All-Star "name" Of Gym Affecting Placement?

[wcsstilldeath]

I dont necessarily believe it has to do with the name of the gym, but the number of teams the gym brings to the competition. If the gym with 20 teams keeps winning then they will be happy and they will keep coming back season after season paying for comp fees, spectator admission, food, dvds etc If the gym with 4 teams is unhappy, its not as big of a loss for the companies. I've only seen this done a couple of times, usually at a crap competition.

 

[peytonnmariee]

I dont necessarily believe it has to do with the name of the gym, but the number of teams the gym brings to the competition. If the gym with 20 teams keeps winning then they will be happy and they will keep coming back season after season paying for comp fees, spectator admission, food, dvds etc If the gym with 4 teams is unhappy, its not as big of a loss for the companies. I've only seen this done a couple of times, usually at a crap competition.

serisouly?! i honestly have never seen this before.....

 

[yojaehs]

If this is the case, your attending a poorly produced event and I suggest that you not return.

 

[wcsstilldeath]

serisouly?! i honestly have never seen this before.....

Yeah, think about it. If a gym with 20 teams (and all the parents that come along with those athletes) is unhappy with the competition and they dont return, thats a huge loss for the competition. I honestly have only speculated that this has happened a couple times, and they were at no-name competitions.

 

[BlueCat]

As I have tried to point out to many an event producer, when teams/coaches/athletes/fans don't understand a result, they simply fill in that unknown with an assumption - usually one that goes against the event producer. (as evidenced by the above posts)

 

[laughAlittle]

I dont necessarily believe it has to do with the name of the gym, but the number of teams the gym brings to the competition. If the gym with 20 teams keeps winning then they will be happy and they will keep coming back season after season paying for comp fees, spectator admission, food, dvds etc If the gym with 4 teams is unhappy, its not as big of a loss for the companies. I've only seen this done a couple of times, usually at a crap competition.

i have seen this a few times before.

 

[WorkToWin]

As I have tried to point out to many an event producer, when teams/coaches/athletes/fans don't understand a result, they simply fill in that unknown with an assumption - usually one that goes against the event producer. (as evidenced by the above posts)

which also makes me wonder is there a certain reason some event producers don't allow scores to be shown? Is there something to hide?

 

[GreatWhite92]

which also makes me wonder is there a certain reason some event producers don't allow scores to be shown? Is there something to hide?

Thats what I question. Why not show the scores? Whats holding them back?

 

[ACEDAD]

As I have tried to point out to many an event producer, when teams/coaches/athletes/fans don't understand a result, they simply fill in that unknown with an assumption - usually one that goes against the event producer. (as evidenced by the above posts)

Agreed. And as BlueCat knows, I've been a big proponent of making all scores (not comments) public immediately. But he and I have been, mostly, voices in the wind.

I've also been a huge supporter of "transparency" in all phases of USASF from the finances, to credentialing, to EP scoring, to EP bid criteria, to Worlds scoring, etc.

The more transparent this sport is, the stronger it becomes.

 

[drewpate]

Agreed. And as BlueCat knows, I've been a big proponent of making all scores (not comments) public immediately. But he and I have been, mostly, voices in the wind.

I've also been a huge supporter of "transparency" in all phases of USASF from the finances, to credentialing, to EP scoring, to EP bid criteria, to Worlds scoring, etc.

The more transparent this sport is, the stronger it becomes.

I think the main reason they don't is so we can't be certain there were scoring mistakes (let's assume honest ones here). Think of it like this, right now we can assume mistakes but not prove them. If the scores for tge categories are made totally open, it's just a matter of watching the tapes and seeing big discrepancies. You see a pattern of those throughout the day and you won't return. People get madder when they can prove something than when they think it.


I remember a competition company that I attended while cheering my first year who made the scores public. We lost to the home gym ( tho it was a national). Turns out they had valued their elite stunt sequence at 15/15 with walk in hands extension power press arabesque double. (on difficulty). Our 7 true coed full ups stretch pop off walk in tic toc half up scored 7/15 on difficulty. We lost due to that difference and the gym never returned.

 

[GreatWhite92]

I think the main reason they don't is so we can't be certain there were scoring mistakes (let's assume honest ones here). Think of it like this, right now we can assume mistakes but not prove them. If the scores for tge categories are made totally open, it's just a matter of watching the tapes and seeing big discrepancies. You see a pattern of those throughout the day and you won't return. People get madder when they can prove something than when they think it.


I remember a competition company that I attended while cheering my first year who made the scores public. We lost to the home gym ( tho it was a national). Turns out they had valued their elite stunt sequence at 15/15 with walk in hands extension power press arabesque double. (on difficulty). Our 7 true coed full ups stretch pop off walk in tic toc half up scored 7/15 on difficulty. We lost due to that difference and the gym never returned.

This is exactly why scores should be posted...I wouldnt mind weeding out the biased competitions. If they become known for unfair scoring than its their own fault.

 

[BlueCat]

I think the main reason they don't is so we can't be certain there were scoring mistakes (let's assume honest ones here). Think of it like this, right now we can assume mistakes but not prove them. If the scores for tge categories are made totally open, it's just a matter of watching the tapes and seeing big discrepancies. You see a pattern of those throughout the day and you won't return. People get madder when they can prove something than when they think it.


I remember a competition company that I attended while cheering my first year who made the scores public. We lost to the home gym ( tho it was a national). Turns out they had valued their elite stunt sequence at 15/15 with walk in hands extension power press arabesque double. (on difficulty). Our 7 true coed full ups stretch pop off walk in tic toc half up scored 7/15 on difficulty. We lost due to that difference and the gym never returned.

I fear that you speak the truth. However, making EPs feel pressure to be more open with the scoring will eventually help this problem. The scoring systems (scoresheets, judge training, data entry, data reporting) will improve dramatically - which is something the sport needs desperately.

 

[JoeTwister]

Also, if they let ALL of the scoring be public (categories, etc.), then people could at least have an idea of why Team A beats Team B instead of making assumptions or making up their own reasons.

One of my favorite changes made by NCA last year was their attempt to do this. I was very pleased when I recieved my ranking sheets after day 1.

 

[BlueCat]

One of my favorite changes made by NCA last year was their attempt to do this. I was very pleased when I recieved my ranking sheets after day 1.

They are heading in the right direction, certainly.

 

[GreatWhite92]

I fear that you speak the truth. However, making EPs feel pressure to be more open with the scoring will eventually help this problem. The scoring systems (scoresheets, judge training, data entry, data reporting) will improve dramatically - which is something the sport needs desperately.

Obviously I don't have any influence what so ever, so I ask all of you who do to not give up on pressuring them to post scores because the secrecy only makes people question whether they are being treated fairly.