fit and eventually got her way. Next, my daughter was moved around so now she does not do her best tumbling pass (and yes, she's one of the better tumblers. Not the best, but certainly top 10 on team)

So my fear is our coach has no idea on what she's doing. I'm trying not to be that person and rants about how wrong she is doing her job.
(same stuff happened last year too, same coach, flyer couldn't stay up and she never replaced her)
I'm also not suggesting my daughter be center flyer either. We have others on the team better than her. I'm realistic about that.

I'll take any advice I can get.

You have asked to assume that many things you say are exactly true and happened as you say they have. That is certainly possible, but my guess is that the version of the story from the coaches' perspective is very different from yours. Before everyone jumps in and claims to know you have been wronged, they should try to find out more about the situation.

<<Playing Devil's advocate and pretending to be the coach in that situation>>

If a stunt or pyramid falls, it is not automatically the fault of the flyer. We would have to see close up videos of them doing the skill - even then, it is not always easy to see where the "fault" lies.

You didn't mention the success rate of the new group. If a coach makes a switch and there is immediate improvement, it is pretty rare for them to switch back. Did they simply switch the positions of the groups or did they rearrange the makeup of the group themselves?

Did you hear the conversation between the coach and the parent? We have had multiple occasions we called coach/parent meetings to tell the parent we were changing something in their favor - only to hear later that the parent went back and bragged that they had DEMANDED we make a change and we immediately caved. Unfortunately, you can't always believe parents' version of coach/parent meetings.

(side note) Any parent that loudly/inappropriately complains about a coaching decision has actually HURT their chances to get what they want at our gym. We will always listen to complaints and occasionally even change some decisions based on the information we learn. However, if we know that a parent has been excessively vocal, negative, or disruptive (or truthfully, if they are overly rude to us about it) it actually makes it LESS likely that they will get what they want. We do not want it to look any parent controls what happens on the floor. That still doesn't mean we won't listen and still try to do what is right in the situation, but it makes the threshold of when we would make a change much higher.

You seem to be suggesting that because the coach is incompetent, the change in your daughter's tumbling pass must have been invalid. We would need to know the history of her tumbling and the reason for the change. We have MANY athletes who do not get to do their favorite or most difficult pass in routines for a variety of reasons. Even if a coach was wrong about who should be center flyer does not automatically make every decision of theirs wrong as well.

NOTE: Starting off a conversation with a version of "Now, I'm not one of those parents that . . . ." is how probably 75% of coach/parent conversations start. It usually (but not always) means that you really ARE one of those types of parents.

Again, you MAY be 100% correct in everything that you have said - I have no way of knowing the details. However, if you are asking for advice/opinions, I feel that it is only fair to try to get in both potential sides of the story.

 

[TheVipersMom]

I definitely wouldn't bring up the tumble pass. My daughter is the best tumbler on the team. (There is one other girl who is probably right where she is at and a few close seconds but not many)

I'm not going to lie I was disappointed to learn my daughter was not last pass. She doesn't even have a difficult pass.

She is working fulls right now and her tumbling pass is a FWO, RO, BHS.

Our team is almost all synchro tumbling. Even last pass is a synchro pass. I think only 2 passes in running tumbling are not synced. My daughter and one other girl (we had squad tumbling but one girl has a block so now her partner goes by herself) so my cp and the other girl are the only two passes that aren't synced.

Come to find out they tried putting my daughter in about three different groups throughout the summer where the passes were a lot difficult but my daughter does slower Fwo's then most but can out BHS every single person as far as speed.

So my daughter got stuck by herself. Since there are a lot of girls going at one time and two girls that cross center like one second after she does she tumbles center back to front because she can do it that way because she is fast.

So complaining about a pass is trivial. They could legit give my cp the hardest pass where she could tumble last from one corner to the other corner and then tumble right back to the pyramid. As awesome as that sounds it would not be about the team it would be about my daughter.

So I realized it was dumb to be mad and even though my daughter has more skills that are higher level she still in essence may not be the strongest level 2 tumbler. So I just tell her to do a fierce hair whip and snap since she is front center when she lands! Lol

I will say if you don't trust the coaching decisions then maybe you would be happier elsewhere. I'm sure that has happened as I have seen moms do it to teams my daughter has been on. I certainly hope it gets better for you and works itself out!! Let us know how it goes!

 

[JulieP]

NOTE: Starting off a conversation with a version of "Now, I'm not one of those parents that . . . ." is how probably 75% of coach/parent conversations start. It usually (but not always) means that you really ARE one of those types of parents.

Again, you MAY be 100% correct in everything that you have said - I have no way of knowing the details. However, if you are asking for advice/opinions, I feel that it is only fair to try to get in both potential sides of the story.

