All-Star Twerk Ban

[dawgshow]

Cranberry!
oops you beat me to it... Vodka!

Line twist. (If that's not too scandalous)


The Fierce Board App! || iPhone || Android || Upgrade Your Account!

 

[dawgshow]

Since when is morality scientifically based?


The Fierce Board App! || iPhone || Android || Upgrade Your Account!

 

[ErinS]

...I just read an article called "All Twerk and a Lot of Play" and it basically said twerking would soon replace Zumba in popularity

As for trends that didn't make ACSM's list, Ryan says mindset training, which addresses the emotional reasons why people eat badly and don't take care of themselves, will be a growth area in the years to come. And she doesn't think we should be too quick to dismiss twerking. "Zumba's done its dash ... but, the next thing you know, people will be twerking all over the place," Ryan says.

The article is from Australia

"All twerk and a lot of play." Sydney Morning Herald [Sydney, Australia] 27 Dec. 2012: 5.Opposing Viewpoints In Context. Web. 24 July 2013.

The librarian in me couldn't resist looking in Opposing Viewpoints.... gah is it Bey-Day yet....

 

[Just-a-Mom]

...I just read an article called "All Twerk and a Lot of Play" and it basically said twerking would soon replace Zumba in popularity


The article is from Australia





The librarian in me couldn't resist looking in Opposing Viewpoints.... gah is it Bey-Day yet....

My grandmother was a librarian for 30 years. So I'm getting extra joy in knowing that today the librarian is researching opposing viewpoints on twerking. At work. Now I'm wondering did my grandmother research opposing viewpoints on Elvis or The Twist back in her day? :eek:

 

[RaRaMama]

I just don't understand why people are upset about the ban. I would hope that my CP would have enough sense not to even think of posting a "twerking" video, but it's nice to know a gym puts it out there in black and white. On the flip side, if my daughter had similarly inappropriate dance moves in her choreography that sent the same message, I would not have issue with voicing my concerns. There are plenty of fierce dance moves that don't leave you looking like a hoochie mama.

 

[mccracal]

Do you have scientific evidence to refute those ideas? Because there actually is plenty of evidence to support them. And I also have taken several college courses on all sorts of biology and psychology.




Yes, internet definitions are sketchy at best. But the actual dictionary on my desk didn't have twerk in it so I had to work with what I had at my disposal. That being said, the internet does happen to be where the majority of people get their info from nowadays. I'm 40 years old - I've been around for a lot of dances, but I'd say this is one of the few I just can't get on board with. I lived in south Florida in the early 90s, when I was 19-20 years old - I've seen twerking in many forms, long before it got "popular." :eek: None of them were artistic.

I agree about the Twist. Yes, things we used to think of as scandalous are now seen as innocent and normal. I don't actually think this is necessarily a good thing though.

I know you (and someone else but I don't remember who) think twerking didn't come from strippers, but I'm going to argue that it did. Your "historical" source is probably about as valid as mine. My source is life experience, and I'm saying strippers in Atlanta and south Florida in the late 80s and early 90s brought twerking to the US. I don't know for sure who named it or if the history of the actual word twerk came from strippers, but the dance did.

I understand that the argument is that it originally came from African dance. I'm going to go ahead and call bs on that. No one is putting a dance on vine or tumblr or youtube to show off their knowledge of African dance. No stripper at Magic City or in Ft Lauderdale said "Oh, let me show these men my artistic African dance for money!" So try to make it sound historical all you want, but the twerking that you see these kids doing now originated with strippers. To try to make it cute or historical or even just not gross is absurd.

(***To clarify, my extensive knowledge of "dancers" in the south in the 90s does not come from being one. :oops: But I did work for a record label and work with a lot of rappers (sadly no one important). Ergo...lots of...um..."young ladies" involved in my line of work.)

1) The lack of evidence and lack of testability of hypotheses is a very common criticism of evolutionary psychology. One of the most accessible works of evolutionary psychology, "How Women Got Their Curves and Other Just-So Stories", explores many of issues that we've been discussing. However, while it does a wonderful job at citing scholarly sources that seem to support its positions, all of their claims about the evolution of human sexuality is rooted in phrasing like "may have been", "could have possibly led to..." etc. You'll find that this sort of phrasing is incredibly common among evolutionary psychologists. There aren't even any strict scientific theories about the most basic components of the mechanisms of natural selection; there certainly isn't widespread, definitive agreement on the development of the sexuality of the rear-end. If you want, I'll be happy to send you the paper I wrote that has a more in-depth (7 pages) criticism of this text and using this type of misleading language in "scientific" books.

2) Artistic certainly is a subjective phrase, but I'll admit that the 90's club girls and the exotic dancers on the stripper poles probably weren't trying to pay homage to Africa when they jiggled their butt. I'll even concede that strippers have helped popularize the phenomenon. However, I don't think that's really relevant when you look objectively at the movements. Even if the strippers popularized the "twerk" type of booty shake, you don't deny that those types of movements were used similarly by African dancers. You also don't seem to be insinuating that the African cultures who incorporated those types of movement in their dances had the same vulgar intent as a coked up stripper rump-shaking in a g-string in order to get some more tips.

