All-Star A Growing Issue... I.e. Crossovers On Worlds Teams (for Bid Obtaining Purposes)

[Ashley]

Maybe we can look at it another way - if your gym has enough athletes to make two level 5 teams with just a few crossovers then why wouldn't you do it? Are you going to tell a bunch of your level 5 athletes that they can't be on the one level 5 team because it's full? That's a quick way to lose money and athletes.

Competition season is a lot longer than just worlds. There are almost 6 months of competition before then. If you can go almost all season with your two teams and then have to find a few replacements for the last competition of the season, is it really that big of a deal?

Again, do you have evidence that these gyms are doing this maliciously to try and get more bids for their gym?

 

[fabulousity]

if a gym takes a subpar level 5 team, puts at MINIMUM 8 crossover alternates from level 5 teams that already have paid bids wins a bid on sunday and holds try outs for the team the following tuesday is unethical.

bids should be won based on what a team has. you should not be able to secure a bid and then fill the roster.

 

[Mo-Lissa]

I didnt assume they werent! I have no idea why they wouldnt be used but I just dont assume things that I dont have actual facts about! thats all

Well I didn't assume anything, I saw the teams compete with the athletes from Worlds teams on the floor. I know there are no crossvovers at Worlds, so the athletes must be replaced, if the athletes were so good why were they not used in the first place was the only question I have....not assuming just asking, but I do not want to argue with anyone just puzzled by this practice.

 

[Mo-Lissa]

Maybe we can look at it another way - if your gym has enough athletes to make two level 5 teams with just a few crossovers then why wouldn't you do it? Are you going to tell a bunch of your level 5 athletes that they can't be on the one level 5 team because it's full? That's a quick way to lose money and athletes.

Competition season is a lot longer than just worlds. There are almost 6 months of competition before then. If you can go almost all season with your two teams and then have to find a few replacements for the last competition of the season, is it really that big of a deal?

Again, do you have evidence that these gyms are doing this maliciously to try and get more bids for their gym?

Totally understand this too, but if you were say on both, and one team wins a bid... maybe you should be replaced from that point on??? I really think that there are many loopholes in general in the whole worlds bid thing. If they just want another team why not do a level 4 and try different position??? Just curious???

 

[Ashley]

Totally understand this too, but if you were say on both, and one team wins a bid... maybe you should be replaced from that point on??? I really think that there are many loopholes in general in the whole worlds bid thing. If they just want another team why not do a level 4 and try different position??? Just curious???

That's a good point, but in the heat of comp season when you're competing every other week, it can be hard to replace your crossovers. At this point in the season, Worlds is almost two months away and comp season is winding down giving you more practice time to do so.

And you could go level 4, but then you're likely to lose the level 5 athletes, the majority of that team, that you just told had to compete on a level 4 team. If not this season, then next.

I'm not against tightening rules, but not everyone who does this has malicious intent. Crossovers are allowed for 95% of the season, you cant fault gyms for taking advantage of that.

 

[Mo-Lissa]

That's a good point, but in the heat of comp season when you're competing every other week, it can be hard to replace your crossovers. At this point in the season, Worlds is almost two months away and comp season is winding down giving you more practice time to do so.

And you could go level 4, but then you're likely to lose the level 5 athletes, the majority of that team, that you just told had to compete on a level 4 team. If not this season, then next.

I'm not against tightening rules, but not everyone who does this has malicious intent. Crossovers are allowed for 95% of the season, you cant fault gyms for taking advantage of that.

I totally don't think everyone has malicious intent....we all love to see good talent, and I don't think many gyms are doing this. I just believe it is something we should be watching because sometimes people take advantage of the rules. I was also involved in allstars when there were no crossovers. Some days this sport has just changed so much from the sport I fell in love with 15 years ago......

 

[lakerfantlc]

It's sad for the kids on the team who got a bid then went to Worlds with a "lesser" team and didn't do well....it is sad for the EP who paid out the bid because a "different" team than the one they paid is now representing them. I think it's ok for injury or emergency...but to stack a big percentage of a team like that...not so much:/...IMO

 

[AllHeartxo3]

If you need that edge to get the bid then I see no problem, but the gyms I see doing this are using game changing athletes. The last pass tumblers and super strong bases are taken out leaving that team mega weak and probably not able to even make it to worlds without them. If I was one of those athletes I'd be more than upset. If I knew with those athletes I had a chance to medal in the top 3, but without them I MIGHT make it to the top 10, I'd be upset. I feel like if you don't have enough athletes to make that strong level 5 team then don't make the team. Make it restricted and if you have a double send them to the other level 5 teams in the gym. It's just a shady process.

