All-Star Redfining Positions In Stunts

[CGAcheer]

In fact, in level 1 you could do a prep with one person, as long as two people are spotters. This matrix actually opens up for more difficult skills but makes teams provide spotters.

You can already do that with 1 spotter

 

[CGAcheer]

Cradles:
For levels 1-5 all cradles require at least 2 catchers, with the following exceptions:
at level 1, Cradles from prep level require 3 catchers.
at Level 2 Cradles from extension require 3 catchers.
Level 6, only requires 1 catcher for 0-1 skill cradles

Stunts:
Level 1, stunts at prep level require 3 attentive athletes(AA)
Level 2, Prep Level stunts require 2 AA, extended stunts need 3 AA
Level 3-5 Extended Stunts need 2 AA
Level 6 only needs 1 AA but perhaps 2 AA for free flipping entries

The the only thing I would potently add is 3 catchers for twist cradles at level 3 and 3 catchers for double twisting cradles at level 4

 

[rvnblue]

Currently all coaches DO determine the level and ability of an athlete. Who do you think chooses what level a team goes into? This is no different than gymnastics, isn't it? Doesn't the athlete / coach choose what level to compete at?

It is true that the coach determines the level at which the athlete competes in gymnastics; however, it is an individual sport where the skills must add up to create a base score suitable for the level, not like in cheer where you can have majority on the floor with at-level skills and some below level.

 

[King]

It is true that the coach determines the level at which the athlete competes in gymnastics; however, it is an individual sport where the skills must add up to create a base score suitable for the level, not like in cheer where you can have majority on the floor with at-level skills and some below level.

The differences do not matter. It is still up to the coach to determine ability level.

 

[King]

You can already do that with 1 spotter

Yeah, and considering the level is made for completely beginners that just walk in off the street I think that is not smart.

 

[King]

Cradles:
For levels 1-5 all cradles require at least 2 catchers, with the following exceptions:
at level 1, Cradles from prep level require 3 catchers.
at Level 2 Cradles from extension require 3 catchers.
Level 6, only requires 1 catcher for 0-1 skill cradles

Stunts:
Level 1, stunts at prep level require 3 attentive athletes(AA)
Level 2, Prep Level stunts require 2 AA, extended stunts need 3 AA
Level 3-5 Extended Stunts need 2 AA
Level 6 only needs 1 AA but perhaps 2 AA for free flipping entries

The the only thing I would potently add is 3 catchers for twist cradles at level 3 and 3 catchers for double twisting cradles at level 4

Level 3 extended one leg stunts require 3 athletes.

 

[BlueCat]

Instead of debating what numbers go into each square on the grid (plenty of time for that later), do we like the CONCEPT of a grid like this? (The biggest change is that there is no distinction made between the grips/roles of the people under the flyer.) If not, are there other ways to set this up? Do we like having a different grid for cradles? Do we need another grid? Do we need more columns?

My perception is that this makes things much more straightforward and easier to understand. (for coaches, athletes, safety judges, and parents) It also gives us some flexibility to alter the numbers if needed without rewriting the entire rulebook. All else being equal, rules that you understand are safer than ones you don't.

There would need to be some additional rules for inversions or unusual transitions that would need to be regulated a bit. There would also need to be clear definitions of "prep level", "extended", etc.

 

[King]

Instead of debating what numbers go into each square on the grid (plenty of time for that later), do we like the CONCEPT of a grid like this? (The biggest change is that there is no distinction made between the grips/roles of the people under the flyer.) If not, are there other ways to set this up? Do we like having a different grid for cradles? Do we need another grid? Do we need more columns?

My perception is that this makes things much more straightforward and easier to understand. (for coaches, athletes, safety judges, and parents) It also gives us some flexibility to alter the numbers if needed without rewriting the entire rulebook. All else being equal, rules that you understand are safer than ones you don't.

There would need to be some additional rules for inversions or unusual transitions that would need to be regulated a bit. There would also need to be clear definitions of "prep level", "extended", etc.

I love it! (shocker)

 

[rvnblue]

Instead of debating what numbers go into each square on the grid (plenty of time for that later), do we like the CONCEPT of a grid like this? (The biggest change is that there is no distinction made between the grips/roles of the people under the flyer.) If not, are there other ways to set this up? Do we like having a different grid for cradles? Do we need another grid? Do we need more columns?

