All-Star A Night With The Popes.

[CEADAD05]

Who let the dogs out ???? I am not going to respond to these last couple of post . Have fun trying to stir more drama ...

 

[FierceandFearless]

If you take the time to read through the thread which everything went down in, I believe there is a post from kingston that talks about a threatening phone call he recieved from Ceacoach which I believe is the reason she is now banned

Oh that's right. I did read that but had forgotten that part.. :banghead: My apologies. That was just a brain freeze on my part. You're right that is probably why. Totally my fault...

 

[kristenthegreat]

And this is why I said earlier-a committee in charge of discipline and ethics CANNOT be composed of gym coaches, owners, EPs, etc. None of it. Coaches and gyms that are the most powerful can easily be involved in some of these cases, because they are big and well known, and under a more watchful eye. Or, they can very easily be connected to the gym in question somehow... Whether it be an old coach now at their gym, using them for choreography, or simply getting drinks with them at a big comp... It's not far fetched that people are well connected in the industry. As far as people making big decisions, that simply is not ok.

Are we really the only two bothered by this?!? This is so Atlas Shrugged! Don't people realize what happened to the Washington Boys and what the Anti-Dog-Eat-Dog rule made people do!?!?

Big spoiler: Everyone sacrificed anyone else to protect themselves. It's all well and good to side with someone in that capacity, but don't be shocked or angry when they turn on you too.

 

[FierceandFearless]

If you take the time to read through the thread which everything went down in, I believe there is a post from kingston that talks about a threatening phone call he recieved from Ceacoach which I believe is the reason she is now banned

eta: please correct me if I am wrong/ just trying to help clarify not stir more drama

No you are totally 100% correct, that part of the thread had completely slipped my mind. Thank you for pointing that out to me

 

[King]

It won't allow me to view her profile, it says it is currently unavailable, but I'm not receiving a message saying she is banned...? However, I have been receiving the message saying certain users profiles are unavailable for a few days, but those users are still posting in threads, so I know they aren't banned, so I don't know if the FB is being updated or something...
kingston care to elaborate? If you're willing to, I just ask that the simple fact is stated so that a rumor doesn't unfold from someone reading that "she's banned" and then end up making more out of it than what it really is. A simple "yes, she is" or "no, she's not," will do. All I'm looking for is clarification.
Thanks in advance :)

ceacoach was banned for threatening to sue the board (and myself). no different than ICEDAD.

 

[FierceandFearless]

ceacoach was banned for threatening to sue the board (and myself). no different than ICEDAD.

Thank you for your clarification.

 

[ACEDAD]

Are we really the only two bothered by this?!? This is so Atlas Shrugged! Don't people realize what happened to the Washington Boys and what the Anti-Dog-Eat-Dog rule made people do!?!?

I cant type everything I want on my phone. But, no, an individual or organization would not vote on an issue about themselves.

And while a completely independent disciplinary board would be ideal, you have to have people that know what they are talking about. And when you get people that know what they are talking about, they tend to know each other. Some would call that a jury of their peers.

No easy solutions.

 

[justpeachy]

joespeach
(removed pic to save space)
I wasn't implying that you were lying about what you read. I completely believed you before I saw the picture, I was just asking that Kingston clarify because I'm confused on why you would be given a message saying she is banned, but I'm getting one saying it's just temp unavail along with several other profiles (again of people who are still posting) giving that same message.. I totally believe your pic and your statement, I just want to know if there was a glitch in what message was supposed to be sent out for that user.
Does that make sense? sorry.... lol

Sorry- retreading my post, I guess I sounded a little snarky. That was not my intent. Just trying to stay factual and not feed the fire.

I think the difference in messages we received was due to me being on my cell vs computer.

No hard feelings! :)

 

[Rudags]

Question for ceadad05. I must say I'm a bit surprised at how lightly you take this. Does your daughter know that she cheated? That her trusted adults surrounding her allowed her to cheat? Would you blindly follow your coach- a proven "rule bender" again? Personally I would be so out of there. No gym, no amount of winning is worth that.

I respect Courtney and I am a CEA fan so I know that will be everyones first "come back" to anything I say. So Ill change the game so its unbiased. There is a gym that I absolutely despise. I am trying to think what I would say if I got on the Fierceboard and someone posted "Kyle's least favorite team that he despises competed exhibition at an event and on that exhibition team, a girl crossed over four times."

To be 100% honest, despite my dislike for this program (that I am mentally picturing to be unbiased) I would respond "They were exhibition, who cares?" Whats funny is I feel the same way about this.

I would be MORE concerned about why an EP allowed it more so than why a gym owner or coach okayed it. Can I see BOTH parties being at fault? Absolutely I can. Would I remove my kid from the program? Heck no. If this is such a HUGE deal, perhaps the USASF should have put parenthesis after the rule (this includes exhibition teams). This is the gray area that causes issues.

I don't see it being unrealistic that an event producers wants the level 5 divisions to be competitive (esp. comparing it to NCA Dallas) and would make a request to not let them exhibition.

Again, someone pointed this out, but when someone of authority gives you the go a head, and it seems harmless (that team was in a division of their own, and didnt even follow the level appropriate rules) - I don't get the complaint?

