All-Star Only Seniors Can Expose Midriff???

[munchkinmom]

Stayed out of this a while, and was able to realize: those who are fighting for the gyms' right to wear a half top are really arguing USASF's side on this. You feel your gym has the right to choose what your kids wear when representing your gym. You're right. You do. At your events. Practice, class, in-house exhibitions, and even for those gyms that produce their own invitational-style comps. You're telling parents, you don't like what we wear - go elsewhere. This is true at for and non profit gyms, either way it is still up to the owners/board of directors. Now the USASF has grabbed their rights. They are not saying that you cannot choose the clothing at your gym, they're just saying if you want to show up at their event you wear what they want. They are saying, you don't like what we wear - go elsewhere. Heck, they aren't even telling you that you can't come to worlds if you want to wear half tops. Your little ones can go to EP's who have no image guidelines, and your senior world teams can still run the existing road to worlds without them. Or you could start your own NGB. USA Children's Half Top All Star Federation. It could work. Remove the age minimum off senior teams including Worlds teams, hold your own Worlds in California, and recreate the 14+ Open division. Many people are upset about those various issues, maybe you could get their business. After all, for profit or not, (even in government) it's all about money in this country. The majority does not get what they want (Bush 2004 anyone?); those in power decide what they feel people need, then people decide who best represents what they want to give their money to.

 

[Mom2Cheergirls]

I am confident that if put to a vote that this would never pass. This is why the usasf and the board of directors took this route.

For now the minority opinion rules, but that is only due to reactionary decision by an out of touch B.O.D. I for one will continue to try and reverse this poorly thought out "guideline".

You know you keep saying those okay with this rule is the minority. Based on this forum board, USASF Facebook I would say you may be the minority. There are people who like full tops, people who don't mind what top they wear, people who have crop tops and would like to keep them but get why USASF went to this measure. Then their is the minority -- who have clearly said on this board that there should be no limit and it infringes on their business and their right to dress their kids however they please.

I have debated with you and watched you argue points that are just absurd. Like that the USASF has no role in doing this (which I refuted when I pulled out their mission statement). USASF is governing body that has elected committee representatives that were a part of this decision -- have you run for such position, have you voted? if not then perhaps that is something you should look at doing -- but until then quit saying they have no right to do this, because it just shows that you are ignorant as to how governing bodies with representative components work. You and your gym make a consumer choice to be involved with USASF sanctioned events -- take your cheerleaders and money and use your consumer choice to go somewhere else -- the same argument you have said to anyone is okay with this rule.

 

[ztaprincess]

If they are smart they will join the fight and get this silly image thing kicked.....!!! A lot will happen in three years so don't count your full tips till thier hatched :)

You can't even make a complete and valid argument as to why crop tops need to stay here on the fierceboard so I hope if you plan on taking this down that you work on that argument a bit. A bigger argument then "you don't have the right to take away our crop tops" is one that probably won't get you far. Goodluck. While you are at it you should stand up and fight that the US Supreme Court should no longer be able to make their decisions on what is constitutional unless they take a vote from the American people, also that US voters should be electing these justices.
Even if the USASF took a vote, the way it is they don't have to go with the way the majority votes. They get the final decision and if they feel it is necessary then they will keep this rule.

 

[njallday]

this thread isn't dead yet? :rolleyes:

In the paragraphs and pages I have just read "supporting" crop tops, not one point was valid. "it's my choice," "no one can tell me what to do," and "I can do what I want" are not valid reasons to keep crop tops. sorry.

The only valid reason would be safety for COED stunting, and that isn't an issue here. With the new rules you are allowed an inch limit on crop tops. How many inches are louisville's crop tops? 4 or 5? (kentucky doesn't even have a crop top.) and they can do rewinds, tosses, and crazy pyramids. and guess what?! their bases have no problems gripping their waists. Since the distinction of coed on lower levels was removed, true coed stunting will not be necessary (and it shouldn't on someone so young), so there is no reason for juniors, youth, mini, tiny to need a crop top. (However, I do agree that there should be no overlap through the levels.)

If you're mad your "rights" have just been taken away, please go join another sport. And have fun being told what to wear. because you will. and they will be much stricter about it.

 

[SparkleSpankies]

If you're mad your "rights" have just been taken away, please go join another sport. And have fun being told what to wear. because you will. and they will be much stricter about it.

