All-Star Covid-19 / Varsity Response

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oncecoolcoachnowmom said:
With COVID going on, I've had this convo with a lot of my mom friends in regards to tons of sports and activities, not just cheer.

My take:

Most owners and coaches and such are trying to do right by kids and protect them the best they can.

But really at this point, some coaches/studios/gyms/leagues are going to do what they want (especially in states where the stay home and closure orders are lifted and there are no real rules.)

Puts parents in a tough spot but the reality is:

PARENTS are going to have to draw a line in the sand and decide to protect their kids if gyms/studios/teams don't. Sometimes it means being THAT PARENT and refusing to let them participate if you don't think it's safe.

I know cheer makes that hard because (example) when you've tried out and your kid made their dream team - you don't want to be the "odd parent out" who sees a problem with what's going on. But, that > a sick kiddo.
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10000000%

I hate being that parent. Most of my mom group consented because they didn’t want their kid left out. I don’t know what the right answer is. We are in Texas and I agree with very little that our governor does.

As far as cheer goes...I don’t know what I want to happen, but what I am seeing (from a lot gyms also) makes me uncomfortable. My child is prone to respiratory infections, I don’t her getting breathed on all the time, but wearing a mask in the gym would also severely comprise her ability to breathe. And it’s not enough if she’s the only one wearing a mask.

Hospitalizations are at record high yet we keep moving forward with reopening everything. I know 12 people who have had the virus, 2 are still alive. I’m not saying we should go back to lockdown. I do want some normalcy for my child. I feel like I’m the only one concerned with how fast we are moving forward.
 
catlady said:
Many people tend to trust those of you on the front lines much more than we trust government and privately funded agencies and organizations. However, my BIL, ER nurse niece and many others that are writing governors about mask wearing, are concerned that during the hot summer months, masking wearing will have people touching their face much more often than without a mask. We can always pick and choose the data that agrees with our stance, but we can't ignore there are corporations, organizations and individuals that stand to gain millions, billions and trillions on COVID19. Instead of reporting the very few hospital beds being used right now for COVID19, they are hyping the new cases and conveniently leave out it is because they have more testing and sites available. The WHO and Dr. Birx don't necessarily disagree with these front line workers. It's really not that hard to understand that any exertion, especially in warmer and more humid environments, will increase sweat production under masks and result in more mask adjusting and face touching. Gyms can not be compared to very cold hospital environments with disciplined mask wearing staff. I stand with the front liners on this one.

To prevent infection and to slow transmission of COVID-19, do the following:

  • Wash your hands regularly with soap and water, or clean them with alcohol-based hand rub.
  • Maintain at least 1 meter distance between you and people coughing or sneezing.
  • Avoid touching your face
  • Cover your mouth and nose when coughing or sneezing.
  • Stay home if you feel unwell.
  • Refrain from smoking and other activities that weaken the lungs.
  • Practice physical distancing by avoiding unnecessary travel and staying away from large groups of people.
Learn more at WHO

From Dr. Birx:

“The most important thing is the social distancing and washing your hands,” she said. “And we don’t want people to get an artificial sense of protection because they’re behind a mask. Because if they’re touching things — remember your eyes are not in the mask — so if you’re touching things and then touching your eyes you’re exposing yourself in the same way.”
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I’m at a loss. I’m more than willing to have a nuanced discussion about what the research says but I can’t do that if you put more weight in anecdotal evidence than you do in data and expert opinion.

Every doctor is not equally prepared to deal with every problem. An emergency physician is board certified in emergency care, not in infectious disease or epidemiology. ER nurses are experts in ER nursing just like I am expert in ICU nursing, but we are not experts in epidemiology or infectious disease either. It is very easy for us to fall for the dunning Kruger effect and oversimplify very complex and nuanced issues, which is what is happening when they tell you that some people not wearing masks effectively or correctly means we shouldn’t encourage anyone to wear masks.

Data and research can be skewed and misconstrued to suit a political agenda or confirm a personal bias but individual opinions are always skewed to reflect personal biases and agendas (often times accidentally).

