All-Star Usasf Major Changes

[lakerfantlc]

They want you to work hard, they want you to succeed, and they want the sports to grow. But these governing bodies of all sports have to look out for the public view and the perception of injury. 100 years ago there were deaths and catastrophic injuries to football players, so they made changes, added pads/helmets/more rules to enhance the way the game was played and viewed. NASCAR as you mentioned earlier has its own rules for the safety of the particpants, yes they go over 200 mph, but those cars are limited on what they can do to maintain participant safety and overall public satisfaction of how safe the sport is. And now in recent years with the NFL changes, NBA foul rules, redefining of NCAA rules for multiple sports, they are limiting the players for safety to allow these activities to continue. Tom Brady is allowed to throw as many touchdowns as he wants, but the defensive players aren't allowed to tackle as hard as they physically can. Which seems unfair to them right? But paralyzed quarterbacks across the NFL would ruin the sport. Precautions must be made by governing bodies based strictly on data and feedback from the athletes and the public.

you are comparing apples to oranges...I NEVER commented on the thickness of the mat...or the spotters etc....your comment is spin...put down the koolaid and step away!

 

[ssccxnce]

you are comparing apples to oranges...I NEVER commented on the thickness of the mat...or the spotters etc....your comment is spin...put down the koolaid and step away!

... can i have some koolaid.. :$?

 

[lakerfantlc]

... can i have some koolaid.. :$?

they would love for us ALL to get on the koolaid;)

 

[ScottyB]

you are comparing apples to oranges...I NEVER commented on the thickness of the mat...or the spotters etc....your comment is spin...put down the koolaid and step away!

Now I am not trying to attack you or go off on the boards but you had mentioned all the things I had in that post, in previous posts of yours. Mentioning NFL, NBA, NASCAR isnt apples to oranges because they are sports with governing bodies. Sports in which athletes push themselves to their fullest (just like cheerleading) and compete to be the best. Simultaneously these sports have come under pressure from groups in the sport and in the public, asking for rules for safety and rules to protect and nurture the sport so it can stay around for all participants of all ages (just like pee wee football wants safety in the higher up levels to protect the image so it isnt perceived as a violent sport).

I was merely addressing the idea that these Pro athletes are capped by rules, NFL tackling for Offense player protection. Restrictor plates on nascar cars to eliminate too high speeds to reduce wrecks and give drivers more control. It happens at all levels and is always met with frustration and anger from the participants but in the end enables to sport to continue and grow.

 

[The Sixth]

If the USASF decided to have a Worlds for each and every level, would that keep people from trying to push to the next level too soon? Not at the same time as Level 5 Worlds. Maybe a different location for each level on different weekends (no crossing allowed). As much as I would hate this, if it would stop coaches from pushing athletes too soon to the next skill, maybe that would be an acceptable compromise??

I don't disagree with the goal of what you're saying. And this isn't directed at you, because I think we're both in agreement with the real problem. But I'd be totally against this idea because I'm tired of all the rainbows and unicorns in cheer. And I think something like this would just *further* dumb down the sport. We already complain about too many divisions, too many Nationals, etc. Cheer needs a slogan soon, that says something along the lines of "Everybody can compete, and everybody can win!".

I agree with all the counterpoints to the "It's about the growth of the sport.". Funny how it seems that every competition I went to this year, EP's are on blast about how it's been the biggest turnout ever for their event. My daughter is 5 feet tall, and probably not destined to grow much taller. I'd say volleyball is NOT in her future, no matter how much she'd like to. But I'm sure as heck not petitioning for a 5' 6" and under league, that caters to kids with so-so hitting skills, playing on a 6 ft net!

Not everybody is cut out for every sport. That's just life. And if you don't treat the top of the food chain as elite, then you're completely doing a disservice to the spirit of competition.

 

[Mclovin]

What is all levels?

It's Varsity's "end of the year" event for levels 1-4 basically. And every team that gets top 3 at a bunch of different competitions get a bid to it. But it's dumb because most of these small local competitions don't even have 3 teams in each division. So everyone ends up with a bid...

