All-Star Slowing Progression?

[oncecoolcoachnowmom]

The worst thing is that too many coaches interpret an athlete's struggle with tumbling as apathy/not wanting it badly enough. Sad.

Oh yes.

As much as I comment on parents saying the above things I've mentioned, I've heard the same from coaches/professionals.

"You must WANT to be replaced because you're still not throwing it."

"Suzie get ready to replace Becky, she must not want to be on Junior 4 anymore."

"Jenny's coming for your spot Suzie! (with replacement Jenny sitting there) You'd better start throwing it!"

"Either throw it or get off my floor because I'm done and I'm over you."

Is there a point as a coach when you may SERIOUSLY need to move on with a replacement pass/kid if you compete in 3 weeks and Suzy is blocked on her BHS? Maybe. But there is really no need to antagonize a kid over it. There's a more diplomatic way to address it.

Not to mention that it's a great way to get kids to quit your program.

 

[FlexyTumblerMom]

I knew I had been a terrible Susie's Mom about something and I just remembered what it was! When CP did gymnastics she had a block about doing a (spotted) pullover on the bar. She would not go upside down. Every time a coach tried to make her do it, she freaked and kicked her legs. I was going nuts. "What is the problem, the coach is holding you, you won't fall, even your little sister can do it... I'll by you a new Lalaloopsy doll if you do it!"

She finally did it because a coach more or less forced her to and I was happy and bought her the toy. I think she kept doing it after that. But I realize now I could have put her off sport altogether. Phew... I did not feel happy with myself and I've not been acting like that since.

Gymnastics brings out the SM in people cause often you will have kids that are great and 2 or 3 events but struggle on 1 event - so that 1 event truly does "hold them back". CP and I BOTH hated all that pressure to keep up on the weak event just so you are able to compete your good stuff in everything else - you'd almost prefer to just be worse on everything equally than really good on some things but not others. It will turn into almost anyone into a SM ;).

 

[Official OWECheer]

Oh yes.

As much as I comment on parents saying the above things I've mentioned, I've heard the same from coaches/professionals.

"You must WANT to be replaced because you're still not throwing it."

"Suzie get ready to replace Becky, she must not want to be on Junior 4 anymore."

"Jenny's coming for your spot Suzie! (with replacement Jenny sitting there) You'd better start throwing it!"

"Either throw it or get off my floor because I'm done and I'm over you."

Is there a point as a coach when you may SERIOUSLY need to move on with a replacement pass/kid if you compete in 3 weeks and Suzy is blocked on her BHS? Maybe. But there is really no need to antagonize a kid over it. There's a more diplomatic way to address it.

Not to mention that it's a great way to get kids to quit your program.

Plus, kids come to think that that is acceptable behavior from a coach (I know I used to think it was, and I vow I will never scare my kids like that).

 

[sportygal2012]

You know @Official OWECheer, that is the one thing I mentioned a lot on this message board... I noticed that many cheer coaches are not teaching this skill to the cheerleaders and I wondered if it may contribute to many of the mental blocks that cheerleaders are experiencing. I know when my daughter was learning how to tumble, the gymnastic coaches taught the athletes ways to safely fall out and pull out of tumbling skills, which most involved tucking in the heads to the chest and round out the back and/or making the body go into a ball to protect the head and neck areas... I see so many cheerleaders just crashing, looking like crash dummies, there is no attempt to protect vital areas like the head and neck...

PS: I know my daughter's private instructor comes from the gymnastics background and he mentioned to me, he wanted to teach this skill, but many of the parents who are paying him for privates do not want him to use instructional time for this vital lesson...That may be the reason why gymnast practice so many more hours too,,, because I remember when my daughter was taking gymnastics they will spend the first 30 minutes working on something they call form and technique and everybody had to point their toes the same, correct hand movements and it included preventative tumbling too...

Yes to everything you said! I used to be a gymnast and one of the first things they taught us when learning a new skill was how to "fall" (most of them are rolls) out of it. We used to roll our eyes every time we would learn a new skill on beam,vault, bars, or floor and our coach would start off with "If you happen to ____ then you need to _____ so you don't kill yourself" (lol not exactly what he said but my summary). Now, I'm so thankful for it because I'm never nervous about something going wrong and landing on my head.

 

[Pebbles49]

Yes to everything you said! I used to be a gymnast and one of the first things they taught us when learning a new skill was how to "fall" (most of them are rolls) out of it. We used to roll our eyes every time we would learn a new skill on beam,vault, bars, or floor and our coach would start off with "If you happen to ____ then you need to _____ so you don't kill yourself" (lol not exactly what he said but my summary). Now, I'm so thankful for it because I'm never nervous about something going wrong and landing on my head.