In the 50s, weight was put on “expert options” and individual doctors would create treatment plans based on their own belief of what is best. What we found through research is that that is ineffective. Expert opinions were replaced, for the most part, by evidence based practice and patient outcomes have been much better for it. There are times where we have to trust expert opinions, and in those cases we turn to the people who are most educated/trained on the topic. In this case, epidemiologists and infectious disease experts like Fauci. Other than that, we have to turn to research and evidence.

So like I said, frontline workers (myself included) are not expert opinions. Nor are doctors board certified in anything other than PulmCrit, ID, or Epidemiology. We are too susceptible to inadvertent bias.

You wouldn’t go to an emergency physician to treat your cancer, you’d go to an oncologist. So don’t go to an ED doc (or any other doc) for advice on this topic, go to an ID/Epidemiology doc.
 
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tojofasho said:
I've been watching the conversation and figured I'd weigh in on at least this part in particular. I'm 26, never smoked a day in my life, no asthma, still cheering, just all around pretty healthy (minus a chronic ankle condition). I got COVID back in the first half of March, I was the 28th case in my state and ended up getting breathing treatments at the ER it got so bad. I now have an inhaler for the first time in my life, and when I run the mile at the start of practice (which use to be unpleasant but bearable), I almost can't breathe by the end of it. Went back for a checkup with a doctor and they basically confirmed that I have lung damage, though whether it's temporary or long term has yet to be seen.

Basically, while the majority of deaths/long term injuries occur in older people, it's happening to us 'younger' folk as well like Andy said. Nobody is safe, not you, your child, or any other family members. Your odds are better than the old folks at the nursing home, sure, and you probably won't die, but you very well may get saddled with a lifelong condition.
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Thank you so much for sharing your story! I am so sorry you had to go through something like this, I wish more than anything no one would have to go through what you and my patients have gone through. All I want is for the smallest number of people possible to get sick. The smallest number of deaths. The reason I have been so outspoken on here is because I am terrified people aren’t going to take this seriously enough and more people will suffer.

I am so sorry this happened to you, but I hope you sharing your story will open some eyes. Cheerleading has been the most important thing in my life for over a decade, but it has to take a back seat right now. Please everyone, your health and your families health is the only thing that matters! Cheerleading will be here when the world returns to normal.

Even if we don’t get a vaccine, we are getting better at treating this thing every day. Your odds of survival or your families odds of survival will be much higher in a year than they would be right now.
 
AndyT_T said:
Data and research can be skewed and misconstrued to suit a political agenda or confirm a personal bias but individual opinions are always skewed to reflect personal biases and agendas (often times accidentally).
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Big big yes to this. I have little to no knowledge about diseases, but I can speak about this. I'm less than 30 days away from finishing a graduate degree in Statistics and the rampant and corrupt misuse of data and statistics is very scary. I mean look at the chart the Georgia Department of Health put out. It was intentionally misleading; with most langauges/softwares with graphing capabilities, you have to go out of your way to put dates out of order. I could go on about ethics in stats, but to anyone looking at graphs or numbers or statistics, be a little bit skeptical. You don't need to go out of your way and do hours of research or have a math degree, but consider asking yourself, "Does this make sense? (i.e., do the axes make sense, does the numbers they're reporting make sense?)", and "Who is presenting this information and where did they get it from?"

I'm not going to go crazy in depth because I know math isn't everyone's cup of tea, but if anyone wants more details feel free to quote me or PM me.
 
Ems said:
Big big yes to this. I have little to no knowledge about diseases, but I can speak about this. I'm less than 30 days away from finishing a graduate degree in Statistics and the rampant and corrupt misuse of data and statistics is very scary. I mean look at the chart the Georgia Department of Health put out. It was intentionally misleading; with most langauges/softwares with graphing capabilities, you have to go out of your way to put dates out of order. I could go on about ethics in stats, but to anyone looking at graphs or numbers or statistics, be a little bit skeptical. You don't need to go out of your way and do hours of research or have a math degree, but consider asking yourself, "Does this make sense? (i.e., do the axes make sense, does the numbers they're reporting make sense?)", and "Who is presenting this information and where did they get it from?"

