All-Star Cheerleaders Season 3?

[Keep_Believing]

Here is the link

FollowOrby Orta‏@Orbyorta
I've been called a lot of things in life but never a bully. Anyone that knows my life struggles knows it's just not true."

This was posted during the team's blowing up of twitter over Dylan leaving.

Here are the two others posted within the same time frame
Orby Orta‏@Orbyorta
I am continually impressed, horrified and saddened by the manipulative mastery of some people. God is watching even when you think he's not.

User Actions
FollowOrby Orta‏@Orbyorta
I love my kids more than I love myself. I live, eat and breath for them. Keep pushing kitties

God has tons in store for you.

I know Kyle posted about it too, but can't find it (I assume deleted). And Dylan has repeatedly said he won't give details, so has he ever said it publicly---I don't think so, but it was part of the explosion when it first happened.

Yes, but some on fierce board refered to him as a bully. That is not Dylan himself calling anyone a bully. All I have seen Dylan say is he wasn't happy.

 

[SL&AM]

Yes, but some on fierce board refered to him as a bully. That is not Dylan himself calling anyone a bully. All I have seen Dylan say is he wasn't happy.

I missed those on FB calling him a bully during that period of time. My inference of the situation was a mixture of tweets during that time period (though most have been deleted it seems) and information his father has given (on different social media and on here) about the atmosphere he was cheering in.

There was a post, though I'm trying to remember where I saw it back then where it talked about the treatment of others (as a problem he was having), if I can find it, I'll post it.

 

[Keep_Believing]

I missed those on FB calling him a bully during that period of time. My inference of the situation was a mixture of tweets during that time period (though most have been deleted it seems) and information his father has given (on different social media and on here) about the atmosphere he was cheering in.

There was a post, though I'm trying to remember where I saw it back then where it talked about the treatment of others (as a problem he was having), if I can find it, I'll post it.

I have seen post from his Dad. I have not seen any from Dylan like that.

 

[SoAena]

I have seen post from his Dad. I have not seen any from Dylan like that.

I guess that's the point. Dylan left and kept things clean, unless I missed something. He's not the one who made the whole thing public on twitter. Yet he's the one who's apparently (I haven't watched it) being trashed on the show.

 

[kristenthegreat]

I have seen post from his Dad. I have not seen any from Dylan like that.

I've been through SEVERAL threads on here with people from various big gyms (SOT, Cali, CEA) claim they were being bullied/mistreated. Heck when that chick from CEA left (can't remember her name) around NCA, she claimed Courtney was bullying her. Satellite gyms, main gyms- doesn't matter. People still join CEA. People are still at SOT despite some coaches being accused of bullying youth aged kids. People are still at Cali/on Smoed despite others saying it is or has become a toxic environment (or alluding to that). These kids don't want to burn bridges more than they already are, so it's easier for the parents to say specific events rather than the kids themselves. I'm not surprised Dylan/Tyler/Whomever doesn't want to go into it, because every instance he writes will be subject to scrutiny 1000 times over with every other person saying 'Well that's not how I see it so you're wrong.' Do you know how draining it is feeling like you have to constantly explain and justify your pain to people?

I've learned on here that just because not everyone has that experience, doesn't mean they aren't real. And if these experiences are starting to be verbalized this season, coupled with athletes in a high-profile environment acting rashly and in bad taste, PLUS the hypocrisy of 'not recruiting during the season'- forgive us all if that leaves a bad taste in our mouths. It might also spill into our words.

 

[Eyes On The Prize]

I've been through SEVERAL threads on here with people from various big gyms (SOT, Cali, CEA) claim they were being bullied/mistreated. Heck when that chick from CEA left (can't remember her name) around NCA, she claimed Courtney was bullying her. Satellite gyms, main gyms- doesn't matter. People still join CEA. People are still at SOT despite some coaches being accused of bullying youth aged kids. People are still at Cali/on Smoed despite others saying it is or has become a toxic environment (or alluding to that). These kids don't want to burn bridges more than they already are, so it's easier for the parents to say specific events rather than the kids themselves. I'm not surprised Dylan/Tyler/Whomever doesn't want to go into it, because every instance he writes will be subject to scrutiny 1000 times over with every other person saying 'Well that's not how I see it so you're wrong.' Do you know how draining it is feeling like you have to constantly explain and justify your pain to people?

I've learned on here that just because not everyone has that experience, doesn't mean they aren't real. And if these experiences are starting to be verbalized this season, coupled with athletes in a high-profile environment acting rashly and in bad taste, PLUS the hypocrisy of 'not recruiting during the season'- forgive us all if that leaves a bad taste in our mouths. It might also spill into our words.