 

[SharkDad]

But see the problem is youre saying it's just one kid maybe it was a stacked team with multiple kids that crossed to the fourth team? How do we know?? After all it sounded like it was a one time "special" occurrence at cheersport and now we find out another "special" occurrence happened at spirit sports! Also! Where does it really end?

You are making things up. What are you trying to get out of this post?

Question for ceadad05. I must say I'm a bit surprised at how lightly you take this. Does your daughter know that she cheated? That her trusted adults surrounding her allowed her to cheat? Would you blindly follow your coach- a proven "rule bender" again? Personally I would be so out of there. No gym, no amount of winning is worth that.

Who's definition of cheating are you using? Don't use your own. Find me a concrete set of rules applied across the sport (or at Cheerpsort) that says an exhibition counts as competing.

 

[FierceandFearless]

Sorry- retreading my post, I guess I sounded a little snarky. That was not my intent. Just trying to stay factual and not feed the fire.

I think the difference in messages we received was due to me being on my cell vs computer.

No hard feelings! :)

no hard feelings at all :) and I agree I'm trying to stay factual as well which is why I asked Kingston for clarification :)

 

[King]

I respect Courtney and I am a CEA fan so I know that will be everyones first "come back" to anything I say. So Ill change the game so its unbiased. There is a gym that I absolutely despise. I am trying to think what I would say if I got on the Fierceboard and someone posted "Kyle's least favorite team that he despises competed exhibition at an event and on that exhibition team, a girl crossed over four times."

To be 100% honest, despite my dislike for this program (that I am mentally picturing to be unbiased) I would respond "They were exhibition, who cares?" Whats funny is I feel the same way about this.

I would be MORE concerned about why an EP allowed it more so than why a gym owner or coach okayed it. Can I see BOTH parties being at fault? Absolutely I can. Would I remove my kid from the program? Heck no. If this is such a HUGE deal, perhaps the USASF should have put parenthesis after the rule (this includes exhibition teams). This is the gray area that causes issues.

I don't see it being unrealistic that an event producers wants the level 5 divisions to be competitive (esp. comparing it to NCA Dallas) and would make a request to not let them exhibition.

Again, someone pointed this out, but when someone of authority gives you the go a head, and it seems harmless (that team was in a division of their own, and didnt even follow the level appropriate rules) - I don't get the complaint?

Is there a good analogy in this? Can it be compared to state vs federal law? A state can say something is legal but a federal law can say illegal. So can you still be charged by the federal? Yes.

However: this is not the US court system and this is all done by private institutions. There is nothing requiring any EP or Coach to follow or enforce any rules. So we can pretty much do as we dang please and there is no precedent. So in that instance I cant say the EP or the Coach is more at fault. It is whoever runs it all determines it.

 

[FierceandFearless]

I respect Courtney and I am a CEA fan so I know that will be everyones first "come back" to anything I say. So Ill change the game so its unbiased. There is a gym that I absolutely despise. I am trying to think what I would say if I got on the Fierceboard and someone posted "Kyle's least favorite team that he despises competed exhibition at an event and on that exhibition team, a girl crossed over four times."

To be 100% honest, despite my dislike for this program (that I am mentally picturing to be unbiased) I would respond "They were exhibition, who cares?" Whats funny is I feel the same way about this.

I would be MORE concerned about why an EP allowed it more so than why a gym owner or coach okayed it. Can I see BOTH parties being at fault? Absolutely I can. Would I remove my kid from the program? Heck no. If this is such a HUGE deal, perhaps the USASF should have put parenthesis after the rule (this includes exhibition teams). This is the gray area that causes issues.

I don't see it being unrealistic that an event producers wants the level 5 divisions to be competitive (esp. comparing it to NCA Dallas) and would make a request to not let them exhibition.

Again, someone pointed this out, but when someone of authority gives you the go a head, and it seems harmless (that team was in a division of their own, and didnt even follow the level appropriate rules) - I don't get the complaint?

VERY well said.

 

[kristenthegreat]

I cant type everything I want on my phone. But, no, an individual or organization would not vote on an issue about themselves.

And while a completely independent disciplinary board would be ideal, you have to have people that know what they are talking about. And when you get people that know what they are talking about, they tend to know each other. Some would call that a jury of their peers.

No easy solutions.

I'm cheating, I'm on my computer. :D

I agree with you on all counts, though. It would be my concern in general- that while you are generally tried by a jury of your peers in modern courts, it usually doesn't include your next-door neighbor who you might have borrowed a shovel from that you dinged up a bit on accident the last time you borrowed it. Maybe someday we will be an old enough sport to have people WITHIN the allstar community but still far enough removed where it doesn't run as much of a risk of stepping on somebody's toes. We should be getting there soon...I hope!

 

[Cheer_Explosion_Coach]

Does the rule say an athlete cannot "compete" or "perform" with 4 teams at one event? I think knowing the wording would clear up a lot for those wishing to split hairs. I thought it was worded perform, but I cannot find the written rule. I think the "spirit of the rule" is to protect the athlete from having to warm up/ perform 4 times in one day. In the spirit of the rule, I believe that CEA had a disregard for the cheerleader and nothing but the best interest of the program. Which in my mind speaks louder than any words said by people for or against the EP or gym.