All-Star Only Seniors Can Expose Midriff???

[Coach Troy]

I un-shimmy this 10000000 X
This is as bad as what we have now.
I say no more power to the USASF they have already shown they abuse it

 

[ssccxnce]

How can there be a penalty if there is no standard? That's an honest question because I've seen that solution mentioned a few times in the last week or so.

You can't put a penalty on something when there is no rule about the length. It would be at the discretion of the EP, would you rather the rule change from competition to competition? I would be fine if the USASF made a rule that stated it can on be a certain number of inches from the waist band of the skirt, but the USASF would rather say hey we are going to limit the number of crop tops worn. They could easily take the college route and say the skirt can't be below the hip bones and the top has to be so many inches from the waist band, so if you don't like what they have come up with now make a proposal and send it in for the meeting.

the problem is saying it has to be x amount of inches doesnt work for everybody there are so many different body sizes that it can fit perfect on some but terribly on others i guess what im saying is there is no proper way to enforce this other then trust that gym owners have enough responsibility to do so and if somebody violates it talk to that gym directly not take it out on the whole of cheerleading

 

[Coach Troy]

the problem is saying it has to be x amount of inches doesnt work for everybody there are so many different body sizes that it can fit perfect on some but terribly on others i guess what im saying is there is no proper way to enforce this other then trust that gym owners have enough responsibility to do so and if somebody violates it talk to that gym directly not take it out on the whole of cheerleading

I love it when I hear common sense answers....

 

[thecheermoma]

I would just like to keep everyone's focus on the real problem here....

There is no problem with our "image" and there is no need for the USASF to dictate dress for the ALL programs. If they
(or the few people that insist on applying their standards to others) feel that a particular uniform is to short, provocative, glitzy, or whatever else they can come up with then that INDIVIDUAL program should be diciplined.

Furthermore most of you are missing the bigger argument that we are allowing too much UNCHECKED power to be acquired by the USASF along with an outdated and out of touch Executive Board. If they can mandate change without a vote by a majority of member gyms, coaches then this is just the beginning. crop tops, makeup, and bows today....whats next Shoes?? hairstyle?? Today its double fulls and bounding skills....tomorrow it could be basket tosses, stepping out of a punch front (which I would argue has injured more then its fair share), or jumps to back???

The point is that we cannot allow one organization to operate without membership checks and balances, and we should never allow the voices of a few dictate what should be decided by the majority. [/quote

 

[thecheermoma]

Not sure how my response ended up your original brilliant post, oops.
Anyway you are are 10000000% correct!

 

[ztaprincess]

the problem is saying it has to be x amount of inches doesnt work for everybody there are so many different body sizes that it can fit perfect on some but terribly on others i guess what im saying is there is no proper way to enforce this other then trust that gym owners have enough responsibility to do so and if somebody violates it talk to that gym directly not take it out on the whole of cheerleading

It works just fine for NCA college. Those teams wear crop tops that aren't so small that they are one body position short of exposing their chest.
In order to give penalties to gyms and make it fair there has to be a rule in place regarding uniforms. You can't put penalties on a rule that doesn't exist. So you either take away crop tops or put restrictions on the size/length of tops.

 

[Coach Troy]

No you leave everything alone and you make the complainers file a formal request and then a committee reviews to see if it is valid, then you deal with that particular gym.

And the standard is what I stated before the original design had the intention of covering all appropriate body parts and is functional for the sport of allstar cheer

 

[ssccxnce]

It works just fine for NCA college. Those teams wear crop tops that aren't so small that they are one body position short of exposing their chest.
In order to give penalties to gyms and make it fair there has to be a rule in place regarding uniforms. You can't put penalties on a rule that doesn't exist. So you either take away crop tops or put restrictions on the size/length of tops.

understandable, heres my take on this (may not actually relate to what your saying but try to follow anyways lol) if the USASF is having such a big problem they should take it up with the uniform companies (considering they are part of them technically anyways) uniforms should be properly fitted to the athlete, seamstress coming in and measuring each girl to ensure a proper fit because the whole heres a uni tell me how it fits and how much you want off doesnt work how is one to know that it will actually fit and how it will look i cannot tell you how many uniforms i have had that have no fit me because of this, my best fitting uniform was my second year of cheerleading when one of the parents who was a dance and skating costume designer came in fitted us twice and made them all not only were those uniforms properly fitted they were cheaper too i guess the thing is gyms do not always know how big or small something should fit all they really know is that they like how nice it looks and how they feel it represents their gym and in regards to ruling like its been stated before designs should be approved in size OR their should be a rule stating that uniforms should not expose specifics areas or blah blah blah instead of saying this type uni for this level/age and this size for this covered by that

#artisticfreedomanyone?

