All-Star Male Flyer... Help!

[Fab4lvr]

A BASKET!!!!!!! Not a stunt!

ok..................

 

[chyeeaaa69]

I guess I should explain myself more. at the collegiate level of this sport, we are losing the amazing male stunters. James Speed himself said at the conference none of his guys could even toss to hands at tryouts. yes he did mention they have been taught, but isn't that taking time out of developing more difficult skills than a toss to block? unfortunately we can't all have girls like Cheyenne(sp?) on Twist and Shout who can toss to block, so when we start to lose boys, for whatever reason, where will we turn? we can't turn to the bigger guys, and attempt to recruit them into the sport, because they have been so turned off by seeing these "cutie booty" boys strutting, hair flipping, and getting away with being a backspot, so we look to the girls. we all know that girls can not stunt at the same level as guys, this is no inequality statement, it's the truth, and yes, there are girls out there who are good stunters, even coed style stunting, however they just don't match. I don't need to provide examples, I'm sure the dancing and figure skating examples are enough, and thank you for those, because I couldn't think of any myself. I love seeing guys fly in baskets, as mentioned before, point basket, not some random off to the side. there was an argument on here before that I'm pretty sure I started (a while back) because a Cheernation junior team put a boy in the air in the far right group. if we could bring that thread back, I'm sure my opinion has changed, so don't try and use that thread against me, but it isn't the look that a coach wants in my opinion. no sexism, just what their routine would look best with. as bad as it is, a male in society is looked at as more masculine, stronger, more rugged, and is not "feminine" in any way shape or form, and trying to change that is pointless, so why not embrace it, and look to our boys for AMAZING stunting, have a few good tumblers/jumpers/dancers (which is the combination discussed at the conference), and then let the girls do the cute stuff.

before anyone jumps down my throat about homophobia... don't waste your time, if you know me... well... sure that speaks for itself.

 

[Brenner]

Oh my god. How come people have such a rigid opinion about what "looks" good? GAH!

Because that is what we are judged on...looking good !

I do not judge as much, this and last season (because of my accident) but I used to judge every weekend.
For 3 different tier one event producers, and I was also invited to judge worlds for the past 3 years.
I have never sat next to a judge that "preferred" to see a male in the air...NEVER !
(meaning the one footed section... I am "ok" with baskets and preps in pyramid)

When I am judging I am looking at body lines....meaning the line from the flyers hip to her big toe.
I want her foot to look like a continuation of her leg.
The boys can't show me the lines.... even if it is because of the uniform alone.
Not to mention "things hanging out and getting in the way of my "lines"

Sorry I don't think it is ever OK for a boy to do a scorpion, over stretch, back leg stretch...
You can call me sexist if you want to...but I just want my team to look the best and we do that by putting up girls.
If I coached a team where the boys were more flexible than my girls... I would find new girls

 

[Rudags]

Because that is what we are judged on...looking good !

I do not judge as much, this and last season (because of my accident) but I used to judge every weekend.
For 3 different tier one event producers, and I was also invited to judge worlds for the past 3 years.
I have never sat next to a judge that "preferred" to see a male in the air...NEVER !
(meaning the one footed section... I am "ok" with baskets and preps in pyramid)

When I am judging I am looking at body lines....meaning the line from the flyers hip to her big toe.
I want her foot to look like a continuation of her leg.
The boys can't show me the lines.... even if it is because of the uniform alone.
Not to mention "things hanging out and getting in the way of my "lines"

Sorry I don't think it is ever OK for a boy to do a scorpion, over stretch, back leg stretch...
You can call me sexist if you want to...but I just want my team to look the best and we do that by putting up girls.
If I coached a team where the boys were more flexible than my girls... I would find new girls

Agree 100%!!!!!!!! SHIMMEY!!!!!

 

[cheerislove8]

Not trying to start any arguments from saying this, just fyi...

I once read in a magazine (it must have been American Cheerleader) when they interviewed judges asking what they like to see in a routine, judges specifically said they'd rather see girls in the air, and to leave it to the boys to base. Not sure what company's judges they interviewed though.

 

[Haniana]

I think its tragic that some find it so hard to be a bit different. There is no secret that a lot of the rules need to change, and a lot of the judges could use some renewed thinking. Things change over time. Modern art would have flopped a hundred years ago, but it works today. It's called evolution. Compleatly natural. Get the boys up. This sport obviously needs a lot of fresh air.

