All-Star Purpose Of Safety Certification For Coaches

[CharlotteASMom]

I was learning a lot from this thread. I don't see the reason to start making it personal.

 

[ztaprincess]

There is no need to start an argument in this thread and get it locked like the CEA one. This thread can easily not focus on CEA so that fighting isn't necessary. Rich and wcdad never mentioned CEA or Courtney so it seems that instead of them attacking it is you coming in this thread and attacking them. I would really like for this to be another discussion instead of another locked thread.

 

[wcdad]

Rich Allen & Michael Wiggins. Wouldn't your more appropriate question be...

"What is the purpose of Courtney Pope having a Safety Certification?"

Because it's evident that this nothing but a means to continue you're assault on her tactics and program.
If it matters that much to you, I suggest you write to the Rules Committee and have your voice heard at their next meeting. You two are capable of achieving nothing but, making yourselves feel good because you keep this topic going. If something is going to be done it will be done on the committee level by those that serve with Courtney.

Try to be a little less transparent, you could have let this topic wait a week or so before dredging it back up for rehashing.

You are missing the point of the thread, No names were brought into this until you just did. There are many examples that can be brought into this as Andree just pointed out. This is a topic as a parent I feel needs to be addressed.

 

[wcdad]

How can you micro manage every practice at every gym....goodness....Certify the coaches...deduct when there are violations in routines..move on....how can the USASF dabble into what goes on at every practice? It's like the Government taking away my salt etc...regulations most times lead to cost and control...set your rules for coaches and comps....thats it....no micro managing..we parents (customers) are not stupid...if we feel a coach is being "dangerous"...we wouldnt be there!!!! We don't need some regulator to tell us what our practice can be like..... IMO

Every other sport has rules and enforcment of them. Does not seem to stop Baseball, Football, Hockey, etc

The issue I see is that the USASF implys they are the regulator to the parent that is just starting out.

 

[lakerfantlc]

Every other sport has rules and enforcment of them. Does not seem to stop Baseball, Football, Hockey, etc

The issue I see is that the USASF implys they are the regulator to the parent that is just starting out.

As a parent... We respect the serenity part.... Govern what you have control over... Micromanaging and fretting about weather other gyms comply seems a waste of time....IMO

 

[Deleted member 15]

The issue I see is that the USASF implys they are the regulator to the parent that is just starting out.

I don't think the parent that is just starting out knows anything about the USASF. I never had a parent come to my gym and say they found me via the USASF or asked anything about the USASF. Once they showed up I informed them about the USASF as I told them about the things we were doing to teach their kids in a safe manner.

 

[drewpate]

There was a team this last year in my area that had two catchers for braced inversions in their pyramid at EVERY competition last year for the entire pyramid. Wasn't caught at the first comp.... (don't get me started on that safety judge.... caught a bunch of illegal stuff in the morning that was actually legal, and then didn't catch a single thing in the level 3 and up routines, even though i counted at least ten) but I know of at least 2 or 3 comps where they got warnings and deductions, and they still kept doing it. Their argument was since it was international coed 5, they could do it. I guess that they thought they had a special mix of level 5 and 6 rules. Sometimes you just can't fix stupid.

 

[yojaehs]

I hear where everyone is coming from. I do think that coaches should be held to a higher level, and when many try to use the USASF certification (which can be passed easily, but that's a different debate) I feel that they should be held to some sort of standard if they are continuously competing illegal elements. I would HOPE that as a parent you would address that with your coaches. I think the best the USASF can do is to make stricter guidelines for coaches to pass these tests. I don't think @meanj was appropriate in his statement bc although the CEA legalities have been previously addressed this is a WORLD WIDE legality problem (cough cough), I appreciate all comments that have been made so far. I hold safety to the highest standard, at my gym we have increased in numbers as we have decreased in injuries. Education is the key and parents hold the key chain!

 

[Batch]

I would hope and expect that he would become certified in Level 6 stunts if he was coaching an Allstar Team under a USASF Gym.

Is this even possible??

 

[lollypop]

I'm not to sure about this, but do the rules have any impact on insurance in regards to injury? I would have thought that if you were doing skills that were outside what the rules allowed or the coaches were not certified to an appropriate level that it would impact on how covered by insurance, though I am not certain on the correlation.