Feel like I was just at cheer church. Preach! :D

 

[catlady]

My guess is that temporary flyer was a "motivational" flyer as SheCheers said, or the coach was just trying to find out if it was, in fact, the flyer or her bases/backspot. You said you had learned that her parent pitched a fit and got her way, my question would be, "by whom?". There tend to be a handful of parents, at every function, whose conversations always begin with, "Well, I heard....", "Judy's mom told me.....", "A friend said she saw.....", "I overheard the coach saying....." Unless you saw and heard it for yourself, I wouldn't put too much faith in it.

It is early in the season and your coach will use this time to tweak the routine, passes, and stunts based on the feedback she receives from the judges. As an example, the judges may suggest more synchronized tumbling, and therefore your daughters pass would change. Coaches, also, find out how they rate on the difficulty scale compared to their competition. Without deductions, how was your teams overall score compared to the rest? If you all scored high on difficulty, she can water the routine down if they are struggling to "hit". If you all scored well (without deductions), she is probably going to work hard on those individuals that caused the deductions. I'd give it a couple more months before I'd confront the owner, especially with the "I learned" information. As you saw at that one practice, your coach can put a flyer in at a moments notice if she needs to for a competition. And last year, it could have been as simple as, she had noone to replacement her with. Noone flocks to a gym with losing teams, I'm sure the owner is watching. Hang in there!

 

[cheerinatorXdad]

Sage words of advice, right here.

 

[CheerMomNTx]

Basically you have to trust your coaches. Venting might feel good right now but be careful. You could vent to the wrong person and then every parent hears about it and that will trickle down to the kids. The last thing you want would be the kids pointing fingers at one another and then you have a team divided.

Stick through it, stay positive and hope for the best. If the coaching style is not what you are looking for, then next season shop around for a program that fits your family. Good luck!!

 

[NEliteSteven]

This might sound terrible, but I'm more of the coach where if a parent comes to me freaking out because they're daughter got moved or isn't point flyer/last pass/point dancer--guess where they're going? BACK LEFT CORNER.

 

[cupieqt]

This might sound terrible, but I'm more of the coach where if a parent comes to me freaking out because they're daughter got moved or isn't point flyer/last pass/point dancer--guess where they're going? BACK LEFT CORNER.

Banish them all to the BLC! Banish

 

[1CheerMom]

This might sound terrible, but I'm more of the coach where if a parent comes to me freaking out because they're daughter got moved or isn't point flyer/last pass/point dancer--guess where they're going? BACK LEFT CORNER.

Wow....that's so wrong and sad for the child. I think everyone just needs to remember that we are talking about kids. This sport is for our kids. Coaches are regular people. (One exception to the rule is coaches who coach their own kids). I'm sure being a coach is very difficult but being a cheer parent is even more difficult when your child is upset and hurt by coaching decisions. This sport runs anywhere from $2000-$5000 with tuition, private tumbling classes, uni's, comp fees, travel expenses etc...it's difficult to justify the expenses when your cp is disappointed. I also would like to say that the way parents react also can influence the way their children will react to setbacks...and I'm
not just talking cheer. In the end we have to remember that this is a team sport.

 

[5-6-7-8]

Wow....that's so wrong and sad for the child. I think everyone just needs to remember that we are talking about kids. This sport is for our kids. Coaches are regular people. (One exception to the rule is coaches who coach their own kids). I'm sure being a coach is very difficult but being a cheer parent is even more difficult when your child is upset and hurt by coaching decisions. This sport runs anywhere from $2000-$5000 with tuition, private tumbling classes, uni's, comp fees, travel expenses etc...it's difficult to justify the expenses when your cp is disappointed. I also would like to say that the way parents react also can influence the way their children will react to setbacks...and I'm
not just talking cheer. In the end we have to remember that this is a team sport.

I agree with you that it shouldn't be taken out on the child, however I disagree that it is difficult to justify spending the money because my CP is disappointed. This is a team sport, my dollar is no more or less important than anyone else's (I hope.). If my child ends up back left corner she can either accept it or work to change it.

 

[1CheerMom]

I agree with you that it shouldn't be taken out on the child, however I disagree that it is difficult to justify spending the money because my CP is disappointed. This is a team sport, my dollar is no more or less important than anyone else's (I hope.). If my child ends up back left corner she can either accept it or work to change it.

Maybe you didn't read my entire post...I clearly stated that we should remember Cheer is a TEAM sport. I personally wouldn't fork out thousands of dollars and commit my time to this sport if my cp wasn't happy and came home sad after practice. We've all seen coaches favor certain kids. In that respect, their money is more valuable than for example the child in the back left corner. Competitive cheer isn't for everyone. Coaching styles can be negative and positive. I've personally seen both. And, just for the record, my cp has been in the back left corner and she rocked that corner last season! (Disclaimer... Her placement had nothing to do with me) :)

 

[5-6-7-8]

Maybe you didn't read my entire post...I clearly stated that we should remember Cheer is a TEAM sport. I personally wouldn't fork out thousands of dollars and commit my time to this sport if my cp wasn't happy and came home sad after practice. We've all seen coaches favor certain kids. In that respect, their money is more valuable than for example the child in the back left corner. Competitive cheer isn't for everyone. Coaching styles can be negative and positive. I've personally seen both. And, just for the record, my cp has been in the back left corner and she rocked that corner last season! (Disclaimer... Her placement had nothing to do with me) :)

Oops! :oops: Sorry I missed that part.