If the strippers do the same movements as the African dancers without the intent of emulating them, can't teenage girls do the same movements without the intent of emulating the strippers? From what I've seen, most teenage girls don't twerk with the intention of mimicking strippers; they tend to think practicing the dance itself is just a fun and silly way to get moving. That's definitely distinct from the intention of African dancers, but it's also considerably different from the intention of the strippers.

 

[ErinS]

My grandmother was a librarian for 30 years. So I'm getting extra joy in knowing that today the librarian is researching opposing viewpoints on twerking. At work. Now I'm wondering did my grandmother research opposing viewpoints on Elvis or The Twist back in her day? :eek:

I've honestly researched more head turning and eye popping things for people in my 2 1/2 yrs since grad school.

I don't have a real opinion on the matter. It's not my cup of tea, I don't have the physique, coordination or rhythm a twerk calls for....but a lot of the articles I'm reading embrace the idea of twerking and it appears that everyone that opposes it is over reacting.

I wouldn't do it. I'd rather not see it. But again. I don't have a dog in this fight.


Just know that somewhere in America Miley Cyrus is still twerking. Twerk. Twerk. Twerk. Twerk. Miley. Miley. Miley. Only in America. (Hi to the jay Z fans)

 

[Just-a-Mom]

If the strippers do the same movements as the African dancers without the intent of emulating them, can't teenage girls do the same movements without the intent of emulating the strippers? From what I've seen, most teenage girls don't twerk with the intention of mimicking strippers; they tend to think practicing the dance itself is just a fun and silly way to get moving. That's definitely distinct from the intention of African dancers, but it's also considerably different from the intention of the strippers.

From what I know of teenage girls, it's not too unlikely that emulating strippers is actually what their intent is. Maybe not strippers per se, but certainly to be sexy. I don't think teenage girls are aware of repercussions and consequences, so they tend to do things to be "cute" without thinking. And I don't mean "cute" in a child-like or teddy bear kind of way. I mean cute like in a "I want all the boys looking at me" kind of way. I find younger girls tend to not be aware of quite how much acting trashy gets them looked at (and treated) like trash. That's a lesson you usually figure out much later in life. The even younger girls doing it are just emulating the older girls doing it.

This is not to say all teenage girls are like this. I don't even think I'd say "most" - but girls that do things like upload videos of themselves twerking don't usually realize that the attention they're getting isn't really what they want. I guess my whole point has been that I don't think there has ever been a case of a girl twerking that she got any kind of attention other than "Yeah girl shake that thang!" <---Yep, right from the keyboard of Carol Brady, the word "thang" for Fierce Board's enjoyment. This does not make me think "class" or any other positive quality that I would want attributed to my daughters. Girls post these things for that reaction. I'm sure your millions of psychology classes could give you plenty of insight into why they'd want that reaction; I have plenty of my own thoughts on it (most of them are the same as any other reason kids act out - never for the reason on the surface).

Like I said earlier, if you want to do it or there are parents who think it's cute, knock yourselves out. I, and many many other people, think it's classless and low rent. If I look at you sideways, now y'all know why. I imagine these are the same parents who think it's cute when their toddler sings trashy lyrics off the radio or when their 5 year old does her first booty pop. Not cute to me, but hey, they're not my kids. If a gym wants to make a rule, that's their prerogative and it's anyone's choice whether or not to cheer there.

My only issue was people trying to make it seem like twerking wasn't meant to be sexual and I think that's naive. I think young girls know a lot more about their bodies and boys than we give them credit for.

 

[Pip22]

Just know that somewhere in America Miley Cyrus is still twerking. Twerk. Twerk. Twerk. Twerk. Miley. Miley. Miley. Only in America. (Hi to the jay Z fans)

My achy breaky heart twinges at this thought.
p.s I'm so jealous of you seeing Beyonce on Saturday. Saw her for the second time in May in nosebleed seats and need to see her slay again.

 

[Ren]

We need a twerking cow.

I wonder if there are any scholarly journals published discussing the correlation between the human evolutionary process and twerking on social media? See you all at the library!

I think your posts are the only thing making me open this thread every time it pops up!

The Fierce Board App! || iPhone || Android || Upgrade Your Account!

 

[ErinS]

My achy breaky heart twinges at this thought.
p.s I'm so jealous of you seeing Beyonce on Saturday. Saw her for the second time in May in nosebleed seats and need to see her slay again.

I'm excited about going...relatively.... I'm only going because Michael Jackson is dead and Janet Jackson is married to some billionaire and doesn't put out new music and the last music she put out blew....So...I decided to go be a Beyonce fan by default. I tried being an Usher fan as well...his concert was okay. And I went to Jay Z and Kanye West... I tried to be their fan as well. Loved their concert...but people were smoking weed and I think I got like a contact high should those exist...anyway... I decided I wasn't about that life.

