High School Male Flyers

[oncecoolcoachnowmom]

I do not take issue with boys flying.

However, I do have a question/concern about males flying as it relates to college cheer.

We all know that the main roles of males in college cheer = basing and tumbling, largely.

Also many coed collegiate cheer coaches are die-hard traditionalists in this area.

Is mostly flyer boy going to be able to make a coed college squad when he has little coed stunting experience?

Is he going the small coed route?

 

[Keep_Believing]

From what I have seen with the exception of baskets and sometimes mid layer in a pyramid, males don't fly after they hit puberty. It ends up being a physics/size issue.

 

[AndyT_T]

Toe touches are not a part of most sports.

But it is a part of our sport.

 

[AndyT_T]

Why is staying coed such a big deal? If boys aren't interested go all girl, it's not a big deal. Why are we bending over backwards changing our sport to appeal to athletes that clearly aren't dedicated or interested.

As a side note, I am living for this not-so-subtle subtext of "I have to make cheerleading seem as un-gay as possible so that straight boys will be willing to try it. In order to keep them interested I have to butch the sport up and remove anything that might be construed as faggy in any way."

 

[AndyT_T]

I do not take issue with boys flying.

However, I do have a question/concern about males flying as it relates to college cheer.

We all know that the main roles of males in college cheer = basing and tumbling, largely.

Also many coed collegiate cheer coaches are die-hard traditionalists in this area.

Is mostly flyer boy going to be able to make a coed college squad when he has little coed stunting experience?

Is he going the small coed route?

I know university of Wisconsin has a male flyer, or at least had one. But most college male flyers only do baskets and occasionally pyramid.
I have heard at NCA a male flying stunts would negatively effect your collegiate image score (Remember when the USASF tried to make a rule about "Flamboyant" motions being done by men and got shut down? The rule is still very much real at NCA) - and I believe UCA has something similar where you're supposed to look like an "all-American" man/woman.

Plus, I'm sure school administrators play a part in boys being ground bound, since the team represents the school and generally overtly flamboyant behavior is not well received by the administrators.

I got in trouble my freshman year when an administrator saw me playing with a friends poms after the game was over and contacted my coach. I also got in trouble for wearing foundation when I cheered games (Im a MAC makeup artist and have cystic acne, I didn't want people to be able to see something I am very self conscious about so I covered it), again when an administrator contacted my coach.
I can only imagine what they'd say if a boy went up and did a High Split in front of the crowd.

Again, I could write a doctoral presentation on the implications of that and the implied instruction to enforce heteronormativity which is presented in just the right way to avoid a discrimination lawsuit. And, for that matter, how that would never fly in an NCAA sport because of it's anti-discrimination policies but because we aren't athletes we're cheerleaders/school representatives its totally okay, but thats probably for a thread all it's own lol

Edit: I do not blame my coaches at Lindenwood at all, nor do I think the situation would have been handled any differently at another university. Clearly I was very happy at my school since I am a walking billboard for it ;)

 

[Ashley]

I know university of Wisconsin has a male flyer, or at least had one. But most college male flyers only do baskets and occasionally pyramid.
I have heard at NCA a male flying stunts would negatively effect your collegiate image score (Remember when the USASF tried to make a rule about "Flamboyant" motions being done by men and got shut down? The rule is still very much real at NCA) - and I believe UCA has something similar where you're supposed to look like an "all-American" man/woman.

Plus, I'm sure school administrators play a part in boys being ground bound, since the team represents the school and generally overtly flamboyant behavior is not well received by the administrators.

I got in trouble my freshman year when an administrator saw me playing with a friends poms after the game was over and contacted my coach. I also got in trouble for wearing foundation when I cheered games (Im a MAC makeup artist and have cystic acne, I didn't want people to be able to see something I am very self conscious about so I covered it), again when an administrator contacted my coach.
I can only imagine what they'd say if a boy went up and did a High Split in front of the crowd.

