All-Star Instead Of Reducing Tumbling How About Huge Tumble Bust Deductions

[krissycole44]

i would LOVE this rule.. i think its pretty simple and clear to understand!

 

[12stepCheermom]

well maybe usasf should have a mandatory summer clinic for coaches to all be on the same page. or debbie love could run it.

And they have a single governing body, and they have a universal scoring and deduction system that doesn't change from competition to competition, and they have credentialed athletes so you can't "sandbag" level 7 because you're an established level 9.

 

[cali20allstars10]

And they have a single governing body, and they have a universal scoring and deduction system that doesn't change from competition to competition, and they have credentialed athletes so you can't "sandbag" level 7 because you're an established level 9.

it only goes up to level 5

 

[Deleted member 11199]

Totally agree, if you have tumbling flaws or a bust, it should be equal to a stunt fall

 

[cheer4cea]

it only goes up to level 5

They are talking about gymnastics levels, which go beyond level 5.

 

[12stepCheermom]

it only goes up to level 5

Gymnastics goes to level 10.

 

[Mightymouse34]

I agree that higher tumbling deductions is the key, but not increasing bust or touch down deductions. Technique however... We are trying to increase technique so it is safer, not just whoever can land it. You can land and still hurt yourself.

obviously you don't have proper technique if you cant land it in a competition. So therefore increasing the bust or touch down deduction will make your think twice before throwing a skill you can only hit in your gym. Even if its 100 out of 100 times you still didn't land it when it counts. We're trying to make cheer a respectable sport, so we need to face the fact that performing under pressure is part of a sport...in football a field goal kicker can hit a 30 yard field goal 100% of the time during practice, but that doesn't make him a good kicker. What makes him a good kicker is the fact that he can nail the field goal when the game is on the line and it matters most. That goes with any other sport. I understand flukes happen, but in any other sport there is no difference between a fluke and a mistake, they both lead to the same outcome. And I don't believe there should be a difference in cheer either.

 

[crazeecheermom]

I am convinced that perfection before progression is key. we need to promote this ideal. I am constantly showing my daughter the difference in how a skill looks when it is executed properly. we refer to it as being "pretty". This should be promoted to our athletes. That is an ideal that gymnastics has embraced.

 

[Taylor Taryn]

In my opinion, cheer is a dangerous sport in general. If you can't for sure land a tumbling pass, don't compete it. You're bound to get at least one injury in your cheer career.

 

[orangecrush3927]

There needs to not only be education on proper technique and coaching, but coaches need to know what causes injuries... It's not the double. Its the landing- the landing of a jump, a tuck, a full. They can all cause the same injuries. Obviously the more force involved, the more prone one is to injury. It's also not just about incomplete rotation. There are plenty of incomplete doubles that can be landed correctly. I'd rather see a 1 3/4 with feet together and land with bent knees than a double that makes it all the way around has crossed ankles/feet apart or lands with straight legs.

That being said, I don't think deductions are necessarily the only way to solve this. First of all technique and execution are NOT the same thing. They may be related, but not the same. I mean heck, there's even a safer way to bust tumbling! You can perfectly "execute" a standing full with poor technique if you're strong enough.

Judges and coaches both need to know what is CORRECT and SAFE. There needs to be industry standards not just for what's allowed, but what is correct. Coaches need to make sure that their routines reflect their knowledge of proper tumbling and judges need to make sure that their scores also reflect this. Right now the technique portion of the score sheet is not well-defined OR utilized like it should be.

 

[worldchampME]

I can agree with this! From a coaches stand point, I know that I am constantly readjusting tumbling and stunts to make sure they are executed well and getting the difficulty AND execution points that they deserve. If they smack HUGE deductions on incomplete passes and ones that touch out or bust, I am going to take the initiative to take it out. It's not worth the risk, not in ANY division. With that being the case, there should be a higher emphasis on points giving for execution in tumbling then, that way there is more of an incentive to PUSH good technique, making our coaches better coaches and more knowledgeable in ALSO gymnastics :) juss sayin!

 

[0riginal]

I think the deductions are a great idea in order to get some tumbling back!

And I'm just kind of trying to reason these new rules, but I was thinking was that a reason they could have changed the tumbling is because judges are not going to go through every standing full, full double, etc. and approve/disapprove them. And even if they did do that, there's no way they could ensure that a coach wouldn't put it back into the routine.
That was just an idea I had, that they're trying to sort of blanket the safety concerns. :p

 

[ntlgnt1]

Let us say no one took out any of the allowed tumbling. But if you bust there are huge deductions. Let us say 5pts at worlds for every tumbling bust, 3 points for a touch down.

Feel free to throw all the skills you want, but you will move down the ranks quickly if you arent performing skills you have mastered.

This also could be applied everywhere at every level. Would not be breaking the rules cycle. And would have the same affect without pissing people off.

I thought it already was a deduction to bust on your tumbling! When my CPs team got score sheets, we'd wonder why they weren't placing even though there were no touch downs or stunt falls. But there would always be a lower score in overall and then a note about bad technique on tumbling; ie legs open on standing tucks, legs balled up on fulls, stepping out wrong, taking a step, or stepping forward on a skill.

 

[MyssMyst]

I'm totally okay with this idea. I'm not competing in anything to spare my ego. Part of competition is learning how to appropriately deal with it when you fail. Failure WILL happen. I can have one tiny mistake on a jump course that costs me a top 10 finish, and that's ok. I spent tens of thousands in training, board, membership dues, and competition fees annually. It SUCKS when a tiny screw up costs me any hope of placing in a class, but I've learned how to deal with it and move on. In the workplace, I go much further than the coworkers who have not learned how to deal with failure. It's a life lesson. No reason our kids can't learn it in cheer.

 

[NCMom]

Our kids at Rays definitely do not compete the skills they can attempt in the gym. As far as a fluke people will only put in skills they know will never fluke. Now we go into worlds excited to watch routines but ALSO not knowing who will win. It will come down to difficulty AND hitting.

There are no flukes. If you can't hit 100 out of 100 you shouldn't compete it. Thats why these rules are changing. We gotta choose one or the other.

2 things....1 That is why Rays are so AMAZING at every level, they compete level appropriate solid routines (something I love our gym for as well) and 2. YES YES YES. If you are not 100% ready for it don't do it. I would rather see a SOLID ready level one team than a shaky level 2 who doesn't have all the skill sets properly there any day.

We competed with you guys at BUTBT and every team was great!