All-Star Xtreme Spirit, Wisconson Dells

[icecheermom]

Appreciate the clarification. Its just crazy that sooo many people have a problem with XS. Not Top Gun!! I do think they deserved the bid. I don't care if its a level 5 team that has won worlds every year since the beginning. I just think that if I have to pay, then you have to pay. I understand EP's want to get more business but there has to be a way that is fair to everyone. Congrats on the bid TG, you look amazing as usual!!

 

[shadow]

CandC5p So your post basically says XS did not make top gun pay registration fees and did not make them pay for a hotel (everybody does it for big name gyms) and that their were judging errors. It that correct?
Even if this is common practice it is a huge conflict of interest.

 

[cheerinfo]

CandC5p - I do tend to agree that if you JUST left TG this past season, it is a huge conflict of interest for you to be anywhere on the judging panel, safety or otherwise. Even if you are the most honest person in the world...to others, perception is reality, regardless of whether or not you did anything "wrong". And shame on XS for not realizing that and allowing you to judge that team at that event. I don't think people are arguing that TG didn't "deserve" the bid, but I think the means in which this company went about getting them there to GET that bid is a matter that warrants discussion and I think it does appear to be a little tainted. I IN NO WAY have any dog in this fight on either side. But I do think it was a bad decision to have a recently departed coach judge the program that he has recently departed from.

 

[JulieP]

CandC5p - I do tend to agree that if you JUST left TG this past season, it is a huge conflict of interest for you to be anywhere on the judging panel, safety or otherwise. Even if you are the most honest person in the world...to others, perception is reality, regardless of whether or not you did anything "wrong". And shame on XS for not realizing that and allowing you to judge that team at that event. I don't think people are arguing that TG didn't "deserve" the bid, but I think the means in which this company went about getting them there to GET that bid is a matter that warrants discussion and I think it does appear to be a little tainted. I IN NO WAY have any dog in this fight on either side. But I do think it was a bad decision to have a recently departed coach judge the program that he has recently departed from.

I agree 100%, except I think there are people on this thread who don't think that TG didn't deserve the bid. I don't have a dog in the fight either, and I wasn't there so I shouldn't really weigh in on that side of it.

 

[CandC5p]

CandC5p So your post basically says XS did not make top gun pay registration fees and did not make them pay for a hotel (everybody does it for big name gyms) and that their were judging errors. It that correct?
Even if this is common practice it is a huge conflict of interest.

I did not "basically" say that, you are "basically" making assumptions. I said that what was offered to Top Gun was very basic and MINIMAL and not out of the norm. Please don't twist things around and put words in my mouth. Exact details do not need to be discussed with anyone. It was a business dealing between the owners of Top Gun and Xtreme Spirit, no one else. People can say its unfair all they want, but its how business works... in all businesses across the world. If you buy a pair of jeans for full price, but your friend found the same exact jeans for half the price you paid, do you cry about it? Do you whine about it and say "well I paid full price, so YOU should have paid full price!" No. Your friend happened to be at the right place at the right time, and you get over it. In this situation, Top Gun has been in the all star cheerleading industry since the early 90's, and they have worked very hard for the success they have achieved and the reputation they have built. If companies make offers to them to get them to wear their products or attend their events, thats between that company and Top Gun. When your gym earns a status and reputation like that, your gym will most likely receive those kind of "perks" as well. I'm sure those people won't be complaining and saying "Well, the other 95% of the industry has to pay for it, so we'll disregard that discount you're offering and pay full price, but thanks anyway." Come on, get real. Anyone wants a bargain when they can get one. Stop making all of this a bigger deal than it is.

This case is closed. I've spoke my peace. You can express your opinions all you want, but you will no longer get any responses from me. If you have any legit questions, message me.

 

[tdittmar]

Things that make ya go hmmmmm?

 

[twistinnUout]

what people have an issue with is not that top gun got that paid bid, if that was really their score then yes they most definitely deserved that bid. They did look a lot better day 2. My problem isn't with top gun or how they choose to run their program. I don't care how they choose or where they go to compete. My issue is that irregardless of how much anyone tries to deny it there was special treatment. Us as cheerleaders and coaches of the event saw it all. If you weren't there or are part of XS of course it will just sound like more drama. If there was no issue nothing would have been said and not so many teams would have a problem of how XS acted this weekend. you seriously could comment about something and people would just over hear and agree about everything. But whatever congrats to top gun for their paid bid. All I have to say is that XS is not a competition to go to for World Bids.

 

[Cheer Tennessee]

A lot of you are unaware that a lot of programs attend competitions for free. Uniform companies give teams uniforms for free. Our athletes have been giving shoes from the companies free. Attended competitions where the fee has been waived. Equipment has been given to us. Hotel rooms even. I am from a smaller program and it happens all the time. Its to up business and get the name spread.

Before I merged my gym of only 50 Athletes with PT.. my extremely small program was offered half fee's and even free. Shoes where given to my athletes, large discounts on uniforms etc. This is nothing new.

 

[cheerinfo]

A lot of you are unaware that a lot of programs attend competitions for free. Uniform companies give teams uniforms for free. Our athletes have been giving shoes from the companies free. Attended competitions where the fee has been waived. Equipment has been given to us. Hotel rooms even. I am from a smaller program and it happens all the time. Its to up business and get the name spread.

