All-Star Super Spin-off: Priorities

[ztaprincess]

But my point is WE can do it.

First I LOVE gymnastics. I started as a gymnastics coach.
Gymnastics is not a sport because of the USAG it is a sport because of its international participation and simply because of it's history.
All-Star Cheerleading has many great minds and can and will make te changes needed. Sometimes those changes will come fast and sometimes the change will take longer and need to be discussed longer but in the end it will be OUR sport.

Without USAG I don't think gymnastics would be where it is today and as repsected as it is today as a sport especially here in the US. The point is if USAG can continue doing great things for gymnastics then why not learn what we can from them to implement them in our own way for cheer? Companies do it all the time and I can imagine the different sports leagues looked at others and thought how to apply it to their own.

 

[Coach Troy]

The issues we face have similarities so I can see the logic in understanding how they applied it to thier sport but my point remains gymnastics cannot solve the issues in our sport since thier objectives are not ours.
I have watched this sport grow and evolve since 1996 and I am proud of what we have accomplished in such a sort time.

A true leveling system
A clear definition of skills
Proper progression of skills (even if not everyone is smart enough to flow them yet)
Our very own world championship
A governing body (not perfect but ours)

And so much more...

We have much yet to do but let's not allow the desire to be called a "sport" cloud our judgment and let others define OUR SPORT

 

[chyeeaaa69]

The issues we face have similarities so I can see the logic in understanding how they applied it to thier sport but my point remains gymnastics cannot solve the issues in our sport since thier objectives are not ours.
I have watched this sport grow and evolve since 1996 and I am proud of what we have accomplished in such a sort time.

A true leveling system
A clear definition of skills
Proper progression of skills (even if not everyone is smart enough to flow them yet)
Our very own world championship
A governing body (not perfect but ours)

And so much more...

We have much yet to do but let's not allow the desire to be called a "sport" cloud our judgment and let others define OUR SPORT

I understand what you're trying to say here. No, USAG is not responsible for gymnastics being considered a sport, nor are they responsible for most of the initial progression of the sport, but what it's NOT doing is ruining the sport. All these different competition companies and things are in no way shape or form helping cheerleading, for the most part. USAG is a relatively structured governing body that everyone can look to, whereas in cheer, you don't know whether to look here, there, or a little bit left of where you were looking 10 minutes ago. There's no one (or no single company) in charge of governing ALL of American all star cheerleading, and THAT is what seems to be what most people think is needed, and why comparisons are being drawn to gymnastics/USAG (or at least why I would draw comparisons to it)

 

[ztaprincess]

We have much yet to do but let's not allow the desire to be called a "sport" cloud our judgment and let others define OUR SPORT

Problem is when people on here post about what makes cheer a sport half the time it is "well look at that injury who thinks we aren't a sport now." :banghead: So I really don't think we need to work on how WE feel as a sport but how the outside world does. Those who participate will have their own view on what makes cheer a sport, but the lack of organization and a governing body that only governs 1 event the entire year (yes they make rules but each EP gets their own rules as well) is not going to help gain the respect so many want from the outside world. It would be like the NCAA only caring about the championship game in Basketball and all the other games can change depending on what arena they are at.

 

[Ashley]

Just a fan here but am still truly interested in bettering the sport as much as I can.

1. Universal Scoresheets: I mention this not only for the reasons already said but mostly because I feel that all worlds eligible teams should be scored on the WORLDS scoresheet in order to obtain a bid. I think this sort of fits into the Universal Scoresheet discussion because it would be the same scoresheet at any competition handing out bids. I hate that teams can win a paid bid at an event that basically ignores deductions and others go where deductions can cost you the bid. On top of that it would help with International level 5 and 6 teams where stunting so worth so much at worlds but not at other competitions so you can get a better idea of how they will stack up at worlds and also so they don't have to change their routines so much right before worlds.

The competition my team got a bid at last year did this - it was great, especially as a coed 6 team, to be judged the same way we would be in Orlando. Unfortunately, they're now a Varsity brand and I don't see them using the Worlds scoresheet again.

 

[yojaehs]

The issues we face have similarities so I can see the logic in understanding how they applied it to thier sport but my point remains gymnastics cannot solve the issues in our sport since thier objectives are not ours.
I have watched this sport grow and evolve since 1996 and I am proud of what we have accomplished in such a sort time.

A true leveling system
A clear definition of skills
Proper progression of skills (even if not everyone is smart enough to flow them yet)
Our very own world championship
A governing body (not perfect but ours)

And so much more...

We have much yet to do but let's not allow the desire to be called a "sport" cloud our judgment and let others define OUR SPORT

I hear you loud and clear and I'm not disagreeing with you that I look forward to the day that "we" have our OWN SPORT. No, the USAG is not the reason gymnastics is a sport, however they must abide by a standard to continue being a sport. They have their weaknesses but if they can ASSIST in guiding I don't see the problem. There is rarely a question if the judges at a USAG event are qualified. There scoring system is FAR greater than ours, if we can learn from them why not?