I'm not going to go crazy in depth because I know math isn't everyone's cup of tea, but if anyone wants more details feel free to quote me or PM me.
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Ditto from a Poli Sci major! Data in political or social issues is often really complex. Issues like Covid’s spread are often multivariate and showing overly simplified data can be so misleading
 
NavarroNewb20 said:
A coach at CA Plano tested positive, per IG. Best wishes for them. :(
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Oh no, that's awful. Praying for the coach and family.

Ps. not trying to sound selfish, but stinks for all the athletes too...they will be probably out of the gym again, and all quarantined for 2 weeks and tested.
 
123jump4! said:
Sweden is 5th in deaths per 1M people if you don’t count miniature countries like Andorra etc. They are WAY worse than their Scandinavian neighbors. Please don’t tell me about my country, I think I know more.
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Source? As of June 19th Sweden has dropped from 8th when I originally posted to now 9th per my source....which I gave and will give again. Give me your source instead of "please don't tell me about my country" and perhaps I can look at the data and compare. I go on global websites that provide actual data but, perhaps since "it's your country" you know more than them.

Coronavirus death rate by country | Statista

@AndyT_T again, this is about people picking and choosing their sources. I gave you the WHO and Dr. Birx, you are giving me the CDC. This virus is here to stay for a long time, do we just put life on hold until a supposed vaccine or "cure" comes around? Yes, it's unfortunate and a horrible virus, but as long as our hospitals are able to handle the sick, life needs to move forward. We have neighbor furloughed doctors and nurses that are worried because some are starting to lose their jobs....in a pandemic. You asked me if I want an ER doctor treating my supposed cancer, well it looks like we are heading that way if we don't get our doctors back giving treatments and surgeries. My daughter's surgery is still on hold because of all the backlog.
 
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catlady said:
Source? As of June 19th Sweden has dropped from 8th when I originally posted to now 9th per my source....which I gave and will give again. Give me your source instead of "please don't tell me about my country" and perhaps I can look at the data and compare. I go on global websites that provide actual data but, perhaps since "it's your country" you know more than them.

Coronavirus death rate by country | Statista

@AndyT_T again, this is about people picking and choosing their sources. I gave you the WHO and Dr. Birx, you are giving me the CDC. This virus is here to stay for a long time, do we just put life on hold until a supposed vaccine or "cure" comes around? Yes, it's unfortunate and a horrible virus, but as long as our hospitals are able to handle the sick, life needs to move forward. We have neighbor furloughed doctors and nurses that are worried because some are starting to lose their jobs....in a pandemic. You asked me if I want an ER doctor treating my supposed cancer, well it looks like we are heading that way if we don't get our doctors back giving treatments and surgeries. My daughter's surgery is still on hold because of all the backlog.
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I said deaths per 1M people which is the same as deaths per capita. Sweden is still 5th. (Death rate that you’re talking about is deaths per number of infected and that’s different.)

Coronavirus deaths per million by country | Statista
 
catlady said:
Source? As of June 19th Sweden has dropped from 8th when I originally posted to now 9th per my source....which I gave and will give again. Give me your source instead of "please don't tell me about my country" and perhaps I can look at the data and compare. I go on global websites that provide actual data but, perhaps since "it's your country" you know more than them.

Coronavirus death rate by country | Statista

@AndyT_T again, this is about people picking and choosing their sources. I gave you the WHO and Dr. Birx, you are giving me the CDC. This virus is here to stay for a long time, do we just put life on hold until a supposed vaccine or "cure" comes around? Yes, it's unfortunate and a horrible virus, but as long as our hospitals are able to handle the sick, life needs to move forward. We have neighbor furloughed doctors and nurses that are worried because some are starting to lose their jobs....in a pandemic. You asked me if I want an ER doctor treating my supposed cancer, well it looks like we are heading that way if we don't get our doctors back giving treatments and surgeries. My daughter's surgery is still on hold because of all the backlog.
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THANK YOU! This is what I have been saying the whole time. It's not reasonable to put our lives and the whole world on hold for however long this last. This is never going away. I have family in the medical industry that has told me that. Its never gonna leave. And a vaccine is not a cure. You can't force everyone to get a vaccine. For example, I have never got a flu shot. So you can't force anyone to take it.
 
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