Yes, I agree with everything you said, especially the ending... I know at an early age because gymnasts received this training they tend to have better body awareness than cheerleaders, who have not received the training... I know my daughter's cheerleading private and team coaches will all tell me about how my daughter has great body awareness, like a cat... She says that because of her prior training, she is not afraid to attempt new skills and her private instructor always starts off with the same line too and he knows that I know it is important, so in her privates, her coach may take 5 or 10 minutes demonstrating and discussing technique and form...

Seriously, I know they offer Jump, Flight, Tumbling and Stunting classes... I wondered if they offer a workshop or clinics on tumbling form and technique (which will teach safely falling and pulling out of tumbling skills) will anyone sign-up or cheerleaders would not think it was important enough skills to learn...Better yet, add as part of the Mental Block Clinics they offer at many of the cheer gyms...

 

[Keep_Believing]

Our gym incorporates teaching safety and safely falling and pulling out of tumbling skills in their tumble classes. In addition they have safety week when the classes spend the whole week focused just on safety (includes tumbling safety and overall general safety).

 

[NerdMobile]

I think CPs gym might like me to be a little more pushy. They are always coming out to me and trying to get me to be excited about whatever it is she is doing- and inside I AM. My daughter is so very hard on herself about every aspect of her life, such a perfectionist, I don't want anything I say/do to ever let her think there is pressure from me. Her current coaches spend a ton of time on technique and this suits her perfectionist nature. You always hear a lot of positive critiques- ways to improve but never really words that cut you down so I feel ok about just letting them lead the process. From my own observation, while they will certainly move a child to develop new skills, they celebrate whatever the child is doing and make it the best possible. All you've got is a front roll? Well those coaches will help you make it the most beautiful and perfect front roll ever. The confidence they build in the kids pays off as they progress to more difficult skills. I think it also helps the majority of the parents not push their kids too hard (or if they do it is not in public where we see/hear).

When we first started with this gym it was for tumbling. She'd had an injury that scared her a year or so before and had stopped ALL tumbling- I mean would not even do a cartwheel. I thought maybe a change of scenery might help. She continued with her regular gym/team/coach but we added in a class at our now current gym. When they asked me what skills she had I was honest- she was working tucks and punch fronts when injured- but that I did not want a class in any of those. I wanted their entry level class. I wanted to start from scratch and clean everything she had and work from there- with no mention of the skills she had been working. They did not bat an eye at this request...but I saw that during the class they would sometimes have her try (with a spot) the skills they knew she had- only now and again, and always right there with her. I always followed up to make sure they were not pushing her- and they always told me those moments came out of conversation with her and her desire. This slow, slow approach was just what I was looking for :). I think it also paid off, as less than a year later she is working her tuck again and it looks pretty.

Her coach chats with me when she is not around and tells me how much he loves that she is a stickler for form. He tells me he loves working with her because he knows the end result will be pretty- and that he likes that she will opt to stay on one skill- even when he tells her she can move up- because she thinks there is room to improve it. I am guessing that they would agree that I am not pushy as they have told me numerous times to come into the gym (parents are NOT allowed in) to get a video or picture and commented that they know they can let me in as I will not make my kid stressed:)

 

[cheermomokc]

I am kinda in a different boat. I have a 5 year old who cheers on a Youth 2 team at a small gym. She currently has most level 3 tumbling skills but only level 2 stunting skills. The problem I am having is she is just getting these skills without being pushed. Tumbling just comes easy to her and I am scared with her being so young, that she might burn out from it. I don't push her at all and she would live at the gym if I let her. Any tips on slowing her progression? I like the fact that her stunting skills are not as advanced as her tumbling skills so she won't be rushed to move up levels cheer wise. How do you tell a kid to slow down an enjoy it?

 

[INeverStopCheering]

To answer the original question: No I have never had a parent come to me and say "Please slow my child down, I'm worried they're going to break their neck"

Why this is I do not know. I feel like if I saw my kid landing on their head over and over I would be at least somewhat concerned for their safety. But then again I was that kid and my mom didn't say anything. She just didn't know better. And now as a result of "throwing it" for a few years, I have neck damage.

So maybe parents just aren't sure enough of what a skill is actually supposed to look like to know when it's wrong?

 

[cheermomokc]

To answer the original question: No I have never had a parent come to me and say "Please slow my child down, I'm worried they're going to break their neck"

Why this is I do not know. I feel like if I saw my kid landing on their head over and over I would be at least somewhat concerned for their safety. But then again I was that kid and my mom didn't say anything. She just didn't know better. And now as a result of "throwing it" for a few years, I have neck damage.

So maybe parents just aren't sure enough of what a skill is actually supposed to look like to know when it's wrong?

