All-Star Amazing Level 2 Teams?

[TheUltimateFan]

Actually, I've re-thought my last statement. If a small gym can't field a level 5 team, what are the odds that they are going to have 100% of their cheerleaders performing at any given level? We've been with small gyms. It's a struggle. So even if you had a level 5 athlete competing down to level 3, odds are you wouldn't have 100% solid level 3 skills for every athlete on that team anyway. So it may level the playing field.

 

[5-6-7-8]

Another tough question. What if there is a small gym that can't field a level 5 team? Do they register their level 5 athletes as level 4 (thereby allowing them to compete level 3)? Then we have defeated our own intent.

Maybe this is addressed by saying a team needs to be a majority "level" skill. So in this scenario, a small level team can be made up of 11 (50% + 1) level 4 athletes and 9 level 5 (or level 3) athletes.

 

[TheUltimateFan]

Maybe this is addressed by saying a team needs to be a majority "level" skill. So in this scenario, a small level team can be made up of 11 (50% + 1) level 4 athletes and 9 level 5 (or level 3) athletes.

:) The pieces are coming together.....

 

[CGAcheer]

Maybe this is addressed by saying a team needs to be a majority "level" skill. So in this scenario, a small level team can be made up of 11 (50% + 1) level 4 athletes and 9 level 5 (or level 3) athletes.

What if you are 1/3 3,4,5? You get to pick whichever

Perhaps an average

 

[DJ]

:) The pieces are coming together.....

You should be a speaker at the USASF conference, you're great at coaching people to arrive at great solutions to the problem at hand. :)

 

[RockstarCheer]

What are the specifications or qualities that are going to define a Level athlete? I have kids that have Level 2 or 3 tumbling that are on a Level 5 team. I may have a Level 4 tumbler who is brand new to cheer, terrible at jumps, motions, dance and has never based that I place on a Level 2 team. Your idea or definitions of what a Level athlete is may be different in mine. I believe that's a big problem. At Rockstar, we don't place all of our athletes on a team based on their tumbling skill level. There is so much more to the score sheet than tumbling. This is why you have Level play, Level guidelines.

 

[TheUltimateFan]

What if you are 1/3 3,4,5? You get to pick whichever

Perhaps an average

That would center an athlete in a range like we described, but the only challenge I see with that is that you could have 2/3 of your team be level 4 or 5 and compete as level 3, giving you the 'majority skill' you need to hit the scoresheet - at a level lower than the skill of your athletes. Even at 50% you still would have 50% level 4 or 5 that could hit the sheet. I think it would have to be more like 2/3 at the declared level, 1/3 crossovers. As far as the small gym goes, if you can't put 2/3 of the people you need on a small team at a certain level, you probably shouldn't field a team at that level anyway. Right? (Small gym owners, please feel free to dive in here).

 

[TheUltimateFan]

You should be a speaker at the USASF conference, you're great at coaching people to arrive at great solutions to the problem at hand. :)

Aww, thanks. It's part of what I do in my real job. But it only works when you have other people willing to brainstorm together to work through the weaknesses and strengths of your position.

However, nobody is going to get me to speak in front of a group that size except my boss and he has to threaten me to get me there. I am inherently shy. :oops: :D

 

[TheUltimateFan]

What are the specifications or qualities that are going to define a Level athlete? I have kids that have Level 2 or 3 tumbling that are on a Level 5 team. I may have a Level 4 tumbler who is brand new to cheer, terrible at jumps, motions, dance and has never based that I place on a Level 2 team. Your idea or definitions of what a Level athlete is may be different in mine. I believe that's a big problem. At Rockstar, we don't place all of our athletes on a team based on their tumbling skill level. There is so much more to the score sheet than tumbling. This is why you have Level play, Level guidelines.

