All-Star Unassisted Stunting Just For Coed Divisions

[yourfavoritebackspot]

Didnt varsity add a coed stunting score to the sr coed teams for the Summit? That should be interesting.

 

[Ashley]

In my opinion it should be called "unassisted stunts". And King is 100% correct when comparing a toss lib and a one to double. They are equally hard and it's insanely hard to find a person (guy or girl) who can do both (especially if you don't look at the state of Texas haha). I also feel that many gyms don't have stunting camps as a "big" money maker simply because of the market. There are many smaller gyms or schools who pay for camps and think "Why learn to stunt? That's the easy part. Tumbling takes longer to learn. Anybody can hold a flyer up". They don't realize that a good, solid stunt takes just as much technique as a good, solid tumbling pass.
I will agree that the more bases a stunt has the easier it is, but I would also say that the more bases it has, the harder it sould be. I would disagree that the move toward "unassisted" stunting is limiting tumbling. I see it as a push to make people (mainly guys, but also girls if they are rewarded for doing unassisted stunts) more all-around. I also feel that it is preparing more athletes for the college level skills. There were a few years where you had specified people on college level teams for stunting and others for tumbling; and the skill differences were huge. Stutters may have a standing tuck but could do a toss anything, while tumblers could do standing fulls and multi-full running passes, but could only do toss hands. This new system could be moving more toward ALL-AROUND athletes.
Again this is just my option.

This is tough. Our gym owners both come from National Championship winning college programs. Coed stunting has always been pushed in our gym. Our small coed team has 4 toss extensions-hands-stretches. Not amazing stunting, but a lot more than what I saw from a lot of teams this weekend.

BUT the doors to the gym are always open to free stunt. I'm on the Coed 6 team and we go in a lot during the week to stunt with the boys on the senior team. I think that this is why we tend to have a lot of coed stunting compared to other gyms in our area. You can make money from stunting clinics, but I think ultimately it comes down to reps - and you don't really need to pay someone to spot your stunts the way you do tumbling (you need a spotter, obvs, but it doesn't really take any training).

With that being said, the best tumbler in our gym is tiny and is one of the boys who does the hands stretch. It's not easy, but even the littlest tumblers can learn. And his tumbling hasn't suffered because of it.

 

[just_kay_today]

I've noticed in that some boys tend to come into coed cheer at a later age. Many gyms have boys who have been with their coed programs since boyhood, but many came after their middle or high school careers have already started. Some only have football experience (enticed by their girlfriend), gymnastics, and some have no experience in cheer at all.

I remember CSP telling our girls when they were on YE, that stunting is a skill. It's not luck. It has to be learned and it has technical aspects to be mastered. That takes a while. Could it simply be that what many of you are expecting to see on some of these allstar teams - as far as unassisted stunts - has just not had the time to be mastered? Since the industry is just getting around to even rewarding teams taking the risk, and many of the boys are late to the game of cheer to begin with, maybe this accounts for the lack of "true" coed stunting.

I suspect that if the industry begins to reward teams for taking the risk and training their boys to properly execute true coed stunts, we will see more of the type of stunting you are describing. Gyms will invest more time in training and development of their coed programs. Boys are competitive and like a challenge. This type of specialization invites them to step up their game. It may even entice more parents to choose cheer as a sport for their boys...who knows.

But right now, it's just in its infancy. "♪But today I am still, just a Bill♫."

 

[ASCheerMan]

My thinking is this-it comes down to money. You can have camps to teach stunting, and you can't for tumbling. Gym owners make money off tumbling, and large corporations run camps. Take away tumbling and move the industry towards stunting and you are taking power from the gym to the big company.

There, I said it. Let that sink in for a bit...

Interesting theory... but completely not true. There is no strategey to reintroduce all star teams to summer camp. In my opinion, the current expectations of all star cheer alienate an important sector of the male population. Why can't we have an avenue for ALL males to feel successful and useful to an all star team.

I agree that tumbling is a great revenue stream for gyms and that's awesome. But tumbling is also a deterent to many potential all star athletes. When I was introduced to cheerleading my 11th grade year, I learned to coed stunt fast and became valuable fast. My tumbling skills improved MUCH slower. I would have had NO shot of making a competitive team if I were in 11th grade today.