But yeah my Beyonce tickets aren't the best...but it was because I don't want to get trampled by the beyhive. I'm just going to go to dress up, be pretty and have some cocktails and say I went.

And about Miley. I watched her We Can't Stop video the other day. Bless her heart. She looked foolish.

 

[Pip22]

I'm excited about going...relatively.... I'm only going because Michael Jackson is dead and Janet Jackson is married to some billionaire and doesn't put out new music and the last music she put out blew....So...I decided to go be a Beyonce fan by default. I tried being an Usher fan as well...his concert was okay. And I went to Jay Z and Kanye West... I tried to be their fan as well. Loved their concert...but people were smoking weed and I think I got like a contact high should those exist...anyway... I decided I wasn't about that life.

But yeah my Beyonce tickets aren't the best...but it was because I don't want to get trampled by the beyhive. I'm just going to go to dress up, be pretty and have some cocktails and say I went.

And about Miley. I watched her We Can't Stop video the other day. Bless her heart. She looked foolish.

For someone who didn't know any JayZ songs when she released Party in the USA, she sure has made up for lost time.
Beyonce is great live. The first time round I wasn't too fussed about her but once I left I was hooked.

 

[fullinitup]

some of these teens need to be inspired by this rather than the best twerk on vine

 

[mccracal]

From what I know of teenage girls, it's not too unlikely that emulating strippers is actually what their intent is. Maybe not strippers per se, but certainly to be sexy. I don't think teenage girls are aware of repercussions and consequences, so they tend to do things to be "cute" without thinking. And I don't mean "cute" in a child-like or teddy bear kind of way. I mean cute like in a "I want all the boys looking at me" kind of way. I find younger girls tend to not be aware of quite how much acting trashy gets them looked at (and treated) like trash. That's a lesson you usually figure out much later in life. The even younger girls doing it are just emulating the older girls doing it.

This is not to say all teenage girls are like this. I don't even think I'd say "most" - but girls that do things like upload videos of themselves twerking don't usually realize that the attention they're getting isn't really what they want. I guess my whole point has been that I don't think there has ever been a case of a girl twerking that she got any kind of attention other than "Yeah girl shake that thang!" <---Yep, right from the keyboard of Carol Brady, the word "thang" for Fierce Board's enjoyment. This does not make me think "class" or any other positive quality that I would want attributed to my daughters. Girls post these things for that reaction. I'm sure your millions of psychology classes could give you plenty of insight into why they'd want that reaction; I have plenty of my own thoughts on it (most of them are the same as any other reason kids act out - never for the reason on the surface).

Like I said earlier, if you want to do it or there are parents who think it's cute, knock yourselves out. I, and many many other people, think it's classless and low rent. If I look at you sideways, now y'all know why. I imagine these are the same parents who think it's cute when their toddler sings trashy lyrics off the radio or when their 5 year old does her first booty pop. Not cute to me, but hey, they're not my kids. If a gym wants to make a rule, that's their prerogative and it's anyone's choice whether or not to cheer there.

My only issue was people trying to make it seem like twerking wasn't meant to be sexual and I think that's naive. I think young girls know a lot more about their bodies and boys than we give them credit for.

You raise some really good points, and I appreciate your perspective as a parent.

I hope we can at least agree that while some teenage girls twerk in an effort to look "sexy", some don't. In my perspective as a college student, I hardly ever see twerking going on as a way to get male attention. If someone does bust out twerking at a party, it usually is for attention-- but they generally hope that it'll result in people laughing, not groping. In fact, most girls that I know who do twerk only do so when they're in a group of other girls who they know really well and are comfortable with. It's always been considerably more of a nonsexual group bonding thing than a mating ritual from what I've seen. I know that the plural of anecdote isn't data, but that's about all I'll have until Harvard decides to do a study on the development of twerking ;)

Again, I don't have any issues with people saying that twerking can be a very sexual dance. I'll I'm trying to do is get people to at least acknowledge the gray area--to understand that sexuality doesn't have to be, and often isn't the main goal of twerking for young/teenage girls.

 

[njallday]

i still agree with and respect orson.


i do have some confusion or questions about the OSU team. i don't follow many "cheerlebs" or kids in the industry, but i do follow well known teams' official twitters, including the "official" OSU cheerleading team. they have a twitter, vine, and instagram and have posted twerk videos (including one actually at practice where the entire program was twerking as their "warm-up" in the OSU gym in full OSU attire) now, i don't know who runs the account (i assume coach, but maybe it's an athlete, or a joint effort), but i find it strange that they so publicly were like look at us, we're twerking. i assume that they're all adults so i really haven't commented on its appropriateness... they can twerk all they want, but it sort of bothers me that the cheerleaders (who are usually the "faces" of the school and role models) are posting videos that are associated with the school team on purpose. it may come back to bite them or hurt their image. (i also know a handful of these kids are on T&S teams, as well, so does this policy include them? or just the minors? or is this a going-forward policy, college kids included?)