This reminds me of the Sexual Harassment training I had to do when I started my job last week. Repeated concept they wanted the trainee to learn: It may not look like sexual harassment to you but if the person feels uncomfortable or feels victimized, then it is. And the courts will always seek how the "harassee" felt in this situation, not the harasser.

I'd like to apply this theory to bullying.

 

[Keep_Believing]

I've been through SEVERAL threads on here with people from various big gyms (SOT, Cali, CEA) claim they were being bullied/mistreated. Heck when that chick from CEA left (can't remember her name) around NCA, she claimed Courtney was bullying her. Satellite gyms, main gyms- doesn't matter. People still join CEA. People are still at SOT despite some coaches being accused of bullying youth aged kids. People are still at Cali/on Smoed despite others saying it is or has become a toxic environment (or alluding to that). These kids don't want to burn bridges more than they already are, so it's easier for the parents to say specific events rather than the kids themselves. I'm not surprised Dylan/Tyler/Whomever doesn't want to go into it, because every instance he writes will be subject to scrutiny 1000 times over with every other person saying 'Well that's not how I see it so you're wrong.' Do you know how draining it is feeling like you have to constantly explain and justify your pain to people?

I've learned on here that just because not everyone has that experience, doesn't mean they aren't real. And if these experiences are starting to be verbalized this season, coupled with athletes in a high-profile environment acting rashly and in bad taste, PLUS the hypocrisy of 'not recruiting during the season'- forgive us all if that leaves a bad taste in our mouths. It might also spill into our words.

I get what you are saying. I was asking because a poster said Dylan said he was bullied.

 

[SL&AM]

I get what you are saying. I was asking because a poster said Dylan said he was bullied.

That why I said "If Dylan felt"...given the comments from every other source but him, it was assumed/inferred that he felt/said it, but never said publicly (for good reason). To take an example from above, the girl who accused Courtney of bullying her before she left was publicly called a liar by Molly on twitter (her post is what is sticking out to me in my head) and several others at the time. Regardless of how that girl felt, her feelings couldn't have possibly been valid because others didn't see it the same way. Though if I remember correctly, Molly's post all but confirmed some level of behavior that some questioned at the time.

My original paragraph was in line with your comment about John not being part of a program that bullies their athletes. Regardless of why Dylan left, since there seems to be more than a few reasons in total, his feelings are still valid, while acknowledging that those coaches feel they're doing nothing wrong regardless of how they're acting/treating their kids...that was what I meant.

 

[Keep_Believing]

Okay, I think I've composed myself.
we know he accused a certain coach of bullying so I can't even pretend to feel sorry for Eddie/Orby when he didn't answer his phone after he let ya'll know.

I took that as Dylan accused them of bullying.

 

[stuntjumptumble]

It really irks me when people throw around the word bullying towards coaches. Some coaches can be tough and that's no big deal, that's life. When you've been through real, physical and emotional bullying by a coach, it's a completely different story. I just hope the kids that choose to use that word understand it and mean it and aren't throwing good coaches under the bus for no reason


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[Cheerfan1234]

This reminds me of the Sexual Harassment training I had to do when I started my job last week. Repeated concept they wanted the trainee to learn: It may not look like sexual harassment to you but if the person feels uncomfortable or feels victimized, then it is. And the courts will always seek how the "harassee" felt in this situation, not the harasser.

I'd like to apply this theory to bullying.

This has nothing to do with Dylan or cheerleading, but more with the topic of sexual harassment and bullying.

I am third-party observer in this thread, so i'm not taking any sides here but rather offering a POV on two important topics. I have been trained in both, and I understand what you're saying. However, under state law there are specific definitions for what sexual harassment is and isn't, and there are also specific definitions for what bullying is and isn't. This is not a simple black and white issue where we ask an alleged victim how he/she felt during a particular incident and then throw the book. If a court of law charged every teacher/coach with bullying every time a student or athlete felt slighted or upset, then we'd have a country of unemployed coaches and teachers...and some childless parents as well. In particular, bullying is a very serious issue that should never be taken lightly, but because it is a buzz word, many people like to throw it around lightly, sometimes very unfairly. This can sometimes do as much damage as true bullying itself.

Now back to Smoed and Dylan...If he felt bullied, he had every right to leave even if it meant his team would temporarily suffer. It does not necessarily mean that he was actually bullied. Based on dad's words, it seemed Dylan was working at 150% and simply thought the team wasn't going to live up to his expectations. I know from experience that when you're angry and frustrated, little things that wouldn't usually bother you suddenly become more dramatic. Perhaps he was simply over it and needed an out. Or, perhaps he truly was in an unhealthy environment. Somewhere in the middle of both hypotheticals is the truth, and no one involved owes it to us. All we can do is speculate and offer our POV.