And on that note... AMEN

 

[Coach Troy]

Stayed out of this a while, and was able to realize: those who are fighting for the gyms' right to wear a half top are really arguing USASF's side on this. You feel your gym has the right to choose what your kids wear when representing your gym. You're right. You do. At your events. Practice, class, in-house exhibitions, and even for those gyms that produce their own invitational-style comps. You're telling parents, you don't like what we wear - go elsewhere. This is true at for and non profit gyms, either way it is still up to the owners/board of directors. Now the USASF has grabbed their rights. They are not saying that you cannot choose the clothing at your gym, they're just saying if you want to show up at their event you wear what they want. They are saying, you don't like what we wear - go elsewhere. Heck, they aren't even telling you that you can't come to worlds if you want to wear half tops. Your little ones can go to EP's who have no image guidelines, and your senior world teams can still run the existing road to worlds without them. Or you could start your own NGB. USA Children's Half Top All Star Federation. It could work. Remove the age minimum off senior teams including Worlds teams, hold your own Worlds in California, and recreate the 14+ Open division. Many people are upset about those various issues, maybe you could get their business. After all, for profit or not, (even in government) it's all about money in this country. The majority does not get what they want (Bush 2004 anyone?); those in power decide what they feel people need, then people decide who best represents what they want to give their money to.

You make some very good points however the USASF only hosts one event that is Worlds. However you are right individual event producers could act in this way.

 

[Coach Troy]

You know you keep saying those okay with this rule is the minority. Based on this forum board, USASF Facebook I would say you may be the minority. There are people who like full tops, people who don't mind what top they wear, people who have crop tops and would like to keep them but get why USASF went to this measure. Then their is the minority -- who have clearly said on this board that there should be no limit and it infringes on their business and their right to dress their kids however they please.

I have debated with you and watched you argue points that are just absurd. Like that the USASF has no role in doing this (which I refuted when I pulled out their mission statement). USASF is governing body that has elected committee representatives that were a part of this decision -- have you run for such position, have you voted? if not then perhaps that is something you should look at doing -- but until then quit saying they have no right to do this, because it just shows that you are ignorant as to how governing bodies with representative components work. You and your gym make a consumer choice to be involved with USASF sanctioned events -- take your cheerleaders and money and use your consumer choice to go somewhere else -- the same argument you have said to anyone is okay with this rule.

Then lets put it to a vote. That way no one has anything to complain about. If as an industry we decide this is what is best then we can all move forward together.

I have not ever been nominated for a position but have voted, attended NACCC meetings, USASF regional meetings and have voted every time there has been one.

I am sorry that my "absurd" arguments are making you so angry.

 

[munchkinmom]

You make some very good points however the USASF only hosts one event that is Worlds. However you are right individual event producers could act in this way.

Yes, it is the only one they host; however, they sanction individual events with member EPs. Much like any national brand, they want to control what images and activities they are affiliated with so as not to damage the public perception of their brand. If you want permission to advertise that your business sells a certain soft drink let's say, expect the soft drink company to have a laundry list of restrictions on aspects of your business's operation, as well as how their product is displayed and marketed. Actually, take a look for yourself: Coca-Cola - Sustainability - Respecting People - Suppliers - Supplier Contract Policies

For USASF, the application for EPs includes:
"is in agreement with (1) the mission of the USASF, (2) following the USASF Cheer and or
Dance Safety Rules and Age Grids at all events, (3) following USASF Sanctioning Standards at all USASF Sanctioned events,

(4) the terms and conditions of the Membership Tiers and the attached USASF Company Member Agreement"
in regards to (3) "c. USASFmembership rules, guidelines and policies must be followed." is one of the points. If an EP wants to be associated with USASF, they take this package.

I would imagine if a brand-type company wanted to host independent events, they could have different subsidiaries, some USASF Members, some not. The non member subsidiary company would benefit from the brand affiliation, but be unburdened by USASF decisions.

 

[kristenthegreat]

Actually, some higher authority tells you what to do every day. It's called the law. And if you're religious, your various religious entities, but that's another thing. ;)

The government makes rules and regulations for the safety of your child all the time, actually. To step in for when a few bad parents are bad and can't make appropriate decisions. Quite frankly, I think the horrendously overworked/underpaid social services has more important things to do than worry about crop tops, but modesty laws are in place for a reason. You can appeal these laws all you like (and some, quite frankly, you should)..but some of this insistence in your 'right to wear crop tops' is ridiculous. I don't believe in a free-for-all, and I disagree with how this measure was pushed through (and I think some tidbits of it are ridiculous), but I'm not completely unhappy with it. Things HAVE gotten out-of-hand. We SHOULDN'T have gotten to this point, but we did. We wouldn't have needed this rule if people didn't think there was something that needed enforcing.