In your regards to the NBA, NFL, MLB etc. you are misinformed. I covered two Pro-Bowls for ESPN Radio (05-06) and sat in MULTIPLE committee, owner, coaches meetings where ideas of multiple sports are discussed, compared and applied. Now are ALL their rules the same, no, can everything be equally transferred, no but can ideas help each other benefit, YES!

Example, Pro-Bowl moving from HI to FL, MLB using All-Star Game to determine home field advantage during World Series were discussed by multiple "heads of their sports". Heck I see on here all the time references to dance, soccer, swimming etc. Why shouldn't we use EVERY resource we can? I feel taking the positives from anywhere we can.

 

[ztaprincess]

The competition my team got a bid at last year did this - it was great, especially as a coed 6 team, to be judged the same way we would be in Orlando. Unfortunately, they're now a Varsity brand and I don't see them using the Worlds scoresheet again.

I really really really wish that they would all be required to do this in order to hand out bids. For the Level 6 Coed teams especially it could mean an entirely different routine. If you are trying to snag a paid bid (which doesn't seem to happen often) then it is crucial to have a routine that still has plenty of tumbling to compete with the Senior 5 teams but at worlds you don't need all of that. It would give teams a much better idea of what to improve on over the season for worlds.

 

[Coach Troy]

Yes that is exactly it!!! We don't look, act, or talk like them and they are a "sport" so if we just do that and say that we are a "sport"
We can get the true governing body, the athlete registration, the judging education, and all the rest if we truly want those things we just need to understand that not all change happens quickly.

There are a lot of competition companies true but is that the problem or is it that in 1999 everyone started to call thier event "nationals" and all thier winners "national champions"?? And every level could earn it??? And even in divisions with no competition they would call you the "national champion!!".

 

[chyeeaaa69]

There are a lot of competition companies true but is that the problem or is it that in 1999 everyone started to call thier event "nationals" and all thier winners "national champions"?? And every level could earn it??? And even in divisions with no competition they would call you the "national champion!!".

PREACH!
This is my least favourite part of allstar cheerleading in the United States.

 

[Coach Troy]

If the USASF would fix this that would make me happy!!!

It kind of reminds me if the BCS ....

 

[yojaehs]

If the USASF would fix this that would make me happy!!!

It kind of reminds me if the BCS ....

Now that's funny LOL!!!

 

[cupieqt]

Parent
You all have pretty much said what I would have said, but one thing that I think really needs to be addressed is a formal complaint system. If this exists already, I had no idea.
I understand that many gyms do community (state/federal) criminal background checks on staff prior to hire. However, the loophole is that if the potential employee has done a million immoral, distasteful, or questionable (but not technically illegal) things, a background check won't show it. Take, for example, the "sending nude pics to the athlete" coach. In his state, he's being charged. In my state, they couldn't charge him for that. There's no precedent. So if this occurred in my state, he wouldn't have a record and a gym owner might unwittingly hire a creep that tip toes on the line of decent and perv.
Don't think it needs to be an investigative branch of the USASF or anything, just a database where a gym can look up to see if complaints (any complaints, really,) have been made against a potential staff member. Maybe listing how many complaints, excluding what the complaint is for. If I was a business owner looking to hire, someone with 1 complaint might be looked at differently than someone with 10 complaints, even if I don't know the exact reason. And gyms should be required to post the complaint "hotline" (or whatever) info just like they have to post minimum wage guidelines and OSHA stuff.

I actually like the hotline idea BUT, this year, suzies mom somehow made her way to my gym. She would call this hotline if she didn't like the dates for the make up classes we offered when her daughter was out sick. Seriously. She would.

 

[yojaehs]

PREACH!
This is my least favourite part of allstar cheerleading in the United States.

I'm not trying to be difficult, but how do you suggest this get fixed? I know for the EP it is crucial to "their" event that they be able to host a "national championship". IMO people can call it whatever they want, "we" all know what the "Big/important" comps to win are. Yes, its annoying to see 2340598 jackets that say "National Champion" but IMO there are only 3/4 that are "worthy". I wish it would go back to the old school regional to qualify for state then state to qualify for national and THEN INVITE ONLY World's. One can dream right!? lol.

 

[Coach Troy]

There really is no way to stop this there is too much money at stake. I just wish event producers would use common sense, but the hard part is they made the change just like the garunteed "2 day" events cause the consumers I.e. parents and gym owners were crying about it not being "fair".
Most if the trouble we are in today we caused ourselves in the early going.

 

[chyeeaaa69]

Like Coach Troy said, there really is no way of doing it. People need to put their egos aside and do what's best for the sport, but in the world we live in today, that is apparently too much to ask.