All-Star A Growing Issue... I.e. Crossovers On Worlds Teams (for Bid Obtaining Purposes)

[MomOf2ThatsMe]

and what happens to those 10 athetes that those new 10 are replacing??? as a parent, i would be outraged. all for the cost of gaining a globe? pathetic...

Those 10 athletes are probably going to go to Worlds with another team from their gym, but I wouldn't want to have to pay the crossover fees for my kid to compete for a bid so somebody else can go to worlds. Screw that!

 

[fabulousity]

and what happens to those 10 athetes that those new 10 are replacing??? as a parent, i would be outraged. all for the cost of gaining a globe? pathetic...

Considering the number of athletes involved, I am under the impression that the lesser skilled athletes were removed in order to secure a bid. Many of them will probably return back to their team now that the check is in the mail. So that decent level 5 team that got the bid will probably be back to tuck and layout central come April.

 

[cheerisgood]

Considering the number of athletes involved, I am under the impression that the lesser skilled athletes were removed in order to secure a bid. Many of them will probably return back to their team now that the check is in the mail. So that decent level 5 team that got the bid will probably be back to tuck and layout central come April.

as per my previous post....pathetic. or perhaps the 'tryouts' mentioned in another post will allow for some 'other' age eglible athletes with certain skills to be moved? i'm not sure, but isn't the rule that they just have had to competed where the bid was won?? i may be mistaken in that.

 

[redsmom]

as per my previous post....pathetic. or perhaps the 'tryouts' mentioned in another post will allow for some 'other' age eglible athletes with certain skills to be moved? i'm not sure, but isn't the rule that they just have had to competed where the bid was won?? i may be mistaken in that.

The rule that applies to substitutions is as follows:
· A Maximum of 10 substitutions will be allowed per team for The Cheerleading Worlds Championship.
A substitute must be a regular paid participant from another team at the same gym and must have competed “on the floor” with that team from that gym at the same event where the bid was awarded. All substitutes must meet the same eligibility requirements as the original team that was awarded a bid (i.e. age, etc.).

WORLDS ALTERNATES: Of the 10 possible substitutes, one to three of those 10 may be alternates. Alternates are registered members of the same team’s gym where the bid was received. Alternates do not have to be rostered or in attendance at the Worlds bid qualifying event where the bid was received.

So 3 just need to be members of the gym (could be new members, possibly released from other gyms), the other 7 must have competed at the bid event.

 

[tumbleyoda]

Well look where we are having this conversation... In an environment that would become increasingly hostile at the mere mention of the PROVEN culprits, yet alone allegations.

I will say this: there are hundreds of programs who could do this and they do not. Maybe because of moral standing? Maybe because of breadth of talent? Not sure, but they don't do it.

In the case of CEA, I do not applaud habitual line stepping. I do not praise individuals who actions always need explanations and clarifications. This cannot be spun as business savvy or innovation, this is monopolizing. Taking opportunities from true talent for self praise and recognition.

What's done is done, but moving forward new rules have to be in place to stop all of this tip toeing.

The best analogy I could think of is that no matter what the speed limit, I do my best to drive 5 miles under. Sure I have to leave a bit earlier and of course people think I am driving too slow. But I also don't get speeding tickets, don't get nervous when I see police staked out looking for speeders and get where I am going. Many more drive just the limit. They too get where they are going without fear of tickets. Still others play in that supposed 5 miles above the limit area. Now the nerves are little bit more on edge here but they assume that since it is not financially profitable to give a 5 mile over the limit ticket or that a lawyer could get it thrown out on speedometer errors they believe themselves to be safe. Yet there are many who drive above the limit no matter what until they get a ticket. They slow down for a few days then push it again. Their belief is that they wont be caught, it is worth the price of the ticket to get wherever they are going fast or if they do get a ticket they can argue their way out of it.

 

[cheerisgood]

The rule that applies to substitutions is as follows:
· A Maximum of 10 substitutions will be allowed per team for The Cheerleading Worlds Championship.
A substitute must be a regular paid participant from another team at the same gym and must have competed “on the floor” with that team from that gym at the same event where the bid was awarded. All substitutes must meet the same eligibility requirements as the original team that was awarded a bid (i.e. age, etc.).

WORLDS ALTERNATES: Of the 10 possible substitutes, one to three of those 10 may be alternates. Alternates are registered members of the same team’s gym where the bid was received. Alternates do not have to be rostered or in attendance at the Worlds bid qualifying event where the bid was received.

So 3 just need to be members of the gym (could be new members, possibly released from other gyms), the other 7 must have competed at the bid event.

thanks for the clarification....so it's open game if i'm reading this correctly...new teams, new routines, anything goes within the constraint of the 10, as long as they are age eligable...and i'm not even going there.

 

[cheer8]

Those 10 athletes are probably going to go to Worlds with another team from their gym, but I wouldn't want to have to pay the crossover fees for my kid to compete for a bid so somebody else can go to worlds. Screw that!

Most of these cross overs don't pay cross over fees... Special treatment ;-)

 

[Bystander]

Most of these cross overs don't pay cross over fees... Special treatment ;-)

Prove that

 

[redsmom]

Most of these cross overs don't pay cross over fees... Special treatment ;-)

Prove that

Irrelevant to the conversation, other threads have discussed crossover fees and different gyms handle them differently. Each gym is entitled to handle them however they want. The crossover fees are small potatoes when a full paid bid is at stake. IMO

(Edited to add, these athletes may not have been crossing at the bid comp since their primary team may not have been in attendance, so they are really just paying the competition fee for a chance to compete.)