 

[IzzyFierce]

Banish them all to the BLC! Banish

I have no idea why I laughed so hard at this. XD

I like the Fierceboards because everyone here is as goofy as me. :chestbump:

 

[cheerinatorXdad]

Personally I would leave tumbling pass alone, especially if the real issue is Miss Falls A-lot and you know Mommy Hissy got the spot. You will have no ground if you complain about Miss Falls-A-lot being put back because mom wanted it and then bring up your CP. Your CP may not be doing her best tumbling pass because maybe she and another CP pass together and always stay in sync, not enough details for me to know.. but there are so many reasons why the tumbling pass could switch and it could be precisely because she is a strong tumbler. Maybe she is always consistent and they need that then so many reasons.... so personally would focus on the other issue and perhaps ask if there is a plan if this continues versus why (because really you know mommy complained so if coach gives you some other answer then it won't matter because you know mommy complained, but if you ask if there is a plan if it continues you may get more information - just a thought.

Now I've had some time to sleep on it!
I'm not concerned so much about the tumbling pass change. So be it. We've got plenty of other good tumblers that should score us well in that category.
Its the center flyer issue that has us up in arms....and its pah-lenty other parents too!

 

[cheerinatorXdad]

You have asked to assume that many things you say are exactly true and happened as you say they have. That is certainly possible, but my guess is that the version of the story from the coaches' perspective is very different from yours. Before everyone jumps in and claims to know you have been wronged, they should try to find out more about the situation.

<<Playing Devil's advocate and pretending to be the coach in that situation>>

If a stunt or pyramid falls, it is not automatically the fault of the flyer. We would have to see close up videos of them doing the skill - even then, it is not always easy to see where the "fault" lies.

You didn't mention the success rate of the new group. If a coach makes a switch and there is immediate improvement, it is pretty rare for them to switch back. Did they simply switch the positions of the groups or did they rearrange the makeup of the group themselves?

Did you hear the conversation between the coach and the parent? We have had multiple occasions we called coach/parent meetings to tell the parent we were changing something in their favor - only to hear later that the parent went back and bragged that they had DEMANDED we make a change and we immediately caved. Unfortunately, you can't always believe parents' version of coach/parent meetings.

(side note) Any parent that loudly/inappropriately complains about a coaching decision has actually HURT their chances to get what they want at our gym. We will always listen to complaints and occasionally even change some decisions based on the information we learn. However, if we know that a parent has been excessively vocal, negative, or disruptive (or truthfully, if they are overly rude to us about it) it actually makes it LESS likely that they will get what they want. We do not want it to look any parent controls what happens on the floor. That still doesn't mean we won't listen and still try to do what is right in the situation, but it makes the threshold of when we would make a change much higher.

You seem to be suggesting that because the coach is incompetent, the change in your daughter's tumbling pass must have been invalid. We would need to know the history of her tumbling and the reason for the change. We have MANY athletes who do not get to do their favorite or most difficult pass in routines for a variety of reasons. Even if a coach was wrong about who should be center flyer does not automatically make every decision of theirs wrong as well.

NOTE: Starting off a conversation with a version of "Now, I'm not one of those parents that . . . ." is how probably 75% of coach/parent conversations start. It usually (but not always) means that you really ARE one of those types of parents.

Again, you MAY be 100% correct in everything that you have said - I have no way of knowing the details. However, if you are asking for advice/opinions, I feel that it is only fair to try to get in both potential sides of the story.

Blue- thanks for the devil's advocate thoughts.
I'll answer what I can now that I've calmed down. Certainly last nights post was an instant knee-jerk reaction to the events.
As for the stunt falls, you are correct. Its not always the flyer. We watched the video again and again. I can't make much from the stunt fall, but the pyramid fall appears to be all her. Just an opinion though.
What I will say is the replacement flyer that was in on Tues night practice had same bases and had no trouble whatsoever all practice long and that's all they did was stunts and pyramid. Therefore an easy deduction could point to flyer as the weak link.

Did I hear the conversation with the coach? No. My source was another parent, that I deem reliable, that witnessed a "lively" conversation shall we say. My deduction was that Susie's Mom pitched a fit because she was back to flying the next practice. So I'm having to make assumptions which I know is dangerous.

So I probably won't confront the coach. I'm having to show trust here. I was told, which is second hand information, that the coach told the falling flyer she has one more shot at the next competition or she's out. Again, only hearsay but my sources have no reason to lie or make this story up. I fear the flyer is going to ruin us again next competition so I feel like we're coming in already with a handicap.

Time will tell. If it happens again and a change isn't made then I think its time to consider making a gym change. I pay too much a month to for us to lose.