My perception is that this makes things much more straightforward and easier to understand. (for coaches, athletes, safety judges, and parents) It also gives us some flexibility to alter the numbers if needed without rewriting the entire rulebook. All else being equal, rules that you understand are safer than ones you don't.

There would need to be some additional rules for inversions or unusual transitions that would need to be regulated a bit. There would also need to be clear definitions of "prep level", "extended", etc.

I think the concept is AMAZING! The inherent combination of flexibility in degree of difficulty and safety makes for a great standard.

 

[BlueCat]

Are there other ways to simplify the rules without allowing more dangerous stunts? A basket toss skills grid and a twisting mount grid would both be easy. What else?

I firmly believe that the rules should be as simple and straightforward as possible. Are there rules that need to be jettisoned?

Example: I think the rule requiring hard-soled shoes is silly. (I do not care to see barefoot teams, but that is for aesthetic reasons, not safety reasons. Gymnastics and Acro compete without shoes) Anything that isn't safety-related doesn't belong in the safety rules, IMO.

 

[CGAcheer]

Level 3 extended one leg stunts require 3 athletes.

Are you saying that is how it should be or how it currently is? And do you mean 3 as in 2 on the ground and 1 in the air or 3 on the ground?

My opinion and the way the rules currently are is that you need at least 2 people on the ground. Currently you can single base with a spotter.

 

[rvnblue]

Are there other ways to simplify the rules without allowing more dangerous stunts? A basket toss skills grid and a twisting mount grid would both be easy. What else?

I firmly believe that the rules should be as simple and straightforward as possible. Are there rules that need to be jettisoned?

Example: I think the rule requiring hard-soled shoes is silly. (I do not care to see barefoot teams, but that is for aesthetic reasons, not safety reasons. Gymnastics and Acro compete without shoes) Anything that isn't safety-related doesn't belong in the safety rules, IMO.

Would you apply the number of attentive athletes required for stunts to inversions or required for cradles?

 

[CGAcheer]

Are there other ways to simplify the rules without allowing more dangerous stunts? A basket toss skills grid and a twisting mount grid would both be easy. What else?

I firmly believe that the rules should be as simple and straightforward as possible. Are there rules that need to be jettisoned?

Example: I think the rule requiring hard-soled shoes is silly. (I do not care to see barefoot teams, but that is for aesthetic reasons, not safety reasons. Gymnastics and Acro compete without shoes) Anything that isn't safety-related doesn't belong in the safety rules, IMO.

Im in favor of getting rid of the spotter terminology. Not a big fan of the grid, they seem simple, but then they start expanding to where there are ten different scenarios within one level that require different numbers of attentive athletes. And this particular grid is more restrictive than our current rules in the number of people you need for a stunt.

And I think the shoe rule is more of a don't wear jazz shoes or flip flops(safety issue) rule than a don't go bare foot rule.

But there are some rules that are a little too interpretive. Such as the braced inversions in level 4 having to be connected on two sides which is dependent on I guess angles, where does the front side end and the right side begin? Are 44 degrees and 46 degrees two separate sides? Should be right and left side of the flyers body instead of the positioning of the bracers in relation to the flyer

 

[King]

Are you saying that is how it should be or how it currently is? And do you mean 3 as in 2 on the ground and 1 in the air or 3 on the ground?

My opinion and the way the rules currently are is that you need at least 2 people on the ground. Currently you can single base with a spotter.

I don't think that is generally a smart thing. I think have 3 on the ground for level 3 extended stunts makes sense. This is the first level where they can extend 1 leg stunts, so requiring 2 extra people does not seem irrational.

 

[King]

Im in favor of getting rid of the spotter terminology. Not a big fan of the grid, they seem simple, but then they start expanding to where there are ten different scenarios within one level that require different numbers of attentive athletes. And this particular grid is more restrictive than our current rules in the number of people you need for a stunt.

And I think the shoe rule is more of a don't wear jazz shoes or flip flops(safety issue) rule than a don't go bare foot rule.

But there are some rules that are a little too interpretive. Such as the braced inversions in level 4 having to be connected on two sides which is dependent on I guess angles, where does the front side end and the right side begin? Are 44 degrees and 46 degrees two separate sides? Should be right and left side of the flyers body instead of the positioning of the bracers in relation to the flyer

With the grid I think you are going to get some repositioning on what is and what isn't smart. Think of it this way... just because you can do certain things in certain levels and you cannot do certain things in certain levels doesn't mean they are 'right'.