All-Star 2015 Worlds Packet

[SheCheers]

Maybe I'm really confused, but didn't everyone want USASF to step up and do something about all the teenage drinking (illegal, yet still done) and wild partying at Worlds? Here, they're stepping up and saying "no, you can't be in another country without proper documentation (also illegal in the U.S., and was done last year.) ill probably get attacked for this, but I think it is kind of a smart rule to have in place. Timing was terrible, but I think that there was good intention behind it.


It's sad that people won't follow an actual law but they'd follow USASF rules first.

I don't see it at all as the same thing.

1) Just because some people wanted usasf to step up and do something about the drinking at worlds, doesn't mean it's those same people who are opposed to this rule.

2) there are a lot of things that are illegal. Should they also add to the packet that no athlete should have ever gotten a speeding ticket? Never committed a misdemeanor or felony?

I think the bottom line is many people are over the USASF prioritizing the wrong things when there are much bigger issues at hand.

 

[quitthedrama]

My issue is that I don't trust Usasf/varsity to always have the best
intentions. I also think the timing on this one stinks. It's December. This should have been shared with gym owners back in May/June.

This is my main issue as well. USASF has so many more important things to address and choosing to add this rule in the middle of competition season makes no sense to me.
Since USASF doesn't enforce many of the rules they have, this is probably all a non-issue :D I would put money on the fact that no athlete will be prohibited from taking the Worlds mat regardless of their citizen status.

 

[Cheer Dad]

This is my main issue as well. USASF has so many more important things to address and choosing to add this rule in the middle of competition season makes no sense to me.
Since USASF doesn't enforce many of the rules they have, this is probably all a non-issue :D I would put money on the fact that no athlete will be prohibited from taking the Worlds mat regardless of their citizen status.

I think you are right about the athletes.

I wonder how the usasf can justify changes in rules AFTER competitions have started. No other sports program I can think of does this. Makes no sense at all.


**If forum lurking were an Olympic sport the Fierce Boards would be the training grounds**

 

[BlueCat]

Maybe I'm really confused, but didn't everyone want USASF to step up and do something about all the teenage drinking (illegal, yet still done) and wild partying at Worlds? Here, they're stepping up and saying "no, you can't be in another country without proper documentation (also illegal in the U.S., and was done last year.) ill probably get attacked for this, but I think it is kind of a smart rule to have in place. Timing was terrible, but I think that there was good intention behind it.


It's sad that people won't follow an actual law but they'd follow USASF rules first.

Regulating participants behavior AT THEIR OWN event is within the limited scope of what USASF should be doing - particularly when it clearly and directly impacts the safety of the athletes.

If they are going to be the regulators of the industry, we want them making wise decisions that are implemented in transparent, timely, efficient ways. "Yeah, but at least they meant well" is not enough.

In and of itself, this isn't an earth-shattering rule. I just dislike "mission creep" - particularly in an organization with such a poorly set-up power structure. (Permanent, self-appointed officers and board members at the top of the food chain.)

 

[Ashley]

Yes the flyers for a J1 visa are all over campus here. It's not particularly hard to get one either I don't think. You pay your money for a return flight and an interview in the US Embassy is all I think. Very few people get rejected.

Sure, but now you're paying huge fees to study in the US. Most European countries have free/subsidized tertiary education. Why would you take out $30K in school loans just to cheer in another country? And there are huge limits to how much you can work when you're here if you have a student visa.

 

[Ashley]

Maybe I'm really confused, but didn't everyone want USASF to step up and do something about all the teenage drinking (illegal, yet still done) and wild partying at Worlds? Here, they're stepping up and saying "no, you can't be in another country without proper documentation (also illegal in the U.S., and was done last year.) ill probably get attacked for this, but I think it is kind of a smart rule to have in place. Timing was terrible, but I think that there was good intention behind it.


It's sad that people won't follow an actual law but they'd follow USASF rules first.

USASF is the governing body of US Cheer. They can't go make immigration rules for Worlds that affect every other country.

 

[kristenthegreat]

Sure, but now you're paying huge fees to study in the US. Most European countries have free/subsidized tertiary education. Why would you take out $30K in school loans just to cheer in another country? And there are huge limits to how much you can work when you're here if you have a student visa.

This is mostly done in the summer or for part of the year post-grad (university).

ETA: Whoops beat me to it!

 

[yooolizzi]

USASF is the governing body of US Cheer. They can't go make immigration rules for Worlds that affect every other country.

I'm assuming the rule was announced because it is held in the US, the governing body is based in the US, it's US law to have your paperwork done to be here, and there were people banned from the country for not having their proper documentation.

 

[omgitssydthekid]

I don't see it at all as the same thing.

1) Just because some people wanted usasf to step up and do something about the drinking at worlds, doesn't mean it's those same people who are opposed to this rule.

2) there are a lot of things that are illegal. Should they also add to the packet that no athlete should have ever gotten a speeding ticket? Never committed a misdemeanor or felony?

I think the bottom line is many people are over the USASF prioritizing the wrong things when there are much bigger issues at hand.