ETA: Also, the "bid" only pays for your entry fee. So if EP's started giving out true paid/partial/at-large type bids to some kind of end-of-year event, maybe just maybe, these lower levels would seem more important to athletes and parents and coaches a like and people wouldn't be trying so hard (to the point of injury) to become level 5...

 

[Mclovin]

I don't disagree with the goal of what you're saying. And this isn't directed at you, because I think we're both in agreement with the real problem. But I'd be totally against this idea because I'm tired of all the rainbows and unicorns in cheer. And I think something like this would just *further* dumb down the sport. We already complain about too many divisions, too many Nationals, etc. Cheer needs a slogan soon, that says something along the lines of "Everybody can compete, and everybody can win!".

I agree with all the counterpoints to the "It's about the growth of the sport.". Funny how it seems that every competition I went to this year, EP's are on blast about how it's been the biggest turnout ever for their event. My daughter is 5 feet tall, and probably not destined to grow much taller. I'd say volleyball is NOT in her future, no matter how much she'd like to. But I'm sure as heck not petitioning for a 5' 6" and under league, that caters to kids with so-so hitting skills, playing on a 6 ft net!

Not everybody is cut out for every sport. That's just life. And if you don't treat the top of the food chain as elite, then you're completely doing a disservice to the spirit of competition.

I completely and totally agree. And I, too, hate the rainbows and puppy dogs way of thinking in our sport. I'm just trying to figure out ways to keep them from banning skills. I would compromise to almost anything before banning skills.

 

[The Sixth]

It's Varsity's "end of the year" event for levels 1-4 basically. And every team that gets top 3 at a bunch of different competitions get a bid to it. But it's dumb because most of these small local competitions don't even have 3 teams in each division. So everyone ends up with a bid...

Too lazy to edit now, but I meant to add, I also think All Levels already fits the earlier idea. They just need to give it a new image and some PR work to make ppl actually care more.

 

[5-6-7-8]

I don't disagree with the goal of what you're saying. And this isn't directed at you, because I think we're both in agreement with the real problem. But I'd be totally against this idea because I'm tired of all the rainbows and unicorns in cheer. And I think something like this would just *further* dumb down the sport. We already complain about too many divisions, too many Nationals, etc. Cheer needs a slogan soon, that says something along the lines of "Everybody can compete, and everybody can win!".

I agree with all the counterpoints to the "It's about the growth of the sport.". Funny how it seems that every competition I went to this year, EP's are on blast about how it's been the biggest turnout ever for their event. My daughter is 5 feet tall, and probably not destined to grow much taller. I'd say volleyball is NOT in her future, no matter how much she'd like to. But I'm sure as heck not petitioning for a 5' 6" and under league, that caters to kids with so-so hitting skills, playing on a 6 ft net!

Not everybody is cut out for every sport. That's just life. And if you don't treat the top of the food chain as elite, then you're completely doing a disservice to the spirit of competition.

I agree on the point that we don't need any more of the "Nationals" nationals (meaning a large local competition.) And , I am 5'5" and loved basketball, but knew I'd never make it to an elite level and that was OK.

But I wonder if having a "Level 4 Worlds" (for lack of a better term) that was held on the West Coast would help bolster international competition by 1) making it easier for Asian / Australian gyms attend and 2) giving a "stepping stone" for US athletes to the true "Worlds."

While I personally would love to see levels 1-3 get some true national competition, I just don't think enough people would be willing to travel to compete in a level 1-3 event. HOWEVER, maybe this is something USASF can address (HA!) by having a real means of creating designated regional qualifiers for state / small region events, and then somehow a Large Region / National event. I know All Levels / The US Finals are sort of there, but there isn't too much exclusivity with it (no more qualifying for All Levels with this new way of doing things, and a top 5 finish for US Finals.)

 

[p.o.k.]

I don't disagree with the goal of what you're saying. And this isn't directed at you, because I think we're both in agreement with the real problem. But I'd be totally against this idea because I'm tired of all the rainbows and unicorns in cheer. And I think something like this would just *further* dumb down the sport. We already complain about too many divisions, too many Nationals, etc. Cheer needs a slogan soon, that says something along the lines of "Everybody can compete, and everybody can win!".