Again, I could write a doctoral presentation on the implications of that and the implied instruction to enforce heteronormativity which is presented in just the right way to avoid a discrimination lawsuit. And, for that matter, how that would never fly in an NCAA sport because of it's anti-discrimination policies but because we aren't athletes we're cheerleaders/school representatives its totally okay, but thats probably for a thread all it's own lol

If cheer were an NCAA sport it would be all girl and boys wouldn't be involved at all so it wouldn't be an issue.

 

[Keep_Believing]

Curious, how do y'all feel about all male team? I have seen a couple of videos of all male teams from other countries.

 

[Ashley]

Curious, how do y'all feel about all male team? I have seen a couple of videos of all male teams from other countries.

I think it's a fun novelty, but that's it.

 

[SparkleSpankies]

I had a boy that wanted to try out 2 years ago, could tumble, was talented, but he did a co-ed all star team. He had a heart to heart with me and said, he also wanted to play lacrosse and felt the guys on the team wouldn't respect him, but since he knew he had his eyes set on cheering in college, he was able to get co-ed stunting experience. I also think if he was told he was flying, he would have looked at me like I was out of my mind.

Fair enough.

 

[OldskoolKYcheercoach]

If cheer were an NCAA sport it would be all girl and boys wouldn't be involved at all so it wouldn't be an issue.

You beat me to this one. This is one of the many reasons I proudly proclaim to everyone who will listen that cheerleading is not and should never be a sport

 

[AndyT_T]

If it is privately owned, that CEO can do as they please. As can a gym owner/coach of a privately owned gym.

Just look at Hobby Lobby or any of the other religious private companies in America. They won't hire gay people. Same with private schools.

And to play devil's advocate in this convo: as a coach of a sports team, aren't you paid for your personal preferences, style, and decision making skills to put the best routine/team out there?

Hobby lobby can't discriminate in hiring based on religion, the supreme court directly addressed that. Privately owned or not CEOs have to follow federal laws.

Private schools get a pass generally because of loopholes in education laws. If they require a religion class as a pre rec they can say that teaching their religion is a part of the schools core curriculum and, in some cases, the courts have shown leeway in allowing them to discriminate because of that.
That is not to say it is right, or that it isn't changing. BJU lifted it's interracial dating ban, which they claimed was part of their religious freedoms, after having lost their tax exempt status because of discriminatory policies.

Besides, I don't think saying "Other places have discriminatory practices so it's okay for me to have discriminatory practices too" is really the argument anyone should be making lol

 

[AndyT_T]

If cheer were an NCAA sport it would be all girl and boys wouldn't be involved at all so it wouldn't be an issue.

I didn't say it should be an NCAA sport, you're missing my point. Im saying that it is important to note that we casually accept something in high school/college cheerleading that both NCAA and all-star cheerleading have ruled as being a discriminatory practice.

You beat me to this one. This is one of the many reasons I proudly proclaim to everyone who will listen that cheerleading is not and should never be a sport

Cheerleading can be a sport without being an NCAA sport.
It can be olympic without being NCAA.
It can be (and is) recognized as a sport at the state level without affecting it's ability to be coed.

 

[luluscamom]

I will! As earlier stated, it's my opinion (which was what the original question asked for) and I don't care what people think of it. If you don't want a truthful answer then don't ask the question. If my opinion makes someone uncomfortable then perhaps they'll understand how high school aged BOYS flying, except in baskets, make me feel.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[Ashley]

I didn't say it should be an NCAA sport, you're missing my point. Im saying that it is important to note that we casually accept something in high school/college cheerleading that both NCAA and all-star cheerleading have ruled as being a discriminatory practice.

I'm not missing your point, I know you weren't saying it should be an NCAA sport. But no NCAA sport is coed with roles based on gender, so you can't say "this wouldn't fly in an NCAA sport."

 

[quitthedrama]

I'm not missing your point, I know you weren't saying it should be an NCAA sport. But no NCAA sport is coed with roles based on gender, so you can't say "this wouldn't fly in an NCAA sport."

I just read an article that a female kicker received a scholarship to play college football, so I'm not sure if this is accurate any longer. I think NCAA sports that don't have separate men and women teams are going to have some evolution in terms of gender in the future.