All-Star Jamfest And Usasf Split?

[newcheerdad]

I thought USA Cheer was the governing body for "all things cheer" (including allstar)...are they one in the same?

I don't know. And I think the fact I don't know is the big problem. (and not just because I'm older and a little slow sometimes. :)

 

[coachrah]

Varsity is tops in: uniform sales, camps, competitions. They have bought up tons of competition companies. Why did they sell out to them? Because of the "if you can't beat em, join em" mentality. Varsity was pushing in on their business (holding events in a nearby town the same weekend, or the weekend before/after their event in the same town). Varsity has a much bigger wallet to work with, so they could offer a higher quality competition for less money, so they were taking all the teams from these events. After a while of this (a few years) they offered to buy out the company, and many agreed-some right way, some it took a few years. There are only a few big competition/camp companies that aren't in the "Varsity Family"...which is run by the guy who says "cheerleading isn't a sport".

Thanks for pointing to the backdoor /behind the scenes/not so nice stuff we are all suppossed to respect. Well at least you have 2 choices with Varsity: CHESS or MONOPOLY...me, I'm looking for the new game in town.

 

[Deleted member 15]

while you do have a point, some but not all gyms do base their out of state/national competition on companies that are offering bids to worlds... Why pay all that money to go far away when there is no real motivation for your gym to go? Yes not all teams are about level 5 and going to worlds but a lot of them are. I know at my gym we (our level 5 team) picks our extra competition based on what companies are offering bids to worlds. This year we happened to choose Jamfest they would not even be on our list of competitions if they were not offering bids....

How many teams that went to Super Nationals this year do you think would not go next year because they stopped offering bids to Worlds? Would losing that number of team and not spending the money on the paid bids be a financial gain or loss for JAMfest?

 

[StarshipTrooper]

Thanks for pointing to the backdoor /behind the scenes/not so nice stuff we are all suppossed to respect. Well at least you have 2 choices with Varsity: CHESS or MONOPOLY...me, I'm looking for the new game in town.

That is why I think JamFest can make work. To my way of thinking, the more you try to limit the market the more attractive alternatives become, and give options to people unhappy with the status quo. Yes I do respect them for their success. But capitalism is the reason you will have alternatives. Now, the big problem for choice comes in when the government gets involved in all aspects of the market. I do now all about that phenomenon. I would be more concered with the public sector limiting choice than Varsity.

 

[RSbrittany]

How many teams that went to Super Nationals this year do you think would not go next year because they stopped offering bids to Worlds? Would losing that number of team and not spending the money on the paid bids be a financial gain or loss for JAMfest?

I could possibly even out but we aren't talking just teams here we are talking entire programs that could possibly pull out of competing at Jamfest if they stop offering bids... programs aren't just going to pull their level 5's out of this competition. Maybe the level 5's wont affect them but entire gyms not attending certainly will. The point I am trying to get across is do you think most teams travel all the way to Indianapolis just to hangout with Jammy all weekend? I highly doubt it. Without bids what is Jamfest going to offer to draw people into traveling to their competition???

 

[StarshipTrooper]

I could possibly even out but we aren't talking just teams here we are talking entire programs that could possibly pull out of competing at Jamfest if they stop offering bids... programs aren't just going to pull their level 5's out of this competition. Maybe the level 5's wont affect them but entire gyms not attending certainly will. The point I am trying to get across is do you think most teams travel all the way to Indianapolis just to hangout with Jammy all weekend? I highly doubt it. Without bids what is Jamfest going to offer to draw people into traveling to their competition???

It will be war, and Varsity has a much bigger war chest. David and Goliath is a good analogy. Don't count the little guy out, smaller and hungrier companies tend to be more nimble and responsive. We went to Indy the last 3 years, and won, but I don't think we went solely for the bid, as last year we had one before the trip. JamFest will have to evolve, but the people running it are smart, resourceful, and don't count them out.

 

[Deleted member 15]

I could possibly even out but we aren't talking just teams here we are talking entire programs that could possibly pull out of competing at Jamfest if they stop offering bids... programs aren't just going to pull their level 5's out of this competition. Maybe the level 5's wont affect them but entire gyms not attending certainly will. The point I am trying to get across is do you think most teams travel all the way to Indianapolis just to hangout with Jammy all weekend? I highly doubt it. Without bids what is Jamfest going to offer to draw people into traveling to their competition???

I think the answer I'm looking for would have to be answered in teams because 1 program could be 1 team or 40+ teams.

Since only a minority of gyms have a Worlds eligible team and only some of the gyms with one base their competition schedule on bids, I wonder what the real impact would be.

JAMfest also has a few non Worlds qualifiers that seem to do pretty well. I was told they should have 7 events with 100+ teams, which is more than any other event producer.

They could also attempt to upgrade US Finals to be a competitor to Worlds as well as All Levels, providing the incentive @RSbrittany is looking for.

They could also be hoping these rumors somehow help them get negotiating power with the USASF that they can turn into more seats on the Board.

These rumors could also be something @kingston made up to increase traffic to the Fierce Board.

 

[canz]

Just IMO, the problem with that is cheer no longer just needs an overarching governing body in the US it just about needs a global approach. All star cheerleading is popular in Australia, New Zealand, the UK, Thailand, Europe (although not maybe to the same extent as in the US) and we should all be able to look to the one place to follow a set of rules and procedures. To use a random example in irish dance they have an overaching body called the irish dancing commission who set the rules and guidelines which everyone else globally has to abide by. Each country however has its own teachers association whose job it is to make sure the rules are being enforced in their country, set competition schedules and so on. Dancers all have to be registered with their teachers association and pay a registration fee each year. dancers also have to submit their birth certificate when they first register as proof of their age. That is held on a databse and means anyones age and eligibility can be checked easily. I think the complication that exists in cheer is that competitions at least in the US and Europe are being run by companies which at the end of the day are going to do what is profitable, if the USASF makes a decision which is negatively going to impact on that then I think you can expect that the particular company will look at doing its own thing which cannot be good long term for the appeal of all star cheerleading. In my opinion I struggle to see how we can convince others we are a legitimate sport without standardised rules and some for of central governing body who is not for profit.
-Sorry this was meant to be in reply to a post above had a blonde moment and didn't hit reply

 

[King]

@Andre
Everything on the Fierce Board is made up to increase traffic and make me a millionaire.

 

[Deleted member 15]

@Andre
Everything on the Fierce Board is made up to increase traffic and make me a millionaire.

I figured that was the case since you are retiring next year.

 

[King]

I figured that was the case since you are retiring next year.

Like the @Andre tags?

 

[StarshipTrooper]

I make conclusions up based on observations. Fact is a different thing. I hope it makes you $10 King, because it has never made me a dime.

 

[King]

I make conclusions up based on observations. Fact is a different thing. I hope it makes you $10 King, because it has never made me a dime.

Should I question your doctoring ability then?

this whole thread has made me $500 so far! (no really... maybe about a $1 a day on ads? just about enough to cover the $75 a month hosting)

 

[StarshipTrooper]

Should I question your doctoring ability then?

this whole thread has made me $500 so far! (no really... maybe about a $1 a day on ads? just about enough to cover the $75 a month hosting)

No, I'm good at that. But intuition is key there. My conclusions on Cheerleading are suspect to say the least. But I did have the pleasure of talking to a few people over a couple of Reislings this weekend who actually know stuff. So on this, I could be right.

 

[King]

Talking to someone earlier today on this. The USASF needs to not only be a governing body, but a logistics company. Handle and organize all the logistics of cheerleading, make it easy, and free to the EP's and Gyms and everyone would want to stay with the USASF. But what do I know?