I agree with all the counterpoints to the "It's about the growth of the sport.". Funny how it seems that every competition I went to this year, EP's are on blast about how it's been the biggest turnout ever for their event. My daughter is 5 feet tall, and probably not destined to grow much taller. I'd say volleyball is NOT in her future, no matter how much she'd like to. But I'm sure as heck not petitioning for a 5' 6" and under league, that caters to kids with so-so hitting skills, playing on a 6 ft net!

Not everybody is cut out for every sport. That's just life. And if you don't treat the top of the food chain as elite, then you're completely doing a disservice to the spirit of competition.

All of this can be interperted as the "No gym left behind program". You too can be a marginal level 5 team with only half of your team competing level 5 skills and still be competitive. I am sorry the real world does not work like this. Why should cheer be any different?

 

[5-6-7-8]

And I know these issues of "why no Jr. 5 at worlds" no senior 4 at worlds stuff has been beat to death. But in light of the discussions out there, I think there may be some merit to at least some discussions. And I am not saying to bring any of this to the existing worlds, but create new event.

Heck, maybe it would bring down the 29384793874 at large bids for teams who aren't truly going to be competitive at Worlds, and bring more exclusivity to Worlds.

 

[The Sixth]

I completely and totally agree. And I, too, hate the rainbows and puppy dogs way of thinking in our sport. I'm just trying to figure out ways to keep them from banning skills. I would compromise to almost anything before banning skills.

That's the real stink of it. We shouldn't have to find a compromise to prevent banning skills. When the Initialisms can actually give the rest of the industry hard proof of all this so called data they have, then *maybe* I'll change my mind. Till, then I don't believe there is any justification for their actions. I don't know if it's considered a conspiracy theory or not, but I'm still of the belief that much of this is just a mask for their own best interests of profitability.

 

[5-6-7-8]

That's the real stink of it. We shouldn't have to find a compromise to prevent banning skills. When the Initialisms can actually give the rest of the industry hard proof of all this so called data they have, then *maybe* I'll change my mind. Till, then I don't believe there is any justification for their actions. I don't know if it's considered a conspiracy theory or not, but I'm still of the belief that much of this is just a mask for their own best interests of profitability.

Yes. Silly thing is, there is profit to be made by requiring tumbling coach certification..."Varsity Brand tumbling credentialing courses and certification."

And I agree that if someone had come out with the data that was used to make those new rules, it would have seemed less conspiracy (even if they used incorrect data.) Not that it makes it right, but at least people could keep the debate / discussion to the data and not conspiracy theories.

 

[lakerfantlc]

That's the real stink of it. We shouldn't have to find a compromise to prevent banning skills. When the Initialisms can actually give the rest of the industry hard proof of all this so called data they have, then *maybe* I'll change my mind. Till, then I don't believe there is any justification for their actions. I don't know if it's considered a conspiracy theory or not, but I'm still of the belief that much of this is just a mask for their own best interests of profitability.

NO...I was talking about putting a cap on the talent as a whole...you brought up helmets and such....apples to oranges...The NFL has NEVER been told they had a cap on achievement..its different...if these rules go through...the sport will die...period

 

[lakerfantlc]

Now I am not trying to attack you or go off on the boards but you had mentioned all the things I had in that post, in previous posts of yours. Mentioning NFL, NBA, NASCAR isnt apples to oranges because they are sports with governing bodies. Sports in which athletes push themselves to their fullest (just like cheerleading) and compete to be the best. Simultaneously these sports have come under pressure from groups in the sport and in the public, asking for rules for safety and rules to protect and nurture the sport so it can stay around for all participants of all ages (just like pee wee football wants safety in the higher up levels to protect the image so it isnt perceived as a violent sport).

I was merely addressing the idea that these Pro athletes are capped by rules, NFL tackling for Offense player protection. Restrictor plates on nascar cars to eliminate too high speeds to reduce wrecks and give drivers more control. It happens at all levels and is always met with frustration and anger from the participants but in the end enables to sport to continue and grow.

sidenote...do you work for varsity or USASF? Just wondering;)