High School Del Val Cheer Program

[Twinklestars]

As someone who never thought Cheer was a sport growing up, I think sideline cheer is detrimental to the public view of what Cheerleaders are. It wasn't until I got to college that I even saw what Cheer teams are capable of and thought it would be something to test my physical and mental abilities. Competitive cheer and sideline cheer should definitely be broken up in my honest opinion. I believe part of the stigma that "Cheerleaders are supposed to cheer on the boys (and girls)!" could be alleviated if there was a "Cheer Squad" and an "Acro and Stunt Team".

I think you need to pay better attention to which forum you are posting. I also think you aren't looking at words correctly.

The argument could be made that allstar/competitive performers should not be called cheerleaders because they. don't. cheer.

Cheerleading started on the sidelines. Being a Cheerleader - History of Cheerleading It incorporated other skills for entertainment value for the crowds. As a former coach liked to say: you are cheerleaders-- not tumble leaders, stunt leaders, or dance leaders!

And, I despise the word squad. They are a team!

 

[CheerItFullOut]

I can see arguments though... Sometimes the kids DO feel a little taken advantage of, sometimes they simply can't be EVERYWHERE...
Back to where the thread originally was... I hope the AD doesn't get a new advisor/coach that's just a nightmare. They may have a personal issue with their current Coach/Advisor... But the AD just might not know JUST how good they had it until it was gone.

 

[Michael White]

I think you need to pay better attention to which forum you are posting. I also think you aren't looking at words correctly.

The argument could be made that allstar/competitive performers should not be called cheerleaders because they. don't. cheer.

Cheerleading started on the sidelines. Being a Cheerleader - History of Cheerleading It incorporated other skills for entertainment value for the crowds. As a former coach liked to say: you are cheerleaders-- not tumble leaders, stunt leaders, or dance leaders!

And, I despise the word squad. They are a team!

No, I think I replied to the right one... This is a response to the Athletic Director who thinks Cheer isn't a sport. ;) I'm not a spring chicken to cheer anymore. I've cheered two years in college, and three on a level 5 team (IOC5), coached two years of all-star and have been an NCA instructor, in case you're wondering.

Cheerleading may have started on the sidelines, but it has definitely come a long way since it's foundation! I was simply saying that maybe the distinction needs to be made now between competition teams and teams that are geared more to leading football and basketball teams.

PS- in my gym, especially with the girls I coached all year, we felt squad was a more endearing and close term than team was, but maybe it's different dialect everywhere.

 

[blyndreamalum]

At my middle/high school the girls only cheer for the typical football and boys bball. My 7th or 8th grade year someone requested we cheer for a girls tournament bball game, and the girls hated it. I never cheered for girls again until I got to college, the Varsity squad did the guys games and JV did girls. Our guys were horrible and our girls were awesome so cheering them on all season was so much more enjoyable... And more people came to the games because they were good.


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[Twinklestars]

No, I think I replied to the right one... This is a response to the Athletic Director who thinks Cheer isn't a sport. ;) I'm not a spring chicken to cheer anymore. I've cheered two years in college, and three on a level 5 team (IOC5), coached two years of all-star and have been an NCA instructor, in case you're wondering.

Cheerleading may have started on the sidelines, but it has definitely come a long way since it's foundation! I was simply saying that maybe the distinction needs to be made now between competition teams and teams that are geared more to leading football and basketball teams.

PS- in my gym, especially with the girls I coached all year, we felt squad was a more endearing and close term than team was, but maybe it's different dialect everywhere.

I found it rather insulting that you came into the "High School Cheerleading" forum where a number of teams don't compete and write that "sideline cheer is detrimental to the public view of what Cheerleaders are".

That is being divisive, but I guess that was your intent. Sure, divide them up into the cheerleaders who cheer and lead crowds and those who compete. The former gets to keep the name.

I think there is a difference between "squad" and referring to a " Cheer Squad" and an "Acro and Stunt Team". Squad/squad goals are Taylor Swift and her ilk who are known as a squad mainly for looks/fashion than skill/talent. You differentiated when you called cheer a squad and the Acro/stunt a team. Team is for athletes.

Maybe I am overreacting, but I am sick and tired of seeing sideline teams get put down for what they do. They work hard and get little respect. When the disrespect is from someone like you, it is unacceptable.