See that's the beauty of this. The decision of where to place your athlete is solely between you and the athlete. I don't think it is likely that a level 5 athlete would willingly choose to be registered at a lower level. Individual pride in your skill and accomplishments is a key factor there. More likely you would have more athletes pushing to be registered at a higher level than at their true level or lower. Ultimately (no pun intended), you would still have the choice to register an athlete with part level 2/part level 4 skills as a level 4. That wouldn't hurt anyone else. Your situation would remain status quo relative to what it is today.

 

[CaptainoftheCheerocracy]

I am intrigued by the registration and athlete registration conversation, but please take it to a new thread. This thread was meant for amazing level 2 teams, so that is what I am looking for when I open it.

The recent conversation is completely valid, but just not relevant to this thread anymore.

 

[Rudags]

1. Don't hate the player.... Hate the Game.

2. Its not against the rules, so why are we mad at this? I believe one year James Speed talked about at a conference about finding ways around rules to make your gym successful. He said something along the lines of "If the USASF came out with a rule that to be a cheerleader, you must have red hair.... Then I would be buying some hair dye."

Now, with that being said - Do I agree with whats being done? No. But I'm also not in Scott's shoes to know the details and whats best for the team and his program. I wouldn't say I know Scott really well - but I do know him. He runs a clean program and every time we cross paths we say hi. Seems like a nice guy.

Truth is, a lot of gyms have multiple Level 5 athletes on lower level teams. Its true. When I coached Senior 2 at the beginning of the season, we literally had the ENTIRE Level 5 Program at the gym wanting to Cross to Senior 2 because they LOVED their routine (specifically the dance). I had to tell them all no, but I did tell them if there was ever an injury or I needed a sub that I would be more than happy to entertain having them on as a sub. I told them they couldn't join the team, and the reason for that was the social media. Hell, I had one competition that I had two girls out for an ACT exam, and one out for an injury. I had three level 5s cross for that ONE COMP to fill in. Our rival gym went NUTS! Posting crap all over Facebook, harassing the kids, bashing the program, discrediting my teams first place win, you name it. Truth be told, I was competing "Large Senior 2" with only 25 amazing kids. Now, If I could have added the 7 Level 5 kids that wanted to, it probably could have only helped with the teams success, but did I want my kids to see the youtube comments, the drama on Facebook, the talk in the warmup room? No. The team was successful with just True Senior 2's on it while I coached them. I commend Rockstar for making their decision and putting up with this social media.

Have any of you actually ever had your level 5 team play around with Level 2 stunts? Most say Level 2 is harder, and to be honest - My level 2 kids can typically out stunt Senior Level 5 kids attempting level 2 stunts. Any athletes care to chime in?

 

[FierceinTeal]

1. Don't hate the player.... Hate the Game.

2. Its not against the rules, so why are we mad at this? I believe one year James Speed talked about at a conference about finding ways around rules to make your gym successful. He said something along the lines of "If the USASF came out with a rule that to be a cheerleader, you must have red hair.... Then I would be buying some hair dye."

Now, with that being said - Do I agree with whats being done? No. But I'm also not in Scott's shoes to know the details and whats best for the team and his program. I wouldn't say I know Scott really well - but I do know him. He runs a clean program and every time we cross paths we say hi. Seems like a nice guy.

Truth is, a lot of gyms have multiple Level 5 athletes on lower level teams. Its true. When I coached Senior 2 at the beginning of the season, we literally had the ENTIRE Level 5 Program at the gym wanting to Cross to Senior 2 because they LOVED their routine (specifically the dance). I had to tell them all no, but I did tell them if there was ever an injury or I needed a sub that I would be more than happy to entertain having them on as a sub. I told them they couldn't join the team, and the reason for that was the social media. Hell, I had one competition that I had two girls out for an ACT exam, and one out for an injury. I had three level 5s cross for that ONE COMP to fill in. Our rival gym went NUTS! Posting crap all over Facebook, harassing the kids, bashing the program, discrediting my teams first place win, you name it. Truth be told, I was competing "Large Senior 2" with only 25 amazing kids. Now, If I could have added the 7 Level 5 kids that wanted to, it probably could have only helped with the teams success, but did I want my kids to see the youtube comments, the drama on Facebook, the talk in the warmup room? No. The team was successful with just True Senior 2's on it while I coached them. I commend Rockstar for making their decision and putting up with this social media.