 

[njallday]

It's sad for the kids on the team who got a bid then went to Worlds with a "lesser" team and didn't do well....it is sad for the EP who paid out the bid because a "different" team than the one they paid is now representing them. I think it's ok for injury or emergency...but to stack a big percentage of a team like that...not so much:/...IMO

I completely agree with you! there is a reason substitutions/alternates are allowed. with teams of this caliber injuries happen and you need to be able to adjust. In my previous post, I left out this part. I am okay with it when used for its sole, original intent.

In addition to obtaining a bid with crossovers who will not be on that team on the worlds floor, I am also not okay with teams that are holding tryouts after receiving a paid bid. Both are unethical, IMO.

 

[NoOneSpecial]

I am not a fan of crossovers to begin with. What other sport uses this method to fill rosters. None that I am aware of.

Would it not be benificial to get cheerleading reckognized as a sport to move more toward their direction. They register their athletes to a governing body, declare level of play at the beginning of the season, submitt their rosters to the governing body, play at the level they declared all season. If for some reason an athlet quits during the season they have to obtain a release from their team and file it with the governing body. They cannot go to another team at a lower level. They must stay in the same level or higher. They have no crossovers and experience the same issues the cheerleading world does with injuries and people quiting mid season. They are aloud to fill those spots only with an athlete from a lower level or equal within the same program.

It seems pretty simple and basic to me. I know some of the argument is letting athletes walk out the door and lose money. The other sports go through the same pains but yet they manage it.

 

[tucknduck]

I am not a fan of crossovers to begin with. What other sport uses this method to fill rosters. None that I am aware of.

Would it not be benificial to get cheerleading reckognized as a sport to move more toward their direction. They register their athletes to a governing body, declare level of play at the beginning of the season, submitt their rosters to the governing body, play at the level they declared all season. If for some reason an athlet quits during the season they have to obtain a release from their team and file it with the governing body. They cannot go to another team at a lower level. They must stay in the same level or higher. They have no crossovers and experience the same issues the cheerleading world does with injuries and people quiting mid season. They are aloud to fill those spots only with an athlete from a lower level or equal within the same program.

It seems pretty simple and basic to me. I know some of the argument is letting athletes walk out the door and lose money. The other sports go through the same pains but yet they manage it.

To make cheerleading a legitimate sport, this is what needs to be done.

 

[gofriars610]

I am not a fan of crossovers to begin with. What other sport uses this method to fill rosters. None that I am aware of.

Apparently you've never heard of "swing" players who play on both Varsity and JV. Most high schools do this. Heck, I even played a few JV games when I played hockey in high school to get experience playing a different position, and I was first or second line on Varsity.
My little brother plays club hockey during the fall, prior to high school season. At one point he was playing for U18, U16-Tier1 and U16-Tier3. (Players couldn't make it, he wanted the extra ice time, etc.) It happens in other sports.

 

[NoOneSpecial]

Apparently you've never heard of "swing" players who play on both Varsity and JV. Most high schools do this. Heck, I even played a few JV games when I played hockey in high school to get experience playing a different position, and I was first or second line on Varsity.
My little brother plays club hockey during the fall, prior to high school season. At one point he was playing for U18, U16-Tier1 and U16-Tier3. (Players couldn't make it, he wanted the extra ice time, etc.) It happens in other sports.

High school is different - not a competitive paid sport.

Maybe it depends on what hockey league you play in and whether or not they are league and non league games. In our area and the clubs that I have participated they are pretty strict and play by the rules. Are people going to go outside the rules heck yes but that is not the norm.

 

[TheUltimateFan]

Wow, this is just sad. When and how did competition become a win-at-all-costs dog fight? It seems like implosion is inevitable if something doesn't happen to take back control of this sport.

 

[gofriars610]

High school is different - not a competitive paid sport.

Maybe it depends on what hockey league you play in and whether or not they are league and non league games. In our area and the clubs that I have participated they are pretty strict and play by the rules. Are people going to go outside the rules heck yes but that is not the norm.

haha we pay a lotttt of money for high school sports. Activity fee at my school is $75, plus the cost of ice. (Not cheap)

It's not against the rules to play up or play on multiple teams...