 

[coachbd]

understandable, heres my take on this (may not actually relate to what your saying but try to follow anyways lol) if the USASF is having such a big problem they should take it up with the uniform companies (considering they are part of them technically anyways) uniforms should be properly fitted to the athlete, seamstress coming in and measuring each girl to ensure a proper fit because the whole heres a uni tell me how it fits and how much you want off doesnt work how is one to know that it will actually fit and how it will look i cannot tell you how many uniforms i have had that have no fit me because of this, my best fitting uniform was my second year of cheerleading when one of the parents who was a dance and skating costume designer came in fitted us twice and made them all not only were those uniforms properly fitted they were cheaper too i guess the thing is gyms do not always know how big or small something should fit all they really know is that they like how nice it looks and how they feel it represents their gym and in regards to ruling like its been stated before designs should be approved in size OR their should be a rule stating that uniforms should not expose specifics areas or blah blah blah instead of saying this type uni for this level/age and this size for this covered by that

#artisticfreedomanyone?

All the uniforms for my teams are custom made to their measurements - and I have to get something like 12 different measurements over their entire body off them - meaning when they arrive they fit perfectly! Downside to this is it is a very time-consuming process :S Had 50 athletes to measure this year and it took almost an entire training each squad. It still only costs $140 per female uniform though (and $100 per male) - maybe it is cheaper in Aus though? (the uniform costs some people are mentioning here seem exorbitant! $300+??)

I think half-tops can be done in a flattering way - if you can see in my dp my teams have midriff showing but the skirt sits in a "V" just below the belly-button and the top comes down in an upside-down-V an inch or so below the bra - so they don't show too much skin and the tops are still athletic and flattering for the bigger girls.

I do see though that it would be harder to implement more specific guidelines (such as others have mentioned - gaining approval of uniform beforehand etc, specific length/style requirements) so perhaps one of the reasons the USASF implemented this blanket rule was because it was easier than the alternatives?

 

[ssccxnce]

All the uniforms for my teams are custom made to their measurements - and I have to get something like 12 different measurements over their entire body off them - meaning when they arrive they fit perfectly! Downside to this is it is a very time-consuming process :S Had 50 athletes to measure this year and it took almost an entire training each squad. It still only costs $140 per female uniform though (and $100 per male) - maybe it is cheaper in Aus though? (the uniform costs some people are mentioning here seem exorbitant! $300+??)

I think half-tops can be done in a flattering way - if you can see in my dp my teams have midriff showing but the skirt sits in a "V" just below the belly-button and the top comes down in an upside-down-V an inch or so below the bra - so they don't show too much skin and the tops are still athletic and flattering for the bigger girls.

I do see though that it would be harder to implement more specific guidelines (such as others have mentioned - gaining approval of uniform beforehand etc, specific length/style requirements) so perhaps one of the reasons the USASF implemented this blanket rule was because it was easier than the alternatives?

wow, thats awesome, and i can assure you that it is definitely cheaper in Australia rather then the US the prices they ask for uniforms are ridiculous the two years that i lived there i wore one uniform and it cost 425.00 (and that was just the uni i still had to pay for bow, shoes, makeup and warm ups) then i come back to canada buy a new uni and pay 200.00 now im sure not all gym unis are this much but it is ridiculous how much uniform companies are asking for nowadays

 

[coachbd]

wow, thats awesome, and i can assure you that it is definitely cheaper in Australia rather then the US the prices they ask for uniforms are ridiculous the two years that i lived there i wore one uniform and it cost 425.00 (and that was just the uni i still had to pay for bow, shoes, makeup and warm ups) then i come back to canada buy a new uni and pay 200.00 now im sure not all gym unis are this much but it is ridiculous how much uniform companies are asking for nowadays

Ok, wow, $425 is just insane! I mean, given, our uniforms are not the fancy sublimated ones or anything, but they are still custom-made with some really nice fabrics. Actually, funny thing is our $140 ones are the most expensive ones you can buy! (at least from this company who makes them - who makes, I would say, the majority of the uniforms over here). I recently charged my girls and guys from between $200 - $300 for the entire year's uniform costs - uniform, bow, team T-shirt and jacket, cheer shoes and makeup (and half of that I ordered from the States!) :P

 

[ssccxnce]