 

[Haniana]

I find it kinda tragic that people are so afraid of change. Its no secret that a lot of rules need to change, and a lot of judges need to get some new perspective. Come on. Modern art wouldn't have worked a hundred years ago, but it works pretty well today. It's called evolution. Compleatly natural. Get the boys up! This sport needs obviously some fresh air.

 

[xtremeteal4life]

I stopped reading your post right here. Men invented cheerleading. In fact, women weren't allowed to do cheerleading for a REALLY long time. I don't mean to offend you, just an interesting bit of information.

I'm not offended...that may be true, but it still doesn't mean once upon a time it wasn't "normal" or "acceptable" for men to be cheerleaders bc it's true....and really it wasn't called cheerleading back then, it was more like "yell squads" and they didn't last a very long. I don't know if you consider twenty something years a REALLY long time before women were allowed to cheer, but I don't. 1903-1923ish (1923 is when women were "allowed" as you say). That's not a very long time. Thought that was a bit of interesting information myself

Again, it still doesn't change the fact that there was a time when men cheerleaders weren't as accepted. Heck, some even still get static for it!

 

[cheerbear2x]

All I'm saying is... I think it's quite awkward to see 4 stunts with girls, and one with boys. IDC if it's a basket, pyramid, whatever. I think it looks iffy. And like cheerislove8 said, judges would rather see girls then boys.

 

[F!ERCE]

All I'm saying is... I think it's quite awkward to see 4 stunts with girls, and one with boys. IDC if it's a basket, pyramid, whatever. I think it looks iffy. And like cheerislove8 said, judges would rather see girls then boys.

Exactly. Uniformity, uniformity, uniformity.

We do everything for a reason. We have "opposites" or mirrors (whichever you may call it), symmetrical formations, synced stunts/passes/tosses and uniforms themselves all because we want everything to look together and the same. Throwing a boy in the mix really throws that off.

 

[ztaprincess]

I think its tragic that some find it so hard to be a bit different. There is no secret that a lot of the rules need to change, and a lot of the judges could use some renewed thinking. Things change over time. Modern art would have flopped a hundred years ago, but it works today. It's called evolution. Compleatly natural. Get the boys up. This sport obviously needs a lot of fresh air.

No one is saying that you CAN'T put a boy up in the air. People are saying that it looks awkward and throws off the routine if you have 4 stunts with female flyers and a random stunt with a boy in the back corner. If your gym want to fly boys go right ahead, but most people are not going to like the way it looks.

Fresh air does not require doing things that will make the sport of cheer look like a joke. Sorry if that sounds harsh, but if it became the norm to have boys in stunts even more people would probably think cheer is a bigger joke then what they already do. Do things that are going to be a step in the positive direction not taking steps backwards in being respected.

 

[marissa.d]

I find it kinda tragic that people are so afraid of change. Its no secret that a lot of rules need to change, and a lot of judges need to get some new perspective. Come on. Modern art wouldn't have worked a hundred years ago, but it works pretty well today. It's called evolution. Compleatly natural. Get the boys up! This sport needs obviously some fresh air.

If a team decides to put up a boy, it is their risk
knowing that the judges DON'T like it.. why do it?
change will happen and is good but changing majority of the cheerworld's opinions and the judges opinions will not be changes just by putting a boy in the air
most coaches will not put a boy up, just because he wants to (even if he is better), because they are risking their team losing from a judges opinion on the overall look of the routine.

 

[Brenner]

I find it kinda tragic that people are so afraid of change. Its no secret that a lot of rules need to change, and a lot of judges need to get some new perspective. Come on. Modern art wouldn't have worked a hundred years ago, but it works pretty well today. It's called evolution. Compleatly natural.
Get the boys up! This sport needs obviously some fresh air.

Maybe you have something here.
Try opening a gym and recruiting male flyers and female bases and let us know how it works out for you.

 

[cheerbear2x]

Maybe you have something here.
Try opening a gym and recruiting male flyers and female bases and let us know how it works out for you.

EXACTLY! How would you like to lift up another guy, onetruparing,? Or girls- how would you like to base a guy? Didn't think so.

 

[FamousxMindset]

How do I do that?

Does your gym or any gym around you offer stunting classes or privates?