 

[Michael White]

I found it rather insulting that you came into the "High School Cheerleading" forum where a number of teams don't compete and write that "sideline cheer is detrimental to the public view of what Cheerleaders are".

That is being divisive, but I guess that was your intent. Sure, divide them up into the cheerleaders who cheer and lead crowds and those who compete. The former gets to keep the name.

I think there is a difference between "squad" and referring to a " Cheer Squad" and an "Acro and Stunt Team". Squad/squad goals are Taylor Swift and her ilk who are known as a squad mainly for looks/fashion than skill/talent. You differentiated when you called cheer a squad and the Acro/stunt a team. Team is for athletes.

Maybe I am overreacting, but I am sick and tired of seeing sideline teams get put down for what they do. They work hard and get little respect. When the disrespect is from someone like you, it is unacceptable.

I'm not disrespecting anyone though... I'm saying that the reason the AD might see it as not being a sport is because he may not know the other side of Cheer. Sideline cheer is great, don't get me wrong, and stunting and tumbling does go on, but you can't say that any casual observer would see sideline cheer as a competitive sport. If I had a dollar for every time I heard someone say "Rah Rah!" And shake their invisible poms when I told them I Cheer, I'd be a few pairs on Nfinities richer. Like it or not, that is the public perception of cheer, I don't think that's up for debate. I think in your misguided view of me, you see that as MY view, which is most assuredly not the case.

I also don't know why you think I'm disrespecting anyone. You don't even know me... but if you talked to my hundreds of lessons and dozens of athletes, you would quickly find out just the kind of person I am, and I don't think I have to prove how much I love this sport. :shaka:

 

[Official OWECheer]

No, I think I replied to the right one... This is a response to the Athletic Director who thinks Cheer isn't a sport. ;) I'm not a spring chicken to cheer anymore. I've cheered two years in college, and three on a level 5 team (IOC5), coached two years of all-star and have been an NCA instructor, in case you're wondering.

Cheerleading may have started on the sidelines, but it has definitely come a long way since it's foundation! I was simply saying that maybe the distinction needs to be made now between competition teams and teams that are geared more to leading football and basketball teams.

PS- in my gym, especially with the girls I coached all year, we felt squad was a more endearing and close term than team was, but maybe it's different dialect everywhere.

I don't think people in that town are at all unaware of the fact that Del Val is nationally ranked. They've been on ESPN. Sideline cheer isn't detrimental to the image of cheerleading.

 

[Michael White]

I don't think people in that town are at all unaware of the fact that Del Val is nationally ranked. They've been on ESPN. Sideline cheer isn't detrimental to the image of cheerleading.

If youre talking about just Del Val, then I agree, likely the community is well aware of the competition team, and their many achievements. But the one person who matters does not believe it should continue, and the program itself is in jeopardy because of it. If you mean that sideline cheer is in no way influencing the public perception of cheer, then I'm afraid we'll have to agree to disagree.

 

[Official OWECheer]

If youre talking about just Del Val, then I agree, likely the community is well aware of the competition team, and their many achievements. But the one person who matters does not believe it should continue, and the program itself is in jeopardy because of it. If you mean that sideline cheer is in no way influencing the public perception of cheer, then I'm afraid we'll have to agree to disagree.

But this isn't about the AD thinking that sideline cheer is all there is to cheerleading. OBVIOUSLY sideline cheer has a huge impact on the public's perception of cheer. But it is not the problem. The problem is the comparative lack of exposure of competitive cheerleading (not all star, but competitive cheerleading in general), the public ignorance regarding the amount of training that goes into cheerleading, and the images that Hollywood and the adult industry continually put out about our sport.

If the rumors are true, then the AD has a deep-seated bias against Kimmy Sweet and cheerleading in general that won't be remedied by having him watch a couple of UCA broadcasts.

ETA: Lots of HS programs have the same team doing everything for sideline and competition. No separation.

 

[mamabear]

I live in this county. Cheer is huge out here. It starts with the AYC and Pop Warner teams who are nationally known and it continues through most of our high schools.There is no way that Del Val's success is not known. Sounds like the AD is choosing to make life miserable.

There has been recent activity at another area high school regarding cheer and I have a feeling that Kimmy Sweet will hopefully end up there next season. I think she would be an amazing addition to their program.