Have any of you actually ever had your level 5 team play around with Level 2 stunts? Most say Level 2 is harder, and to be honest - My level 2 kids can typically out stunt Senior Level 5 kids attempting level 2 stunts. Any athletes care to chime in?

This is so ture. One year my senior 5 team had a part in our pyramid where we had to stunt at prep level and it was almost impossible. We fell 90% of the time and ended up having to take it out of our routine.

 

[RockstarCheer]

1. Don't hate the player.... Hate the Game.

2. Its not against the rules, so why are we mad at this? I believe one year James Speed talked about at a conference about finding ways around rules to make your gym successful. He said something along the lines of "If the USASF came out with a rule that to be a cheerleader, you must have red hair.... Then I would be buying some hair dye."

Now, with that being said - Do I agree with whats being done? No. But I'm also not in Scott's shoes to know the details and whats best for the team and his program. I wouldn't say I know Scott really well - but I do know him. He runs a clean program and every time we cross paths we say hi. Seems like a nice guy.

Truth is, a lot of gyms have multiple Level 5 athletes on lower level teams. Its true. When I coached Senior 2 at the beginning of the season, we literally had the ENTIRE Level 5 Program at the gym wanting to Cross to Senior 2 because they LOVED their routine (specifically the dance). I had to tell them all no, but I did tell them if there was ever an injury or I needed a sub that I would be more than happy to entertain having them on as a sub. I told them they couldn't join the team, and the reason for that was the social media. Hell, I had one competition that I had two girls out for an ACT exam, and one out for an injury. I had three level 5s cross for that ONE COMP to fill in. Our rival gym went NUTS! Posting crap all over Facebook, harassing the kids, bashing the program, discrediting my teams first place win, you name it. Truth be told, I was competing "Large Senior 2" with only 25 amazing kids. Now, If I could have added the 7 Level 5 kids that wanted to, it probably could have only helped with the teams success, but did I want my kids to see the youtube comments, the drama on Facebook, the talk in the warmup room? No. The team was successful with just True Senior 2's on it while I coached them. I commend Rockstar for making their decision and putting up with this social media.

Have any of you actually ever had your level 5 team play around with Level 2 stunts? Most say Level 2 is harder, and to be honest - My level 2 kids can typically out stunt Senior Level 5 kids attempting level 2 stunts. Any athletes care to chime in?

For the record again I'll state the facts...We have Level 2, 3 & 4 kids on that team.....They are so excited about going to Dallas and experiencing NCA like our Chili Peppers and Beatles kids...It's been such a great move for us because now the whole gym is talking about NCA. Now we have younger teams and athletes asking about NCA. We've never flown to a competition in the 5 years at Rockstar. This is our first competition EVER that we've flown to. Hopefully next year all our teams will want to compete at NCA! Oh, and I like you to Kyle lol

 

[clickclickFLASH*]

When putting together a half year team to go to Dallas, you have a lot of people from different skills wanting to do it. If you're making a team, why go a level higher when the majority of the team doesn't have the higher level skills? These athletes asked to be on the team to experience NCAs, I don't see why people are bashing on the teams and the gyms especially if you don't even know how the teams were created.
If you have a certain amount of kids sign up, and the majority can't tumble higher than level 2 and some can't even do a back handspring, why make it a higher level? I don't see that as stacking. I see that as creating a team fit for the majority of their skills.
And if you were a kid and saw someone talking about how your team is cheating on such a prestigious board like this, wouldn't you feel like you were being bashed?

 

[PCMegan]

I was going to say although I don't think it's very fair.... You're not the first who has done it and not the last.