Before I merged my gym of only 50 Athletes with PT.. my extremely small program was offered half fee's and even free. Shoes where given to my athletes, large discounts on uniforms etc. This is nothing new.

To me, the issue is not so much the "perks". I have been a part of two very large, well known gyms and I am sure they get offers as well, sponsors, etc. However, my concern is about the judging panel. You should not have someone judge a BID EVENT where a gym you JUST left is competed. Period. The end. To me, that is the bigger concern. XS should have known better, and that is a big mistake in my opinion.

 

[Rudags]

A lot of you are unaware that a lot of programs attend competitions for free. Uniform companies give teams uniforms for free. Our athletes have been giving shoes from the companies free. Attended competitions where the fee has been waived. Equipment has been given to us. Hotel rooms even. I am from a smaller program and it happens all the time. Its to up business and get the name spread.

Before I merged my gym of only 50 Athletes with PT.. my extremely small program was offered half fee's and even free. Shoes where given to my athletes, large discounts on uniforms etc. This is nothing new.

I agree with you. Comp companies have told me to bring my entire gym to comps for free to create competition so the event will grow. These were never World Bid Events. The problem I see with it is that this is getting HUGE attention because of XS's rep from the past several years. I have not been to an XS Spirit event since 2009 (for good reason) and others feel the same way. This weekend my old gym was in attendance. They had wrong skills wrote on their scoresheet (example: 6 one to fulls, great job) when in essence they had 11 two to fulls. When asked about it, they were told that they do NOT change scores. Whatever, they lived with it. Then the next day they show up with someone handing out new scoresheets as some corrections were made. WTF?

 

[twistinnUout]

If your team was in high hopes for a paid bid and then you witnessed this weekend you would be pissed too, so for everyone adding that they get their stuff paid for all the time and get free shoes and uniforms, good for your team. Unfortunately once again people are just going to put their two cents in hopes of trying to stand up for a big name gym. Just like the rest of the cheerleading world. So it's been proved. XS should have just said that they were giving at large bids only because they "invited" a team to come get their paid bid. You can look at it anyway you want but this weekends scoring and judging was so ridiculous.

 

[NEliteSteven]

Haha, no, I didn't take offense to your comment at all... you were just stating a fact. I was totally in the wrong in that situation! I'm still mad at myself for it and feel bad that y'all had to go through that anger! .... Are you going to Worlds? I'll buy you're staff drinks and dinner to try and make up for it! ... And then when I heard about the mis-announcing of the awards that affected your team, I said to myself "Oh my gosh, this poor program has seen the worst of it."

It's only December, we'll live. haha And we will be at Worlds to watch, so you'll definitely have to say Hi!

I definitely feel bad for Top Gun getting hounded on this. It clearly isn't a bad decision on their part, any gym in their right mind would do the same if offered. I think like Kyle said above me, it just adds to the reputation that XS has already given itself. I remember last year being in warm ups and them changing our warm up times to be a half hour earlier. Our team had to go twice in one day since we ended up with major conflicts the day before. We were upset that our kids wouldn't get time to breathe and the owner told us that we needed to "Chill out and stop making a big deal about it". Legit. It is too bad, because there are extremely nice people that work for xtreme (see above) but I think the company is a little "out there" with their scoresheets. Also when you're paying what you pay to go to these competitions two panels of judges would be nice, so you don't have to wait 10 minutes between teams. It made it such a long day, of not that many teams.

 

[shadow]

Clothes, shoes, being sponsored is very different than what is being discussed here.
The discussion is not about Top Guns program and how its run. It could have been any team treated in the same manor. It is not about free tangible goods. It is about the event prompter. It is about the appearance of impropriety. When qualification to a major event is on the line, in order to not taint the process, extra caution should be taken to have no appearance of nepotism.

 

[NEcheer]

If your team was in high hopes for a paid bid and then you witnessed this weekend you would be pissed too, so for everyone adding that they get their stuff paid for all the time and get free shoes and uniforms, good for your team. Unfortunately once again people are just going to put their two cents in hopes of trying to stand up for a big name gym. Just like the rest of the cheerleading world. So it's been proved. XS should have just said that they were giving at large bids only because they "invited" a team to come get their paid bid. You can look at it anyway you want but this weekends scoring and judging was so ridiculous.

I was at this event as a coach and spectator to the worlds divisions both days and IMO the correct teams got the CORRECT bids. There was not one team who hit perfect the first day. If someone would have they would have been right up there if not in front of Top Gun after day 1. The XS score sheet rewards a team with great execution, and even though Top Gun had a few stunt falls day 1 the execution on everything else they did is what won it for them. I am pretty sure EVERY team had a stunt fall the first day!

Anyone was capable of taking home that paid bid this weekend! If the scoresheet was set up to reward difficulty Top Gun may be sitting in a different spot. (Although I am sure their routine would have looked a little different!) To say that "XS should have just said that they were giving at large bids" really is not fair. I think a lot of teams were really hoping for a bid this weekend (who wasn't!?) and in all honesty may have been thinking this would be an easy chance at one and are upset TG put a wrench in their plans.

Final results are posted here: http://www.xtremespirit.com/results12171811.html

 

[luvhim381]

Some of you need a hug!!!