 

[Official OWECheer]

I live in this county. Cheer is huge out here. It starts with the AYC and Pop Warner teams who are nationally known and it continues through most of our high schools.There is no way that Del Val's success is not known. Sounds like the AD is choosing to make life miserable.

There has been recent activity at another area high school regarding cheer and I have a feeling that Kimmy Sweet will hopefully end up there next season. I think she would be an amazing addition to their program.

If you are at liberty to elaborate, please do so!

 

[OldskoolKYcheercoach]

Let's stop pretending this is a new phenomenon. Competitive cheer teams appear, dominate, and disappear in cyclical fashion and have been doing so for 35 years. Does anyone remember Christian Brothers High School? Their program fell apart because the "Brothers" decided that they did not want to support them anymore. Competing at Nationals is expensive, it is (generally speaking) not a state-sanctioned event, and if a coach doesn't keep her eyes on the prize, the potential exists for great drama. Every competitive cheer program must recognize that they are one small boo boo away from having the hammer come down on their ability to compete.

The other fallacies in these arguments: trying to label cheer as a sport, implying that a good sideline program is detrimental to the image of cheerleading (note the adjective "good"), and indicating that somehow separating sideline cheer from competitive cheer at the high school level would fix all problems...are all bogus in light of the fact that we are discussing a competitive luxury (attending UCA nationals), vs competitive requirements (such as a sanctioned state competition).

 

[mamabear]

It is all speculation at this point, so I would rather not say since I am not close to the situation. I am just watching from the sidelines, but there is an opening in the area that I am guessing that she might be interested in. It would be a fairly obviously choice if she is not interested in relocating and taking on a major program.

(sorry if I made it seem more juicy. It is just a gut feeling.)

 

[Michael White]

But this isn't about the AD thinking that sideline cheer is all there is to cheerleading. OBVIOUSLY sideline cheer has a huge impact on the public's perception of cheer. But it is not the problem. The problem is the comparative lack of exposure of competitive cheerleading (not all star, but competitive cheerleading in general), the public ignorance regarding the amount of training that goes into cheerleading, and the images that Hollywood and the adult industry continually put out about our sport.

If the rumors are true, then the AD has a deep-seated bias against Kimmy Sweet and cheerleading in general that won't be remedied by having him watch a couple of UCA broadcasts.

ETA: Lots of HS programs have the same team doing everything for sideline and competition. No separation.

I don't know the man personally so that may certainly be the case! :) you say the rumor is he doesn't like cheering in general. I wonder though, what is his issue with cheering then? Does he not like it because of injuries? Because of the "girls in skirts and showing midriffs"? It certainly can't be the cost unless the school is paying for these trips. If it's a personal bias against the coach, that's even worse in my opinion. The team is collateral in his pursuit against the coach.

 

[Official OWECheer]

I don't know the man personally so that may certainly be the case! :) you say the rumor is he doesn't like cheering in general. I wonder though, what is his issue with cheering then? Does he not like it because of injuries? Because of the "girls in skirts and showing midriffs"? It certainly can't be the cost unless the school is paying for these trips. If it's a personal bias against the coach, that's even worse in my opinion. The team is collateral in his pursuit against the coach.

I can't speak for him, but a lot of the time, it honestly comes down to them believing in stereotypes. It's ridiculous.

Let's stop pretending this is a new phenomenon. Competitive cheer teams appear, dominate, and disappear in cyclical fashion and have been doing so for 35 years. Does anyone remember Christian Brothers High School? Their program fell apart because the "Brothers" decided that they did not want to support them anymore. Competing at Nationals is expensive, it is (generally speaking) not a state-sanctioned event, and if a coach doesn't keep her eyes on the prize, the potential exists for great drama. Every competitive cheer program must recognize that they are one small boo boo away from having the hammer come down on their ability to compete.

The other fallacies in these arguments: trying to label cheer as a sport, implying that a good sideline program is detrimental to the image of cheerleading (note the adjective "good"), and indicating that somehow separating sideline cheer from competitive cheer at the high school level would fix all problems...are all bogus in light of the fact that we are discussing a competitive luxury (attending UCA nationals), vs competitive requirements (such as a sanctioned state competition).

THIS. All of it.