 

[Mom2Cheergirls]

Then lets put it to a vote. That way no one has anything to complain about. If as an industry we decide this is what is best then we can all move forward together.

I have not ever been nominated for a position but have voted, attended NACCC meetings, USASF regional meetings and have voted every time there has been one.

I am sorry that my "absurd" arguments are making you so angry.

Okay you need to go take a class on how governing bodies work -- because clearly you don't get it. Doesn't get me angry just makes me shake my head that an adult running a business doesn't understand governing bodies basic principles. You are not getting your way so instead your screaming "no fair!"
Let's simplify: Do you mean to tell me that you have your entire gym vote on every uniform, the practice times, what comps you go to so you can all move together? If they don't like the choices you make in governing your gym they can go elsewhere with their money -- if you don't like what the USASF is doing then go elsewhere -- want to go to USASF Worlds then play by their rules... I think there are enough gyms opening that if you choose to leave over your intense need for your cheerleaders to wear crop tops they can get by without your money, just as you can get by at your gym with parents who don;t like the choices you make at your gym.

 

[XtremeWpg]

Here's the thing. Cheerleading, under the USASF new guidelines for unis or having none at all...have a TON of leeway on what they can and cannot wear. I challenge anyone to find another sport that freely could design any uniform they choose in whatever style, colour, metallic, glitter, mesh, cut out, animal print, reversible, choker, knee socks, bow they want. Please don't say figure skating. Because you'd be wrong. They have restrictions on how much skin can show and what areas need to be covered by flesh coloured fabric. They have skirt length restrictions etc.

Even if this full top thing sticks, you still have so much that can be done. Every sport has a standardized look, and the ones that don’t, do have rules.

And no. It's certainly no ones "right" to wear a crop top. If you really think it is, perhaps you should research the difference between "rights" and "wants".

 

[omgitssydthekid]

My two cents.

I have worn four different all star uniforms. The first two were full tops (same gym, different uniforms) and were easily the most uncomfortable uniforms I've ever worn. I felt so uncomfortable in them because the part covering my stomach never seemed to fit right on me ( it was way too big) and would always come up and get at messed up when I was tumbling or flying. The two crop tops I've worn (different gyms) were both very classy uniforms. They had shoulder cut outs and we did/do have to wear special bras with them. One was a halter bra and the other one was a one shoulder bra. I have yet to see a wardrobe malfunction due to either of these uniforms, and both of which are Varsity. And neither of these uniforms look inappropriate on any of the athletes that I've seen wearing them.

In my opinion, gyms should continue to get crop tops for the whole program but have the tiny/mini/youth/junior kids wear a leotard under their uniform to keep them covered and still abide by the rules. That way, when kids move up in age divisions and have to change uniforms they do not have to buy a brand new uniform.

 

[ssccxnce]

lol i swear this is the last thing im adding to this thread because there is too much of a clash between opposing sides and really nobodys going to win lol but i thought this was rather funny i found it on tumblr

 

[debbie]

Okay you need to go take a class on how governing bodies work -- because clearly you don't get it. Doesn't get me angry just makes me shake my head that an adult running a business doesn't understand governing bodies basic principles. You are not getting your way so instead your screaming "no fair!"
Let's simplify: Do you mean to tell me that you have your entire gym vote on every uniform, the practice times, what comps you go to so you can all move together? If they don't like the choices you make in governing your gym they can go elsewhere with their money -- if you don't like what the USASF is doing then go elsewhere -- want to go to USASF Worlds then play by their rules... I think there are enough gyms opening that if you choose to leave over your intense need for your cheerleaders to wear crop tops they can get by without your money, just as you can get by at your gym with parents who don;t like the choices you make at your gym.

I totally agree with your point "if you dont like it dont go to Worlds". I agree to disagree with your point on the governing body because they are NOT a governing body that was elected by the clubs they were started by members of a PROFIT company who started the non profit usasf. Also lets not pretend they make decisions on whats in the best interest of "cheer" as long as the overwhelming majority of the members have a conflict of interest (looking out for whats best for varsity) every decision they make will be questioned. So how do we look at rules they make? Is it what is best for cheer or whats best for varsity? I think its a fair question to ask.

 

[Mom2Cheergirls]

lol i swear this is the last thing im adding to this thread because there is too much of a clash between opposing sides and really nobodys going to win lol but i thought this was rather funny i found it on tumblr

Actually it is kind of funny --- and she has more fabric on than 2 of some uniforms :)