This is also my problem. She lands all of her tumbling and never lands on her head or anything. I am worried she isn't being taught the proper technique or form. It looks pretty to me and the coaches rave over it, but is it right. Like I said she is at a small gym and we will eventually move to one of two large programs in our area, I am just scared when we get there they will tell us she is not doing it correctly and she will lose the confidence she has.

 

[mamabear]

I am kinda in a different boat. I have a 5 year old who cheers on a Youth 2 team at a small gym. She currently has most level 3 tumbling skills but only level 2 stunting skills. The problem I am having is she is just getting these skills without being pushed. Tumbling just comes easy to her and I am scared with her being so young, that she might burn out from it. I don't push her at all and she would live at the gym if I let her. Any tips on slowing her progression? I like the fact that her stunting skills are not as advanced as her tumbling skills so she won't be rushed to move up levels cheer wise. How do you tell a kid to slow down an enjoy it?

I have seen it done.We have a 3rd grader with level 4 + tumble and some 3 stunting and coed skills. Her big sister is one of our elites and this one definitely seems to be following in her big sister's footsteps...but, her mom has stepped in and slowed it down. Her mom is in no rush for her daughter to be separated from her friends and be doing the harder stuff without people her own age around her. The older sister also had a pretty severe injury last season, so that might factor in too. The mom looks at the big picture and knows there is plenty of time. I wish that I had her patience -- not that I will ever be dealing with the same accelerated tumbling issues ;) - but it has been interesting to see her do what is right for her child.

 

[cheermomokc]

I have seen it done.We have a 3rd grader with level 4 + tumble and some 3 stunting and coed skills. Her big sister is one of our elites and this one definitely seems to be following in her big sister's footsteps...but, her mom has stepped in and slowed it down. Her mom is in no rush for her daughter to be separated from her friends and be doing the harder stuff without people her own age around her. The older sister also had a pretty severe injury last season, so that might factor in too. The mom looks at the big picture and knows there is plenty of time. I wish that I had her patience -- not that I will ever be dealing with the same accelerated tumbling issues ;) - but it has been interesting to see her do what is right for her child.

That is sometimes the downside of small gyms. I do not want her to be with junior aged girls and if she keeps advancing her skills that is all they will have for her. We may move to a larger gym sooner than expected (like next year)because I know they have younger teams with more advanced levels. She will be better off with kids around her age that have similar skills than with the older girls.

 

[mamabear]

That is sometimes the downside of small gyms. I do not want her to be with junior aged girls and if she keeps advancing her skills that is all they will have for her. We may move to a larger gym sooner than expected (like next year)because I know they have younger teams with more advanced levels. She will be better off with kids around her age that have similar skills than with the older girls.

That is what is happening with our gym too. We don't have youth teams this year, so the talented littles got moved straight to a Junior team, which is good in some ways and not so great in others. I think the ones who are having the worst time adjusting and finding a place on the team are the small tumblers, who are not the best flyers. In a larger gym, there would be a perfect spot for them, but they are harder to place when they are so much smaller than the rest of the team.

 

[Helen uk uni cheer]

That is sometimes the downside of small gyms. I do not want her to be with junior aged girls and if she keeps advancing her skills that is all they will have for her. We may move to a larger gym sooner than expected (like next year)because I know they have younger teams with more advanced levels. She will be better off with kids around her age that have similar skills than with the older girls.

As much as I hate crossovers maybe next year at the bigger gym if you decide to go she could do mini 2 and youth 3 if they had it and let her because she is really a mini and it great to let them just be kids

 

[MamaMya04]

There's a gymnastics gym close by that has the reputation of being the "miracle gym" and if your child can't get a skill, people from HS cheer will tell you to take your child there and ask for the "miracle" coach. Oldest had been working on her running tuck for over a year at her AS gym and could not get her set correct so cp begged to go to the "miracle" gym. After a few weeks the coach told her she had it on the tumble track, and told her she was read to throw it by herself. Her set didn't look much different to me, but hey, I was excited to finally see my kid throw her running tuck by herself. All I can say is when your child is laying on the mat after landing on their neck in a contorted, crumpled mess, you really realize how stupid it is to want something quickly instead of correctly. I can't tell you how grateful I was to see my child stand up, only to have that coach say, "learn from your mistakes, do it again". People flock to this coach and I will say her talent is her ability to convince kids they have a skill and to throw it whether they are ready or not. We didn't go back, but she's always booked.

I'm pretty sure I know who you're talking about and I feel the same way. I took my CP when she was 6 to learn her BHS. The very first time she stepped on the mat with the coach, she told my cp to throw it. No spot or anything. My CP was better off working on it at home with me. We pulled out the futon mattress and practice every night until she could do it by herself. She even made the mini2 team that year. I have a cheermom that swears by this coach and her no nonsense approach. She thinks it works best for her CP. I learned very quickly that that approach isn't a suitable coaching style for my CP. However, it doesn't work for some.