Ok, wow, $425 is just insane! I mean, given, our uniforms are not the fancy sublimated ones or anything, but they are still custom-made with some really nice fabrics. Actually, funny thing is our $140 ones are the most expensive ones you can buy! (at least from this company who makes them - who makes, I would say, the majority of the uniforms over here). I recently charged my girls and guys from between $200 - $300 for the entire year's uniform costs - uniform, bow, team T-shirt and jacket, cheer shoes and makeup (and half of that I ordered from the States!) :p

:| goodness i wish the gyms i went to had enoughs brains in them to actually look for decent deals lol (not knocking love every gym ive been with but holy do they not care about expenses)

 

[coachbd]

Also, the team I used to cheer for used to all have full-tops, then a few years ago my Senior 5 team (and only our team) got "special" new uniforms with half-tops (that was a pretty new/cool thing for us back then! Haha). Eventually though the entire gym went to this uniform with the half-top, and the younger girls just wore a black undertop thing under it (can't remember what it's called!) - this meant they still had the same uniform but it was more covered. It looked totally fine, and then if they were a cross-over or moved to a more Senior team (only our more Senior teams wore it properly as a half-top) all you had to do was take off the black under-cover and voila! - good as new :) Perhaps if gyms were interested in saving costs they could do something like that?

(I know it is not the key issue in dispute here (our "right" to choose what we want etc.) - but it could be a possible solution if gyms were willing!)

 

[coachbd]

:| goodness i wish the gyms i went to had enoughs brains in them to actually look for decent deals lol (not knocking love every gym ive been with but holy do they not care about expenses)

Yeah I think part of that is because they think (and maybe it is true in a lot of instances) that parents will just pay whatever they are told to pay because it is for their children, and that is just "the way it is"/"what is costs".

In my instance, since I run a university program (and really, over here, that means it is run just like an "all-star" program but it is affiliated with a university - we don't cheer for our Uni (at games/sideline etc.), we only compete (and only at all-star comps - we have no comps strictly for HS/Uni (aka. college) that I know of) and there are no scholarships given by the Uni etc., it's run like an all-star program (but without the generally better facilities and coaches) - I need to keep the costs to an absolute minimum otherwise I will literally have no-one joining. Since everyone is (to use the popular phrase over here) "poor uni students" and their parents (normally) don't pay for their cheer - it is difficult for me to get people involved because once I say the costs are $300 for uniform and $300 tuition (and that's for the entire year!) they don't see how it is super cheap they just see it as a prohibitive cost. I often wish I ran a program for younger kids because I think maybe it would be much easier (paying on time, not complaining about cost, even just committment etc.)?

Basically what I am saying though is that I think you can definitely keep the costs lower than what some all-star programs charge while still running a successsful business (although the above cost examples, I will admit, are not this model - but it is possible) - at least definitely in regards to uniform costs. If you're not making a profit from them (I'm not sure if people do this?) then I would think it would be in your interest to keep the costs as low as you can (while still having a good uniform)?

 

[auscheerflyer]

Yeah I think part of that is because they think (and maybe it is true in a lot of instances) that parents will just pay whatever they are told to pay because it is for their children, and that is just "the way it is"/"what is costs".

In my instance, since I run a university program (and really, over here, that means it is run just like an "all-star" program but it is affiliated with a university - we don't cheer for our Uni (at games/sideline etc.), we only compete (and only at all-star comps - we have no comps strictly for HS/Uni (aka. college) that I know of) and there are no scholarships given by the Uni etc., it's run like an all-star program (but without the generally better facilities and coaches) - I need to keep the costs to an absolute minimum otherwise I will literally have no-one joining. Since everyone is (to use the popular phrase over here) "poor uni students" and their parents (normally) don't pay for their cheer - it is difficult for me to get people involved because once I say the costs are $300 for uniform and $300 tuition (and that's for the entire year!) they don't see how it is super cheap they just see it as a prohibitive cost. I often wish I ran a program for younger kids because I think maybe it would be much easier (paying on time, not complaining about cost, even just committment etc.)?

Basically what I am saying though is that I think you can definitely keep the costs lower than what some all-star programs charge while still running a successsful business (although the above cost examples, I will admit, are not this model - but it is possible) - at least definitely in regards to uniform costs. If you're not making a profit from them (I'm not sure if people do this?) then I would think it would be in your interest to keep the costs as low as you can (while still having a good uniform)?

Which uni team do you coach? Because the uni team I am on costs $300 each term not $300 for the whole year!! I am struggling so much with fees and haven't even bought my new shoes or uniform yet..