All-Star I'm Going To Cheat

[MomOf2ThatsMe]

IDK if you were the originator of this but I don't understand why this would be that hard. I feel like it is going to take a serendipitous slap in the face moment before people realize there are problems.

It wouldn't be. Especially considering at many nationals or larger regionals they already have a team picture taken by the action photo vendors.

 

[King]

It wouldn't be. Especially considering at many nationals or larger regionals they already have a team picture taken by the action photo vendors.

What we would not want is to go through the photo vendors. That would allow someone to 'lose' a photo when convenient.

Think of it this way: What if there had to be a photo of every worlds team each day or the EP was fined $500. Think they would ever lose one?

 

[cheer8]

What we would not want is to go through the photo vendors. That would allow someone to 'lose' a photo when convenient.

Think of it this way: What if there had to be a photo of every worlds team each day or the EP was fined $500. Think they would ever lose one?

Great idea but Raise the fine!!!

 

[King]

Great idea but Raise the fine!!!

How much should a fine be before it matters? $500 too small? $1000? $5000?

 

[MomOf2ThatsMe]

What we would not want is to go through the photo vendors. That would allow someone to 'lose' a photo when convenient.

Think of it this way: What if there had to be a photo of every worlds team each day or the EP was fined $500. Think they would ever lose one?

True. However, since they are already posed & lined up, just put it in the contract (I'm assuming vendors sign contracts to be at these events) that the vendor must allow the EP has have a rep on hand to snap a picture at that time along with the vendor and that the vendor representative must allow a clear, unobstructed view for the one photo.

 

[MomOf2ThatsMe]

How much should a fine be before it matters? $500 too small? $1000? $5000?

Go big or go home. Just like you said, a kid only burns their hand on the stove once.

 

[cheer8]

How much should a fine be before it matters? $500 too small? $1000? $5000?

higher the better... to small people will try to get away with it... if you set it high smaller competition companies will never even think of it and larger companies wouldn't want to lose that money as well for they have to spend more money for their facilities and event decor (LOL) This will deter all involved!

 

[MomOf2ThatsMe]

Also, I know Worlds is the the top events in the industry, and thus gains a lot of attention. If the Summit gains traction as the lower-level Worlds event, it is open to abuses as well and I do believe that similar strategies should be in place for that competition.

 

[Cheer_Explosion_Coach]

What we would not want is to go through the photo vendors. That would allow someone to 'lose' a photo when convenient.

Think of it this way: What if there had to be a photo of every worlds team each day or the EP was fined $500. Think they would ever lose one?

I think the EP could choose to use a vendor. But the responsibility to produce the photo would be on the EP. And yes $5,000 shoudl be the floor for this fine.

 

[BlueCat]

What we would not want is to go through the photo vendors. That would allow someone to 'lose' a photo when convenient.

Think of it this way: What if there had to be a photo of every worlds team each day or the EP was fined $500. Think they would ever lose one?

In order to make it harder to cheat, the photos need to be taken RIGHT before (or after) the team takes the mat. It should be difficult to switch someone in/out of the photo between the pic and the performance. The photos also need to be posted somewhere public and permanent, with date stamps. It wouldn't need to be anything elaborate - a picture from an IPhone or similar would more than suffice.

NOTE: This is not a perfect solution. It would not make cheating impossible. However, it is essentially free and it would make it much more difficult and risky for a gym to lie about their rosters.

 

[Cheer_Explosion_Coach]

In order to make it harder to cheat, the photos need to be taken RIGHT before (or after) the team takes the mat. It should be difficult to switch someone in/out of the photo between the pic and the performance. The photos also need to be posted somewhere public and permanent, with date stamps. It wouldn't need to be anything elaborate - a picture from an IPhone or similar would more than suffice.

NOTE: This is not a perfect solution. It would not make cheating impossible. However, it is essentially free and it would make it much more difficult and risky for a gym to lie about their rosters.

I wonder if we can convince an EP to do it as a trial run. To take a step towards eliminating cheating. It wouldn't immediately give them a competitive advantage so I wonder if they would invest the small amount of $$ and time to see if this works.

 

[cheercurl]

I still firmly believe that putting every team's group photo (with each athlete's face being clearly visible) on a public web site for every competition eliminates most of the problem. It is has nearly zero cost, simple to implement, and would be highly effective. It would be a huge deterrent and make the enforcement/punishment process MUCH easier - like security cameras at a retail store.

I do get blank stares when I try to argue this at committee and Board meetings, though - so perhaps I am wrong. It just seems like it would be SO much easier to catch cheaters if we did this. You would effectively be crowd-sourcing your investigation process.

Imagine the decision process of whether to use an overage athlete at Worlds if you knew that a picture of each athlete would be available for everyone to see afterwards.

The only thing I don't like about this is I have "crazy parent's" at my school who will not even let me put up a picture of their child a bulletin board. I am guessing those same parents are not going to let you put up a picture of their kid on the web.

I still think passport ID card could work. There are always going to be parents that won't want to follow requirements. I am not sure we can account for every variable. Make it a requirement and see how it goes. The card is much more private than name and picture on web.

 

[cheercurl]

My ultimate solution would be like kingston says: RFID tags and a well-designed database.

The downside is that requires a level of cooperation, organization, and efficiency that doesn't exist in the industry yet.

Now this I believe...just sayin'

 

[BlueCat]

The only thing I don't like about this is I have "crazy parent's" at my school who will not even let me put up a picture of their child a bulletin board. I am guessing those same parents are not going to let you put up a picture of their kid on the web.

I still think passport ID card could work. There are always going to be parents that won't want to follow requirements. I am not sure we can account for every variable. Make it a requirement and see how it goes. The card is much more private than name and picture on web.

I hadn't thought of having the rosters included on there, but that would be an added security measure. Perhaps the photos could only be available to those with a paid USASF membership.

 

[12stepCheermom]

Happened at Cheersport mini 1 division last year from our gym. One of our mini 2 girls started filling in for someone that quit a couple weeks before and when they jump, bhs in mini 2, they jump pause bwo in 1. Everyone else paused, she went right on over. They went from 1st or 2nd day one to last. Oh, well. it happens.

That happened with a tiny 1 at USFinals years ago at our old gym. She got pulled up to fill in for my daughters mini 2. Well she did great on mini 2 and went to her tiny 1 where she was the point in standing tumbling and was supposed to do a round off back walk over....

...uh...that'd be a round off back hand spring.

The look on her face when she snapped up was priceless! She remembered she wasn't supposed to do it in mid air. She was like 4-5 at the time.

Given the fact we knew we were gonna finish dead last in that competition with just about every team...our daughters mini 2 finished 8th of 9 that year and we thought we'd won the lottery because we weren't DEAD last, we just thought it ws hilarious.

They're still on the same team today 4 years later, only now that little 9 year old powerhouse with the right resources and coaches has a mean kick double basket and whips through to layout and my son coed stunts her whenever he feels like tossing girls in the air :)