Anyway, back to your point: No. LOL

 

[Ashley]

I remember CSP telling our girls when they were on YE, that stunting is a skill. It's not luck. It has to be learned and it has technical aspects to be mastered. That takes a while. Could it simply be that what many of you are expecting to see on some of these allstar teams - as far as unassisted stunts - has just not had the time to be mastered? Since the industry is just getting around to even rewarding teams taking the risk, and many of the boys are late to the game of cheer to begin with, maybe this accounts for the lack of "true" coed stunting.

I don't really agree with this. There are tons and tons of college teams where the majority of the boys have never cheered before and they manage to pick it up in a relatively short amount of time. It shouldn't take 4 years to learn how to do a toss extension. We're not talking about unassisted full-ups. Coed stunting isn't really something boys can do before puberty anyway, so it's not like starting in high school puts them at a serious disadvantage to boys who have been cheering longer that that.

I think you can tell the teams that have put more of an effort into teaching it than those who do the bare minimum because they have to. I think it will take time to see more of it, but this is the second year with this rule, if I'm not mistaken.

 

[just_kay_today]

I don't really agree with this. There are tons and tons of college teams where the majority of the boys have never cheered before and they manage to pick it up in a relatively short amount of time. It shouldn't take 4 years to learn how to do a toss extension. We're not talking about unassisted full-ups. Coed stunting isn't really something boys can do before puberty anyway, so it's not like starting in high school puts them at a serious disadvantage to boys who have been cheering longer that that.

I think you can tell the teams that have put more of an effort into teaching it than those who do the bare minimum because they have to. I think it will take time to see more of it, but this is the second year with this rule, if I'm not mistaken.

My point was risk vs reward. Many gyms have not put in the time because there was no reward. I think BlueCat said that the Worlds and Jamfest scoresheets are the only ones rewarding single based stunts as such. So, if I were a coach and could win without it, why would I waste the time and effort coaching my boys to do it?

Besides, most college teams don't compete and aren't judged for bobbles or tiny mistakes. When the scoring gains begin, and become more mainstream, the technique will begin to count more. Even in all girl mastery of stunting technique does count. NCA was proof of that this past weekend.

 

[King]

I think rewarding true coed stunting makes it a lot harder to max out, and that is a good thing. I would like to see true coed stunting and assisted stunting take the same scoring position in large coed as kick double baskets and kick kick double baskets. You have to for real do it to be up a level.

 

[King]

My thinking is this-it comes down to money. You can have camps to teach stunting, and you can't for tumbling. Gym owners make money off tumbling, and large corporations run camps. Take away tumbling and move the industry towards stunting and you are taking power from the gym to the big company.

There, I said it. Let that sink in for a bit...

I am not a big corporation and I am available for camps. Just PM me!



</shameless plug>

 

[ASCheerMan]

Interesting theory... but completely not true. There is no strategey to reintroduce all star teams to summer camp. In my opinion, the current expectations of all star cheer alienate an important sector of the male population. Why can't we have an avenue for ALL males to feel successful and useful to an all star team.

I agree that tumbling is a great revenue stream for gyms and that's awesome. But tumbling is also a deterent to many potential all star athletes. When I was introduced to cheerleading my 11th grade year, I learned to coed stunt fast and became valuable fast. My tumbling skills improved MUCH slower. I would have had NO shot of making a competitive team if I were in 11th grade today.

Anyway, back to your point: No. LOL

I can't believe nobody shimmied my last post. That's crap.

 

[xtremeteal4life]

I can't believe nobody shimmied my last post. That's crap.

umm I did before seeing this! :p

 

[f5forever]

With that being said, the best tumbler in our gym is tiny and is one of the boys who does the hands stretch. It's not easy, but even the littlest tumblers can learn. And his tumbling hasn't suffered because of it.[/quote]

Oh no, I totally understand that! I was just talking about gyms that do summer camps for local (usually smaller gyms or schools). Stunting is hard, but it depends A LOT of technique. It's my belief that ANYONE can learn to stunt, as long as they learn proper technique. Open stunting is a GREAT way to get in extra practice and increasing skills.