Violating a country's immigration laws is a lot different than going 10 miles over the speed limit. I'm not saying this rule is great, and the timing is seriously horrible, but I don't think it's the end of the world. I agree that there are other things the USASF should be prioritizing but I don't think this rule is a bad idea. However, it shouldn't be put in place for the 2015 worlds. The rule clearly isn't developed enough since everyone has so many valid questions about it that a two sentence blurb in the worlds packet can't answer.


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[Ashley]

I'm assuming the rule was announced because it is held in the US, the governing body is based in the US, it's US law to have your paperwork done to be here, and there were people banned from the country for not having their proper documentation.

Then USASF can enforce it for US Teams. If the comp is held on US soil, why does the USASF care if that German on that French team is a French citizen? All that matters is that international competitors are in the US legally to compete, what happens the rest of the year shouldn't be a concern to the USASF, at least not for non-US teams.

And at the VERY LEAST, this should have been communicated long before the worlds packet came out and with some advance warning.

You do not have to be a citizen, or legal resident (green card) or student to be in this country legally. There were a lot of foreigners who competed on US teams legally last year - and their Visa probably won't qualify under the new rule. This rule is the equivalent of throwing the baby out with the bath water.

 

[CheerBank]

Then USASF can enforce it for US Teams. If the comp is held on US soil, why does the USASF care if that German on that French team is a French citizen? All that matters is that international competitors are in the US legally to compete, what happens the rest of the year shouldn't be a concern to the USASF, at least not for non-US teams.

And at the VERY LEAST, this should have been communicate long before the worlds packet came out and with some advance warning.

You do not have to be a citizen, or legal resident (green card) or student to be in this country legally. There were a lot of foreigners who competed on US teams legally last year - and their Visa probably won't qualify under the new rule. This rule is the equivalent of throwing the baby out with the bath water.

That's my biggest issue with all of this. All other problems I have with the USASF aside, how do they think it is okay to make this a rule at this point in the season?

 

[gofriars610]

Maybe I'm really confused, but didn't everyone want USASF to step up and do something about all the teenage drinking (illegal, yet still done) and wild partying at Worlds? Here, they're stepping up and saying "no, you can't be in another country without proper documentation (also illegal in the U.S., and was done last year.) ill probably get attacked for this, but I think it is kind of a smart rule to have in place. Timing was terrible, but I think that there was good intention behind it.


It's sad that people won't follow an actual law but they'd follow USASF rules first.

I'm going to throw out a bunch of hypotheticals based off of a real pair of towns, Calais, ME and St. Stephen, NB. They're two different towns in two different countries, but they share EVERYTHING. (The link has more details.) It's not weird at all to go grocery shopping in one country and go to another to buy gas, for instance.

Say I lived in St. Stephen and went to high school there, but the closest all-star gym was Calais Extreme (which doesn't exist to my knowledge, but again, hypotheticals). I'd still be a legal resident of New Brunswick and Canada, but it's perfectly legal for me (and anyone else with a passport) to cross the border into Maine for practice or for a team sleepover or anything of the sort.

However, because I'm not a legal resident (or whatever a "legal student resident" is) of the United States, I would be barred from competing with Calais Extreme at Worlds, despite having a 100% legal presence in the U.S.

It was wrong of the athlete to overstay his/her tourist visa. That is illegal. The situation detailed above is logical, plausible, and perfectly in line with U.S. law...yet an athlete is still being prohibited from competing. That's what people are upset about.

 

[njallday]

because there is IASF for countries other than the US, does this mean they're safe? like the athletes traveling over a European border to cheer (which is equivalent to someone traveling from PA to NJ to cheer.) does the USASF rule ONLY impact US-based gyms? so everyone competing with a gym registered in the United States has to legally be in the United States? I am much more okay with the rule only being about the US rather than the whole world. still poor timing, though.

side note - isn't there an EU passport that allows you into all 28 member states freely, without a visa? I'm very rusty on my international knowledge, but isn't there that whole "freedom of movement" rule? so USASF/IASF could not stop European athletes from cheering in other countries, because you'd be in that country legally. right?

 

[catlady]

From the USASF member insurance coverage policy frequently asked questions dated August 2014 underwritten by K&K insurance USASF Cheer Gyms :

"Is my cheer gym covered for a meet or tournament that we are hosting that involves non-registered students/members?

Yes, liability coverage is included for meets or tournaments you host that include students/members of your school, as well as non-registered students/members. Medical payments for participants coverage is not available for non-registered students."

My guess is someone on the legal staff just read the insurance policy and realized the terms in which coverage is available. The website doesn't have the policy in its entirety but, this explains the "registered student" issue and I would imagine it probably has something concerning legal residents, as well.

 

[AliciaM]

I think it's a different situation if you're living in Canada and going over the border because you're not living in the states. I think the real issue that usasf is bringing up is when people are moving to the U.S. to live and cheer without having a visa. I really don't think it should concern them. However, the gyms that are taking these athletes in that are from another country should care. They should be making sure the athletes are there legally and that the athlete has valid medical insurance for the duration of their stay.

That's my opinion on the matter. I don't think it's a horrible rule that usasf made I just think it should be a more lengthy rule as well as not implemented until 2016 since tryouts haven't happened yet and kids aren't flying from all over to cheer somewhere when they don't have the proper documentation to do so.