All-Star Your Daughter Won't Fly Forever

[Keep_Believing]

What I wish our gym did was cross-train the flyers/bases more on teams where almost all kids are the same size. Have one set of kids in pyrimad and one set in elites or something or at least mixing it up somehow. I think it would better prepare everyone for growth spurts and position changes. When Susie grows 5 inches in a year and has never "grabbed a foot" and it thrown into basing level 4 for their first basing experience ever, it just seems somewhat preventable.

One positive of CEA using double teamers is that they can base on one team and fly on another. Many get experience in different positions.

 

[BlueCat]

@BlueCat, I love your basketball analogy, but I it falls short when comparing this situation... In basketball, the too short athlete doesn't required others to execute and perform their job... A too short basketball player can work on skills - speed drills and work on muscles to help with leaping higher...

But flyers absolutely cannot do or execute their job without the total aid of the bases and backspots... So beinga flyer, somewhat put an athlete in a no win situation and I think, it is the adults, imo, that makes the situation worse because of their expectation for their child....

PS: I think, bases and back spots can do strength training at any age. I still remembered my daughter doing gazillion pushups and handstand pushups, against a wall, and pulls ups and she never used weights...She also used the ropes to strengthen her arms and upper body and these are common exercises that gymnasts do... But I noticed these exercises are not commonly done in cheer conditioning. ..

My analogy was limited to the idea that pointing to isolated examples of stunts that work with "normal" sized flyers doesn't mean that size is irrelevant to stunting success. In my opinion, overall mass is MORE highly correlated to flying success than height is to basketball success for many of the reasons you described. Also, an increase in overall mass of the flyer is probably directly correlated to stress injuries in the bases. At some point, you can be forced into a choice between hurting Suzy Flyer's feelings, or (increasing the chance of) hurting Sarah Base's back muscles.

Another way to look it is that raising a "normal" flyer takes more work and energy than a "tiny" flyer. That is energy/work that cannot be used in other ways during a 2 1/2 minute routine.

I wish the above wasn't true. I honestly wish that it was simply a matter of experience, desire, and hard work. That would be more "fair". However, physics (and for the most part, the scoresheet) simply don't care about those things. That doesn't mean athletes shouldn't be treated with serious respect for their heath, body image, feelings, desires, and it doesn't mean that we just immediately start pulling kids out of the air on a whim. It does mean that, ultimately, not every athlete gets to have the exact role in routines that they want.

 

[TealShades]

THISSSSSSS.
But I don't think it's so much as this when it comes to leaving the air. Think about it this way.
You've been flying all of your life and then you get taken out of the air and made a base, your experiencing extreme difficulty in basing toward the point where it's either get it together or you're off the team. This actually happens. Replacements are made easily.

Have them weight train ;).

 

[CLynn]

What I think he/she meant was bringing a 12 year old 4'6 80lbs flyer on a senior team to fly.

And I have no problem with that because according to the rules now, that flyer would be age appropriate (even if he/she doesn't find it appropriate). Don't get me wrong, I wouldn't mind if the minimum age for sr. teams was raised even more, and for sure that would extend the lifespan of some flyers flying. I appreciate the pov though, that instead of having a goal of extending the flyers lifespan, we as parents and coaches mentally and physically prepare them for the likelihood that they might need to switch positions.

 

[CLynn]

What I wish our gym did was cross-train the flyers/bases more on teams where almost all kids are the same size. Have one set of kids in pyrimad and one set in elites or something or at least mixing it up somehow. I think it would better prepare everyone for growth spurts and position changes. When Susie grows 5 inches in a year and has never "grabbed a foot" and it thrown into basing level 4 for their first basing experience ever, it just seems somewhat preventable.

I can see from a competitive perspective teams where most kids are similar in size would be a disadvantage, but as a concept for a once a month training event or maybe summertime gym event I like this idea.

 

[lifeoftheparty]

CP is 12yo and around 75lbs, She is a flyer for now and I'm sure there will be a time she no longer is. Its the trend now I understand it and don't disagree with it. When it is her time to base I would like her to have an opportunity like the one child from SMOED who was placed on restricted 5 one year in anticipation that it would be her last year flying. We are not fly or die at all, what concerns me for the safety of all is when flyers are grounded they have to learn to base at a higher level almost immediately. CP is a lvl 5 flyer but started at lvl 1. I wish there was a better way to prepare the flyers that are grounded to transition into basing.