 

[tumbleyoda]

The rule that applies to substitutions is as follows:
· A Maximum of 10 substitutions will be allowed per team for The Cheerleading Worlds Championship.
A substitute must be a regular paid participant from another team at the same gym and must have competed “on the floor” with that team from that gym at the same event where the bid was awarded. All substitutes must meet the same eligibility requirements as the original team that was awarded a bid (i.e. age, etc.).

WORLDS ALTERNATES: Of the 10 possible substitutes, one to three of those 10 may be alternates. Alternates are registered members of the same team’s gym where the bid was received. Alternates do not have to be rostered or in attendance at the Worlds bid qualifying event where the bid was received.

So 3 just need to be members of the gym (could be new members, possibly released from other gyms), the other 7 must have competed at the bid event.

Define in a way that would be enforceable what a registered member of the gym. Because in previous years this was another grey area that left opening to be exploited. And IIRC there have been gyms that have challenged this based on their understanding of what this meant.

 

[Bystander]

Irrelevant to the conversation, other threads have discussed crossover fees and different gyms handle them differently. Each gym is entitled to handle them however they want. The crossover fees are small potatoes when a full paid bid is at stake. IMO

(Edited to add, these athletes may not have been crossing at the bid comp since their primary team may not have been in attendance, so they are really just paying the competition fee for a chance to compete.)

you are right!

 

[cheer8]

The best analogy I could think of is that no matter what the speed limit, I do my best to drive 5 miles under. Sure I have to leave a bit earlier and of course people think I am driving too slow. But I also don't get speeding tickets, don't get nervous when I see police staked out looking for speeders and get where I am going. Many more drive just the limit. They too get where they are going without fear of tickets. Still others play in that supposed 5 miles above the limit area. Now the nerves are little bit more on edge here but they assume that since it is not financially profitable to give a 5 mile over the limit ticket or that a lawyer could get it thrown out on speedometer errors they believe themselves to be safe. Yet there are many who drive above the limit no matter what until they get a ticket. They slow down for a few days then push it again. Their belief is that they wont be caught, it is worth the price of the ticket to get wherever they are going fast or if they do get a ticket they can argue their way out of it.

But newer people in this industry need to know that these people doing this are not "GOD"
You don;t have to be scared of them... At meetings, competitions etc... Call their butts out. GROW SOME PEOPLE!

I say this b/c look at tumbleyodas example. One day these speeders will cause a wreck and take out people who are following the rules. Think about it people. I have been in this industry for going on 17 years now. I speak my mind and everyone that knows me knows it. I will keep speaking b/c I know I won't be taken out by anyone!

Will you speak up before you are taken out by the speeder?

Can't wait till Doral!

 

[cheer8]

Prove that

Don't have to prove it and I said nothing was wrong with it.
If I go to a store and want a candy bar and it cost $1 and go to another store and its a dollar but buy one get one free! What would you do! Just saying most aren't paying cross over fees. If you think different then you are oblivious!

 

[tucknduck]

Bottom line is with 20 large on the line, you're gonna do whatever it is you need to do to get that loot for Worlds. The ONLY solution is to get rid of crossovers all together and do what other sports do. On a HS varsity team, they go to the JV to call up a player. They don't go to another HS varsity team and borrow a player. In cheer, they need to eliminate crossovers all togetherand replace with callups from the lower levels. You take your top level 4 athletes and replace injured athletes that way and if the routine needs to be altered to fit that athlete, then so be it. That''s what good coaches do. they adjust and get the best out of what they got to work with. No way should athletes be crossing from one team to the next. It ain't legit. A single governing body needs to run all-star cheer and athletes should be registered with these organizations with their age, level and team they're on.

Callups should only be done to replace injured athletes and you limit the number of callups to say 3. Any more, then you should work with less on the roster and adjust the routine..Simple as that.

There is no reason for crossovers..period....My way will work ONLY if crossovers are eliminated and move to a call-up system.. If it's a safety issue for the lower level athletes that peeps are gonna complain about, you move up your best level 4 or best level 4 at the position you need to replace up to level 5, then the coaches need to work them in with the skills they have. When a player is injured in the major leagues, they call up a player from the minors fully expecting they're not going to have the same success as the established major leaguer so the manager utilizes the player to the best of his ability out of a need, the need being to replace an injured player. What this system does is also shows how strong the gym is when they can use call-ups in a pinch and can do well in tournaments. It reflects those coaches who are working with the athletes at the lower levels that help them improve every year.

Eliminate crossovers...Introduce call-ups...It's the only way..period.

 

[imrichhowboutu]

Here is an easy solution to the rule that you must have competed at the competition.

On every team you bring, you roster as many people that are eligible for that specific division.

So in this particular instance, if Gym X wants to replace athletes on a senior team after a bid is obtained, at Competition J, they would do the following

• Roster 10 athletes in the following divisions ages 12-14
• Lg Sr 4.2, Sm Sr 4.2, Lg Sr 2, Lg Sr 2, Lg Sr 3, Lg Sr 3, Sm Sr 3, Lg Sr Coed 3, Sm Sr 4, Sm Sr 4, Sm Sr Cd 4, Sm Cd 5, Sr Restricted 5, Med Coed 5

• Roster 10 athletes in the following divisions that are ages 12-14
• Sm Jr 4, Lg jr 5, Lg Jr 3, Jr Cd 3

Now you can pull any age eligible athlete off of any of those teams PLUS up to 170 athletes that you rostered as alternates that weren't actually at the competition. In theory, you could roster every athlete in your program, whether or not they competed.