 

[MissBee]

If I were the lady in charge (but I'm not) here's how I would do it:
During June/July your team pays a USASF certifier to come out an evaluate your team. You show the stunting and tumbling that you team has mastered (hits 9 times out of 10) and the certifier signs off on that. So if you are mastering Level 3 tumbling and level 4 stunts, you are certified as a Level 3 team for that season. This means that at competitions your team should be performing Level 3 only skills.
There would be also be a practice certification signed off by the evaluator. This would be determined by your percentage of proficiency on the skills and tumbling for that level. For example, if your team is evaluated as hitting Level 3 stunts 60-80% of the time, you can compete Level 3, but can still only practice Level 3 skills. This is to encourage the team to work towards perfecting their technique and increasing strength. If your team is evaluated as hitting Level 3 stunts 80-100% of the time, the evaluator will sign off for competition at Level 3, but practicing toward Level 4 stunts.
This would allow teams to safely progress through the levels, without worrying about teams trying out skills that are too hard for them, or trying skills before they are ready. This would also increase safety for everyone involved, and would protect the coaches from negligence charges....if they were following the guidelines for the certified practice or competition level (and are providing a safe environment in regards to matting, lighting etc) then they have done everything within their power to provide a safe environment and it was simply an accident that Susie got hurt (inherent risk).

 

[MissBee]

I'm not to sure about this, but do the rules have any impact on insurance in regards to injury? I would have thought that if you were doing skills that were outside what the rules allowed or the coaches were not certified to an appropriate level that it would impact on how covered by insurance, though I am not certain on the correlation.

I know that for AACCA/NFHS, if a coach is certified and the team is doing skills appropriate for their level on the appropriate surface, then the coach is covered by their $1M insurance coverage. However, if a coach is certified and has the team doing skills outside of their level (i.e.; basket tosses for MS, or 3 high pyramids for HS) then the AACCA will not back that coach in the event of a lawsuit.

 

[King]

Catching up with the thread (so I may have missed some points):

It is very hard and expensive to enforce all the rules 100% of the time. As an example we don't have cops at every stop sign to make sure everyone does a full 5 second stop. We also don't rely on on citizens themselves to police every single stop sign and turn people in (creating a sort of secret police situation).

The most practical way of handling it is like I said. Have any breaking of the rule in a competition environment take a team out of contention. Then a coach has little to gain by consciously breaking these rules and will go out of their way to break the rules.

I am just not a fan of unenforceable rules.

 

[REA Dad]

Every other sport has rules and enforcment of them. Does not seem to stop Baseball, Football, Hockey, etc

The issue I see is that the USASF implys they are the regulator to the parent that is just starting out.

I haver 4 children and all are involved in numerous sports. None of these other sports have rules for practice other than general safety rules.

Examples:
Football: required pads and mouthpiece must be used during contact drills.
Wrestling: headgear must be worn while wrestling.
Softball: batting helmet must be worn.

None of the governing bodies of these sports tell you as a coach what you can or can't teach at practice. They just make sure the athletes are safe and you are safe as a coach. If you teach football players to hold instead of block at practice you aren't breaking any rules until you play the game and get the penalty for your players holding.

USASF has the same general safety rules in place, if you don't know them they are located here - http://rules.fierceboard.com/?p=29

 

[wcdad]

I haver 4 children and all are involved in numerous sports. None of these other sports have rules for practice other than general safety rules.

Examples:
Football: required pads and mouthpiece must be used during contact drills.
Wrestling: headgear must be worn while wrestling.
Softball: batting helmet must be worn.

None of the governing bodies of these sports tell you as a coach what you can or can't teach at practice. They just make sure the athletes are safe and you are safe as a coach. If you teach football players to hold instead of block at practice you aren't breaking any rules until you play the game and get the penalty for your players holding.

USASF has the same general safety rules in place, if you don't know them they are located here - http://rules.fierceboard.com/?p=29

Little league has pitch counts for the kids. Like you said there are rules that can be enforced during practice if a officer of the program sees the Infraction

Football has as you said rules that are enforced during practice. Chop blocks clipping etc. all in place for safety. Again a coach can be held accountable at any given time.

The underlying issue is in cheer leading you have coaches that are teaching skills that are known to not be legal at any level We have a unique situation in cheer, if a team does 10 comps a year that is a lot. But at the most counts for 20 days or about 20 hours. Yet a team will practice a minimum of 2 days a week for a minimum of 2 hrs a practice 208 hrs a year. Not including clinics, camps, and extra practices Clearly more time spent in practice. The reason more injuries are received in practice.