All-Star Please Tell Me I Am Wrong

[ScottyB]

*sighhhh* we all seem to be forgetting that USASF wants to make money. IASF wants to make money. Vendors & Gyms want to make money. Disney wants to make money. Everyone wants an extra buck in their pockets.

Adding more divisions & changing existing rules (i.e. full length uniform tops) to "worlds" (if we can/should even call it that) does two things:

1. Bring more kids into the sport (i.e. Suzy who has joint injuries and cannot tumble. or Jenny who's parents/religion/personal beliefs have kept her from joining the sport because of modesty reasons)
   
   
2. Makes everybody more money. How much does it cost to "go to worlds"? I'm sure someone has done the math on here before. Factors to consider: Paying for training on a 'worlds team', Paying for everyday practice wear, paying entry fees for [multiple] bid competitions., paying to travel to [multiple] bid competitions, paying hotels & airfare, paying for "xyz competition practice wear", and then actually paying for worlds (park hoppers, hotel, food, tickets, souvenirs, more practice clothes...) like, OMG the list could go on, and on.

If you break it down and 'look where your money is going' NO KIDDING it is of the best interest for the governing bodies to offer these divisions. They cash in on it. Within driving distance from where I live - I know of over 6 NT teams that have sprung up overnight - and they are actively advertising "NEW WORLDS TEAM" - don't fool ourselves. Gyms are cashing in too - whether they agree or not. The demand is there and it is a smart business decision.

Most division expansion and changes to the major comps (aka ones held at Disney) are to encourage more attendance. Varsity is on the hook with disney to increase attendance at all events over the next 17 years..

 

[catlady]

If that's the reasoning, there would just be an outright ban on tumbling.

Don't kid yourself into thinking that this is some sort of safety-driven push.

If they wanted to limit the number of concussions, they'd start by banning double downs. Just like they did in school cheer. School cheer gets rid of double downs and the number of concussions instantly fell dramatically.

If they wanted to get rid of ACL,MCL, etc, they'd get rid of tumbling doubles. I'd be willing to bet those numbers went down when tumbling doubles were done away with at the high school and college level.

The difficulty levels would be more streamlined (this I actually believe is in the works, as I have seen some of the changes in the past few years as moving things a little closer together).

They would get rid of what I call the "all star cheater" techniques on a lot of stunt skills. This new trend of having kids land in cradles with their arms pinned to their sides would be banned. Any version of a full up that is done with the bases merry-go-round walking under a stunt would be banned. These things all increase the risk by allowing kids to do pseudo-skills as a top or a base and feel like their training is adequate when it's really fallen way short.

Lol, don't kid yourself. Concussions weren't a new thing, it just took a little more information to start convincing parents they weren't just something you could sit out for a few minutes and all would be okay. In the past seven years, I have watched WINNING L5 teams go from having some layouts, fulls and a hand full of doubles, to full team doubles, majority team standing fulls and back and forth elite passes. They aren't going to outright ban tumbling right now, but it is smart to prepare and adapt for possible new medical findings.

Medical information is just now catching up with the last 10-15 years of incredibly intense training in youth sports. The wear, tear and recurring injuries on joints is proving to have lasting quality of life consequences. As the last line in that article I posted said, "“But it’s a slow process. Not everything is going to happen overnight. It’s a culture change.”

ADM influencing change in youth football

 

[OldskoolKYcheercoach]

Lol, don't kid yourself. Concussions weren't a new thing, it just took a little more information to start convincing parents they weren't just something you could sit out for a few minutes and all would be okay. In the past seven years, I have watched WINNING L5 teams go from having some layouts, fulls and a hand full of doubles, to full team doubles, majority team standing fulls and back and forth elite passes. They aren't going to outright ban tumbling right now, but it is smart to prepare and adapt for possible new medical findings.

Medical information is just now catching up with the last 10-15 years of incredibly intense training in youth sports. The wear, tear and recurring injuries on joints is proving to have lasting quality of life consequences. As the last line in that article I posted said, "“But it’s a slow process. Not everything is going to happen overnight. It’s a culture change.”

ADM influencing change in youth football

I understand the medical implications, probably more so than most. I also fight the battle with parents and coaches who don’t get it. I hold two board certifications, one in general emergency care, and another specific to trauma. This includes prevention. I am a published author, and I lecture on these topics...including head injuries.

NT is not about injury prevention. It’s never been about injury prevention. It’s about laundering more money from the general population.

 

[dat.jpp]

I understand the medical implications, probably more so than most. I also fight the battle with parents and coaches who don’t get it. I hold two board certifications, one in general emergency care, and another specific to trauma. This includes prevention. I am a published author, and I lecture on these topics...including head injuries.

