All-Star Yo, Gymtyme Is Not Playing This Year.

[ztaprincess]

My random thought of the day...If none of the greats change what makes them great than the score sheets changing wouldn't matter either....hmmmmmmm

I thought the exact same thing. If the big contenders went to worlds with the routines they have now, then just because the scoresheet doesn't match their routines doesn't mean they wouldn't still place in the top 3. While it may help the true International teams score a little higher then usually I still personally feel like the US teams would walk away with top 3 even with their routines now.

 

[ztaprincess]

I went through and watched the videos that I could find of the teams most people are raving about and got some screen shots of how they would match up with "coed" stunting with the routines they have competed with thus far. From watching Stingray Fire is ahead with unassisted stunts in their routines. Now if they stay the same all the way through worlds I see Fire staying ahead of the pack, but if they want to match the scoresheet then there needs to be a lot of work on stunts to catch up. **by the way there are what I could see from the blurry videos, I could be wrong on some of them**

Cheerforce (from what I could see they have none)

Gymtyme (you can clearly see 2, but the two in the front are iffy i can't tell if they are touching)

Cheer Athletics Wildcats (in all the stunt sections I only spotted 1)

Brandon Steel (there are 2 spread out in the 3 sections)

Stingray Fire (There are too many to count)

 

[cinderella]

Because what does referring to last year have to do with this years routine and the fact that NO ONE seems to get that walking clean behind around the floor is worth MORE than tumbling. Tumbling aint worth jack. If you had a squad full of standing doubles it might be worth the little thing that goes on the end of my shoelace. Lets even skip the fact their stunt is illegal and they can't seem to read a legality sheet (nor can anyone who was at the competition that gave them a bid).

Just curious, what part of their stunt is illegal?

 

[annauk]

Lets even skip the fact their stunt is illegal and they can't seem to read a legality sheet (nor can anyone who was at the competition that gave them a bid).

I've been trying to figure out how on earth that got past the legality judges!

 

[King]

I went through and watched the videos that I could find of the teams most people are raving about and got some screen shots of how they would match up with "coed" stunting with the routines they have competed with thus far. From watching Stingray Fire is ahead with unassisted stunts in their routines. Now if they stay the same all the way through worlds I see Fire staying ahead of the pack, but if they want to match the scoresheet then there needs to be a lot of work on stunts to catch up. **by the way there are what I could see from the blurry videos, I could be wrong on some of them**

Everyone is doing straight toss stunts unassisted. In college that was what our team JV did. Just straight toss stunts... unassisted.

 

[ztaprincess]

I know that they are just straight toss I was just pointing out that right now most teams don't even have that. So if they want to hit the scoresheet they have a lot of work to do. It goes with what was said about not changing the routines. Since most teams are in the same boat right about now, if they were to stay the same then anyone is up for first place because no one is maxing in stunts. Looking at the routines right now Fire is ahead of the back at getting atleast the most toss stunts up there so the chance of them getting unassisted other stunts in my opinion seems greater right then then the other teams getting them.

As for the illegal Gym Tyme stunt I am guessing it is when they fall from the scorp? They need 3 bases catching and one to remain in contact right? I guess that there are some legality judges that need to work harder because they competed the stunt at NCA Classic in Nashville and won. They had 5.00 in deductions but I don't know if they hit perfect. Possibly they are doing it somehow that makes it legal?

 

[King]

I know that they are just straight toss I was just pointing out that right now most teams don't even have that. So if they want to hit the scoresheet they have a lot of work to do. It goes with what was said about not changing the routines. Since most teams are in the same boat right about now, if they were to stay the same then anyone is up for first place because no one is maxing in stunts. Looking at the routines right now Fire is ahead of the back at getting atleast the most toss stunts up there so the chance of them getting unassisted other stunts in my opinion seems greater right then then the other teams getting them.

As for the illegal Gym Tyme stunt I am guessing it is when they fall from the scorp? They need 3 bases catching and one to remain in contact right? I guess that there are some legality judges that need to work harder because they competed the stunt at NCA Classic in Nashville and won. They had 5.00 in deductions but I don't know if they hit perfect. Possibly they are doing it somehow that makes it legal?

You are right. IF no one changes than everybody is in the equal lower category. That cool group stunt everyone is working on? It is worth MAX 25 points... out of 35.

 

[King]

You are right. IF no one changes than everybody is in the equal lower category. That cool group stunt everyone is working on? It is worth MAX 25 points... out of 35.

Put another way the difference between doing group stunts and doing a coed sequence (notice I said sequence, not a straight toss stunt) is worth more than all tumbling combined.