 

[nicolee]

Look, there has to be some reason why Smoed constantly has kids jumping ship. I have never in my life experienced a team so unstable...
The word 'bullying' is thrown around way too much, which I take issue with as being accused of bullying a child is a serious allegation that could ruin a career. But people are always joining, leaving, coming back, complaining, leaving again, coming back, blah blah blah. I myself don't feel any sort of need to know why an 18-year-old kid wants to switch gyms – it's between him and his family – but the way I see it, there has to be something wrong with the way the program is conducted for kids to seem so unhappy.

 

[Keep_Believing]

Look, there has to be some reason why Smoed constantly has kids jumping ship. I have never in my life experienced a team so unstable...
The word 'bullying' is thrown around way too much, which I take issue with as being accused of bullying a child is a serious allegation that could ruin a career. But people are always joining, leaving, coming back, complaining, leaving again, coming back, blah blah blah. I myself don't feel any sort of need to know why an 18-year-old kid wants to switch gyms – it's between him and his family – but the way I see it, there has to be something wrong with the way the program is conducted for kids to seem so unhappy.

I think part of it is that they get kids who move for cheer. When you move off and away from your family, I think the chances are higher that you won't be happy. It is a lot bigger adjustment.

 

[Cheerfan1234]

Look, there has to be some reason why Smoed constantly has kids jumping ship. I have never in my life experienced a team so unstable...
The word 'bullying' is thrown around way too much, which I take issue with as being accused of bullying a child is a serious allegation that could ruin a career. But people are always joining, leaving, coming back, complaining, leaving again, coming back, blah blah blah. I myself don't feel any sort of need to know why an 18-year-old kid wants to switch gyms – it's between him and his family – but the way I see it, there has to be something wrong with the way the program is conducted for kids to seem so unhappy.

Maybe we don't get the warm and fuzzy family feeling because Smoed often consists of "one-hit wonders" who have ulterior motives for being on the team and then leave when the goal is met. Dylan and Janee seemed like the only athletes who seemed unhappy with the gym and its atmosphere. Those are two people on a squad of 20 now going on its 5th season. You are right, many people have left, but from what we see. the majority of them leave because they want to have a true high school experience, they miss home, or they age out. Or, they are removed because they can't cut it. I don't necessarily get the impression that the program is being mismanaged. Although the drama makes for better television, I get the impression that most of those homegrown athletes love CA as well as Eddie and Orby.

 

[Eyes On The Prize]

This has nothing to do with Dylan or cheerleading, but more with the topic of sexual harassment and bullying.

I am third-party observer in this thread, so i'm not taking any sides here but rather offering a POV on two important topics. I have been trained in both, and I understand what you're saying. However, under state law there are specific definitions for what sexual harassment is and isn't, and there are also specific definitions for what bullying is and isn't. This is not a simple black and white issue where we ask an alleged victim how he/she felt during a particular incident and then throw the book. If a court of law charged every teacher/coach with bullying every time a student or athlete felt slighted or upset, then we'd have a country of unemployed coaches and teachers...and some childless parents as well. In particular, bullying is a very serious issue that should never be taken lightly, but because it is a buzz word, many people like to throw it around lightly, sometimes very unfairly. This can sometimes do as much damage as true bullying itself.

Now back to Smoed and Dylan...If he felt bullied, he had every right to leave even if it meant his team would temporarily suffer. It does not necessarily mean that he was actually bullied. Based on dad's words, it seemed Dylan was working at 150% and simply thought the team wasn't going to live up to his expectations. I know from experience that when you're angry and frustrated, little things that wouldn't usually bother you suddenly become more dramatic. Perhaps he was simply over it and needed an out. Or, perhaps he truly was in an unhealthy environment. Somewhere in the middle of both hypotheticals is the truth, and no one involved owes it to us. All we can do is speculate and offer our POV.

I did not mean to compare this to actual sexual harassment charges, just to the theory of "if they felt wronged in someway then they felt wronged and it's not up to others to tell them if they shouldn't feel that way." In the videos I had to watch, there were many occasions that I thought "this isn't sexual harassment, this person is overreacting." But I liked the idea of not telling someone when they were or weren't wronged because I was not the one in the situation. I know that there are many grey areas in the sexual harassment and in bullying. Maybe bullying is not the right word to use in the Dylan situation.

Another thing to note: Dylan and his family obviously spent the time, effort, and money to come over to the U.S. to cheer his last year. If I wasn't getting what I expected out of a team, I'd switch too. At the end of the day, gyms are businesses and the athletes are essentially customers. If you are not happy with what goes on, how things are ran, how you are treated, you have every right to leave and go someplace else. You are the one paying the money (and lots of it) for the product.