 

[Pebbles49]

@BlueCat, I definitely saw where you were going, but I get so upset that this sport is so flyer centered... People are forgetting that cheerleading is a sport and most importantly, a team subjectively judged sport... Luckily, at least in cheer, there are no limitations and chances are given to try other positions and there are flexibility to learn new things...

I hate to think that cheer athletes are actually limit themselves... Using @BlueCat's basketball analogy,,, I believe in this sport the most prized positions are forward and/or point guard because they tend to play more and in the position to score more then the other athletes on the court, but I never heard an basketball athlete refusing to play because they are forced to play Center, etc...

I love Cheer because this sport provides a place for any body type a chance to participate, which is not a common thing in other sports... In other sports, unlike Cheer, if you cannot fit a strict body type these athletes are really force to quit or get cut... Let's really look at sports like football, ice skating, etc...

 

[cheer25mom]

@BlueCat, , there are no limitations and chances are given to try other positions and there are flexibility to learn new things...
..

this is true for flyers, but definitely NOT for bases. If your kid comes in as the bigger or taller kid on the team they are a base, and there isn't ever going to be an opportunity to try to fly. Not saying there should be, but flyers are definitely the ones with more choices/ opportunities in most cases.

 

[Lisa Seye]

Coaches should be helping make this transition, and ideally it should be made at the beginning of the season so that they are learning stunts a little along.

A lot of flyers don't really WANT to learn to base either, and that makes them harder to teach. think "I'm too weak to do this" ... this is too hard"ect. If you have the core strength and body control to fly, and the arm strength to tumble transitioning to basing an appropriately sized flyer shouldn't be excessively difficult... if you are willing to put in the effort necessary and have the proper instruction.

I will add to my other post that when cp was basing on her junior team, she loved it. When they started putting her back in the air, she was disappointed because she wanted to base. She was very content to fly on her senior team and base on her junior team.

 

[HeyMom]

How about gyms stop taking experienced flyers out of the air just because they're 5'6. Understanding Height may play a role but if the experience, cleanliness and HIGH skill level is there.... why should they get out of the air? If the stunts hit, why replace? I feel like they should give the taller flyers a chance before they just make them a base.

And add to this: How about gyms actually invest some time and teach young flyers to base so that when the inevitable happens, they are physically and mentally prepared to take on a new role.

 

[cheer25mom]

I will add to my other post that when cp was basing on her junior team, she loved it. When they started putting her back in the air, she was disappointed because she wanted to base. She was very content to fly on her senior team and base on her junior team.

I am glad, and some girls do but there are also those who definitely are not interested in wanting to learn to base, and it shows.

 

[retiredl5cheer]

And add to this: How about gyms actually invest some time and teach young flyers to base so that when the inevitable happens, they are physically and mentally prepared to take on a new role.

Parents can initiate this too. If your gym offers stunt classes, sign your flyer up and ask for her to base. Ask for her to double team on a lower level team and base there.

The challenge is that most coaches have a very limited amount of time, so they spend it focusing on the team, not the individual. I don't have time to train our routine and also cross train all of my flyers, bases, and back spots. If someone is missing, sure, I allow someone else to hop in their spot, but there's simply not enough time in the practice schedule to play around switching positions.

 

[HeyMom]

Parents can initiate this too. If your gym offers stunt classes, sign your flyer up and ask for her to base. Ask for her to double team on a lower level team and base there.

The challenge is that most coaches have a very limited amount of time, so they spend it focusing on the team, not the individual. I don't have time to train our routine and also cross train all of my flyers, bases, and back spots. If someone is missing, sure, I allow someone else to hop in their spot, but there's simply not enough time in the practice schedule to play around switching positions.

Our gym did not offer any classes to help athletes learn to base.

 

[retiredl5cheer]

Our gym did not offer any classes to help athletes learn to base.

Did they offer stunt classes? Or just flyer classes?

 

[HeyMom]

Did they offer stunt classes? Or just flyer classes?

Just flyer flex classes and a class for coed stunting.