All-Star Was Large Senior Realllllly Dying?

[King]

I don't know other than the fact you want them out of small and into medium since they won't go large. Logisticis is the main thing, but if everyone wants to sit in Orlando for 2 days to get through a division, it's fine with me. I just go to the few I enjoy and lay beside the pool and sip a beverage the rest of the day. I do not think your divisions will increase the participation overall, just shift the teams around a bit.

Not really sure why I would care if they are out of small senior. All things being the same, having 70 in the division hasn't been an issue so far.

 

[StarshipTrooper]

There'd be 2 teams in the division and no one would give a poop.

Does it bother you that they are such high profile teams right now?

 

[StarshipTrooper]

You are including family. OK. That makes more sense. Total cost, not just the athlete themselves.

Yes, sorry, did not make that distinction. For SE, the Popes are very, very fair on pricing. Less than 2k a year for tuition and competition fees.

 

[King]

Does it bother you that they are such high profile teams right now?

Probably about as much as it bothers you that ESPN would rather show Small Senior on TV last year?

 

[cheerinfo]

info, I guess my point would be, as long as the competition is good, I do not feel the need to push rules and regulations to change the market to my vision of what could be better. If F5 and WC show up in Large Senior, I would say SE will go large. If they go medium, the SE team will probably go medium. Anything else is speculation as far as what will happen. Give it a try and we'll see. I have no problem with that. If there were one division for everyone, there would be a heck of a competion. Again, the CheerSport model of competition with multiple levels and divisions and resulted in a lot of teams showing up at CheerSport. Has it increased the number of teams and gyms with athletes? I don't know. But it is not the best Level 5 competition, which I would argue is what Worlds actually is, and the model may not work there.

I do not want large to go to 30 because I necessarily believe it will create more gyms or more athletes. I believe it will increase the number of teams competing in a particular division which is what i like to see. I hate going to a competition, large ones included, and having 5 teams to compete against (and even 5 is a big division in most cases anymore). If changing the size from 36 to 30 increases the number of teams in that division, than I am for it. And if it moves a few out of small senior, that division is large enough to spare a few teams I think. I do not feel that 3 teams always against each other and ONLY those same 3 teams is good competition, no matter how great those teams are. I would prefer to see them in with the other teams and all fight it out. They may still end up on the top, that is fine. But I would prefer to have teams compete against more teams rather than 2 or 3 a couple times a year. But this year will hopefully determine how it should go the next year. Nothing can be done now. But that is my view on it. More teams to compete against = better IMO

 

[StarshipTrooper]

Probably about as much as it bothers you that ESPN would rather show Small Senior on TV last year?

I think that was a USASF decision, as the broadcast was a hour long infomercial for All Star. Smart marketing. Varsity makes their money in schools, and small senior looks like school based cheer on steroids. Just like international was showcased to promote growth overseas. Does not bother me in the least. BTW, was Large Senior shown on ESPN last year? I think, in spite of it not being the best marketing for what the telecast was for, to show Large Senior shows those teams popularity to have them on the telecast. I assume your answer would be no, it does not bother me.

 

[StarshipTrooper]

I do not want large to go to 30 because I necessarily believe it will create more gyms or more athletes. I believe it will increase the number of teams competing in a particular division which is what i like to see. I hate going to a competition, large ones included, and having 5 teams to compete against (and even 5 is a big division in most cases anymore). If changing the size from 36 to 30 increases the number of teams in that division, than I am for it. And if it moves a few out of small senior, that division is large enough to spare a few teams I think. I do not feel that 3 teams always against each other and ONLY those same 3 teams is good competition, no matter how great those teams are. I would prefer to see them in with the other teams and all fight it out. They may still end up on the top, that is fine. But I would prefer to have teams compete against more teams rather than 2 or 3 a couple times a year. But this year will hopefully determine how it should go the next year. Nothing can be done now. But that is my view on it. More teams to compete against = better IMO

Fair enough, but are you OK with limiting other's choices with rules and regulations to get what you want?

 

[King]

I think that was a USASF decision, as the broadcast was a hour long infomercial for All Star. Smart marketing. Varsity makes their money in schools, and small senior looks like school based cheer on steroids. Just like international was showcased to promote growth overseas. Does not bother me in the least. BTW, was Large Senior shown on ESPN last year? I think, in spite of it not being the best marketing for what the telecast was for, to show Large Senior shows those teams popularity to have them on the telecast. I assume your answer would be no, it does not bother me.

It was an ESPN decision. I believe it was a USASF decision to have them perform again (but that part I can't verify. I just know the first part for sure).

 

[NJ Coach]

I don't think Large Senior was dying as quickly as Unlimited. It's a lot harder to find that many boys, so Unlimited has died down fast. Large Senior has had a small leak for the past few years. Each year, the leak seemed to get bigger and bigger. While it's true that there may be slightly more teams at worlds this year than last, it by no means signals the plumbling has been fixed. It is hard to find 36 girls with that many skills. It's so much easier to field a team of 20. Especially with 3 heavyweights sitting at the top of the division. I'll be very sad the day Large Senior ceases to exist.

 

[StarshipTrooper]

It was an ESPN decision. I believe it was a USASF decision to have them perform again (but that part I can't verify. I just know the first part for sure).

Not what I hear. I don't think ESPN makes enough on advertising to cover All Star without some supplement from the industry. I know pretty certain that the timing of the ESPN retape was due to the cost to USASF for the camera crew. But I'm not CERTAIN about it, but I'll bet that the programing was a USASF decision, not ESPN, or at least a consensus. But it is a moot point, they show the teams that promote their agendas, USASF to grow their business and ESPN to get ratings. I cannot explain why in the world they would show international if not for USASF intervention, because I can guarantee the committed cheer audience would have rather seen TG, Cali and Ga. in their coed divisions.

 

[cheerinfo]

Fair enough, but are you OK with limiting other's choices with rules and regulations to get what you want?

yes...when it affects so few teams, yes I am. To make for more competition, I certainly am for limiting choices for a few to benefit many.

 

[wcsstilldeath]

When large Senior finally dies, what will be the new division that everyone fights/analyzes over? It'll be a sad day when fierceboarders have to plegde alliance to a new team.

 

[imrichhowboutu]

When large Senior finally dies, what will be the new division that everyone fights/analyzes over? It'll be a sad day when fierceboarders have to plegde alliance to a new team.

Well i think the majority of us will still talk about these teams wherever they move to. Although i have noticed that with panthers moving to small, there hasnt been much talk about them

 

[King]

When large Senior finally dies, what will be the new division that everyone fights/analyzes over? It'll be a sad day when fierceboarders have to plegde alliance to a new team.

I guess I don't understand why it won't all just shift over to medium? When it is called the new large?

 

[imrichhowboutu]

I guess I don't understand why it won't all just shift over to medium? When it is called the new large?

When large is deleted as a new division, won't medium be renamed. It would be weird to just have Small and Medium as the sizes that we call them.