NT is not about injury prevention. It’s never been about injury prevention. It’s about laundering more money from the general population.

I feel like stunting would cause alot more injuries rather then tumbling.

 

[catlady]

I understand the medical implications, probably more so than most. I also fight the battle with parents and coaches who don’t get it. I hold two board certifications, one in general emergency care, and another specific to trauma. This includes prevention. I am a published author, and I lecture on these topics...including head injuries.

NT is not about injury prevention. It’s never been about injury prevention. It’s about laundering more money from the general population.

The money part is obvious, I can't handle it when people say "it's about the money", that is literally why businesses exist and people go to work. Lawd have mercy, YES it is about the money, has been and always will be about the money! So, now that the obvious is out of the way, you have to look at what can effect the money. If people start removing their kids because of repeat injuries, threat of surgery, quality of life down the road, $4,000 deductibles, concussions, etc. then add 5.0 because YES it is about the money and they don't want to be in the same position as youth football with declining numbers and LESS money. The governing body of football didn't do anything when the studies started coming out about concussions, good or bad plan? It's not necessarily cheer as we know it will change, it's just adding options that can protect your business and YES add money.

 

[SL&AM]

I have to agree...my Cp does not have her double, and is on a 5R. She is a natural athlete, but getting non-restricted 5 tumbling separates the wheat from the chaff so to speak. She is going to actually have to put the work and time to get those skills if she wants to go to Worlds. She was briefly excited about the NT division, but my husband and I told her we weren’t footing the bill for a year on a NT team just to go to Worlds. She has no physical issues that would prevent her from getting a double. We refuse to reward a lack of work ethic on her part. I told her we love her and support her even if she never gets her double and stays R5, but not letting her take the easy way out to get to Worlds.

I give you major snaps for this approach and I wish more people felt this way.

I understand that original intent of NT and that intent is all fine and dandy (for areas of the world who don't have our resources), BUT...and I'll say it again and again, this is just going to become another US/Canada/Australia/Sweden dominated division and will do little to nothing to help those it was 'intended' to help.

 

[njallday]

USASF/Varsity will continue to add divisions (NT/Open and International Summit) until they have a profit inducing event in their precious new arena every day from the kick off of ICU through the end of D2 Summit. Empty arenas don't pay for themselves.

 

[Keep_Believing]

Agree but aren't they already over flowing at summit! LOL

 

[alpaca]

A little off-topic but related because it has to do with safety. Out of curiosity : how many of your CP's have had baseline concussion testing? CP's school does it for everyone, not just student-athletes.

 

[SL&AM]

A little off-topic but related because it has to do with safety. Out of curiosity : how many of your CP's have had baseline concussion testing? CP's school does it for everyone, not just student-athletes.

We had a referral for one when oldest was 7 years old. We traveled to a bigger city about an hour and a half away to the Children's hospital because their neurology department did them. We went to her Ped, explained why I wanted it done and insurance covered it.

 

[CheerBank]

A little off-topic but related because it has to do with safety. Out of curiosity : how many of your CP's have had baseline concussion testing? CP's school does it for everyone, not just student-athletes.

Only student athletes at our HS.

 

[omgitssydthekid]

Can't your coaches just tell the EP's/judges to not judge that one individual who is injured?

No. It doesn’t work this way. Judges don’t just overlook an athlete that is “injured” because a coach tells them to. And frankly, it shouldn’t.


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[emo_wifey]

A little off-topic but related because it has to do with safety. Out of curiosity : how many of your CP's have had baseline concussion testing? CP's school does it for everyone, not just student-athletes.

We were going to have it done at CP's ped, they didn't have the right equipment to run the software for the under 10 group yet. I need to contact them again about it.

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[quitthedrama]

No disrespect, but I have to laugh at the defense of adding level 5 NT as preventing injuries or helping better quality teams get to worlds. I have already heard of multiple gyms who have no business fielding a safe and competitive level 4 team based on current stunt ability announcing they are fielding a NT Worlds team. At least with tumbling the athlete is only capable of hurting themselves - now entire stunt groups are at greater risk for injury. I predict we are about to see some extremely scary, unprepared and poorly coached NT teams this season. If preventing injuries was a true reason, then level 5 wouldn't be the place where they would introduce this division.....

 

[coacha]

A little off-topic but related because it has to do with safety. Out of curiosity : how many of your CP's have had baseline concussion testing? CP's school does it for everyone, not just student-athletes.

I coach high school, so all of my athletes have it, but our school only does those involved in school athletics. I wonder if they would baseline a student who isn’t if asked. Especially since they are already set up to do it.