All tumbling combined.

Now if no one were to change, these fun loving single based stunts that everyone is doing that is just a straight toss pop down would actually max out the scoresheet (see earlier discussions about large senior teams and maxing out in jumps). BUT if one singular team were to do an actual coed sequence every single one of these teams routines that you just highlighted would get maybe a 26 or 27 out of 35 on stunts.

Walking clean around the floor and having good formations is worth more than all tumbling... combined.

 

[ztaprincess]

Yeah with the new scoresheet for stunts it will be interesting come NCA when a lot of these teams get to compete against each other for the first time and see how the routines measure up. If one of them walks in with amazing coed stunts I feel like the other teams will be scampering to get a new stunt downpat for worlds. If someone doesn't walk in with coed stunts until worlds I feel like there will be panic from certain teams.

Question though, does Gym Tyme doing the unassisted ballup stretches at the beginning of the routine score higher or would it just be considered a toss?

 

[King]

Yeah with the new scoresheet for stunts it will be interesting come NCA when a lot of these teams get to compete against each other for the first time and see how the routines measure up. If one of them walks in with amazing coed stunts I feel like the other teams will be scampering to get a new stunt downpat for worlds. If someone doesn't walk in with coed stunts until worlds I feel like there will be panic from certain teams.

Question though, does Gym Tyme doing the unassisted ballup stretches at the beginning of the routine score higher or would it just be considered a toss?

a ballup stretch is easier for the base than a straight toss to the top. ballups were invented for people who cant toss to the top.

 

[socratesofcheer]

Yeah, I have, actually. Why?

I don't want to speak for kingston, but, I think he is referring to the disproportionate values of building vs tumbling and choreography.

 

[xpressjag]

Since world's scoresheets don't give a lick about tumbling, choreography, or group stunting I think they are beatable. In fact, no one so far has a routine that hits the sheet well.

I wouldn't completely agree with this statement since those skill areas are still listed on the score sheet. Their point value may not be as high but they still matter. I will always say overall impression will always kill anyone on anyday. The single base stunting is worth more, but won't determine places. You have to have the entire package.

On a side note, who decided on these point values and score sheets? These are so UCA style score sheets its not even funny.

 

[King]

I wouldn't completely agree with this statement since those skill areas are still listed on the score sheet. Their point value may not be as high but they still matter. I will always say overall impression will always kill anyone on anyday. The single base stunting is worth more, but won't determine places. You have to have the entire package.

On a side note, who decided on these point values and score sheets? These are so UCA style score sheets its not even funny.

Ok, there is 5 points for standing tumbling (execution PLUS difficulty in JUST 5 points) and the same for running tumbling.

So in that 5 points for standing tumbling if one team had 10 standing fulls and another had 20 standing fulls, and one had 8 members do PERFECTLY synchronized two to fulls. Just curious how you think all three of those would score... in that 5 points. To help out, here is the guide for tumbling:


1-2 points Standing tumbling skills executed with poor technique, perfection and
synchronization. L3 standing tumbling skills. Limited number of skills and
variety performed in routine. Few performers attempting skill compared to
number on the floor.
2-3 points Standing tumbling skills executed with standard technique, perfection and
synchronization. L4 standing tumbling skills. Average number of skills and
variety performed in routine. Approximately half the number of performers
attempting skill compared to number on the floor.
3-4 points Standing tumbling skills executed with standard to higher than standard
technique, perfection and synchronization. L4 standing tumbling skills.
Average number of skills and variety performed in routine. Approximately
half the number of performers attempting skill compared to number on the
floor.
4-5 points Standing tumbling skills with a nearly perfect to perfect level of technique,
perfection and synchronization. L5 standing tumbling skills. Multiple skills
and variety performed in routine. Most to all of performers attempting skill
compared to number on the floor.

 

[King]

My opinion, all would get between 4 - 5 points.

 

[King]

I wouldn't completely agree with this statement since those skill areas are still listed on the score sheet. Their point value may not be as high but they still matter. I will always say overall impression will always kill anyone on anyday. The single base stunting is worth more, but won't determine places. You have to have the entire package.

On a side note, who decided on these point values and score sheets? These are so UCA style score sheets its not even funny.

My opinion, all would get between 4 - 5 points.

Ill expand a little further. In that battle to have all those standing fulls, if you kicked off 8 boys who could standing full, took 8 boys who couldn't tumble AT ALL but.... could do single based front handspring ups hands full ups do you think that tumbling team that is more complete, has better choreography, but can barely hold a coed stunt to save their life would win?